In this episode, Karen sat down with her friend and colleague, Karina Ricks. Karina is the Director of Pittsburgh's Department of Mobility and Infrastructure (DOMI) and brings a wealth of experience to the role. Karen and Karina chat about her time in international development, consulting, and in DC city government. They also work on a slightly different definition of a smart city, talk about the problem of urban landslides, and Karina's fascination with a certain genre of reality tv shows.