Mormon Folk Magic, Joseph Smith’s Occult Reputation & Dave Butler’s Cunning Man The hosts discuss ongoing interest in Joseph Smith’s seer stones, treasure digging, and whether these practices should be labeled “occult,” referencing questions from the FAIR Conference and Mark Ashurst-McGee’s work on Joseph as a “village seer.” Dave Butler introduces his novel series Cunning Man, co-written with Aaron Ritchie, about Hiram Woolley, a very Mormon sugar beet farmer in 1935 Utah who battles literal and figurative demons of the Great Depression using his Grandma Hetty’s documentable folk-prayer lore, alongside his adopted Navajo son Michael. They explore definitions of magic and “occult” as “hidden,” Christian grimoires like Hohman’s The Long Lost Friend, Catholic folk practices (including burying St. Joseph statues), sympathetic magic, and LDS garment folklore as both symbolic and protective, including how such beliefs appear in Mormon history and culture. 

00:00 Occult Joseph Smith 

02:02 FAIR Conference Questions 

04:26 Cunning Man Series 

06:20 Mormon Indiana Jones 

10:59 American Paladin Hiram 

16:23 Grimoires and Psalm Magic 

17:37 Catholic Folk Practices 

21:36 Defining Magic and Occult 

27:40 Saint Joseph House Spell 

31:44 Sympathetic Magic Explained 

33:32 Magic Underwear Folklore 

38:30 Garment Protection Lore 

40:06 Carthage Jail Accounts 

42:21 Charm Versus Blessing 

43:46 Chi Rho Stand In 

46:59 Decline of Magic 

50:26 Cunning Man Trilogy 

10:59 Bautista and Mexico 

58:23 AUB and Fundamentalists 

01:01:20 Future Books Ideas 

01:04:29 Hofmann and Folk Magic 

01:06:43 Wrap Up and Recommendations 

 The hosts of LDS Uncorrelated celebrate strong early podcast numbers, then Arantza reports back from Florida girls camp, describing extreme heat, mosquitoes, ticks, and an alligator in the lake while she ran Book of Mormon Jeopardy and discussed camp traditions like songs, including “Mormon Boy,” and how these events build friendships and spiritual formation. The conversation turns to chastity teaching, rejecting the “chewed gum” metaphor and arguing for repentance through Christ and healthier attitudes toward sexuality. They discuss pranks like snipe hunting, compare boys’ and girls’ camp culture, and share a Boy Scout story. The episode then pivots to a current event: Shane Baldwin publicly claiming to be the “Davidic servant,” with Dave performing a satirical song and the hosts arguing the concept is a fringe construct, criticizing Baldwin’s claims, apps, and history, and emphasizing staying centered on Christ.   

00:00 Cold Open Chaos 

00:54 Show Welcome Back

01:44 Florida Girls Camp Gators

03:26 Book of Mormon Jeopardy 

07:21 Mormon Boy Song 

10:39 Flirts Modesty Chastity 

17:06 Snipe Hunting Prank 

24:08 Boy Scout Survival Prank 

28:49 Relief Society Mysteries   

30:54 Dave Song Teaser   

31:47 Badger Hat Banter   

32:21 Messiah Claim Emerges   

34:00 Go Tell Abraham Song   

38:30 What Is Davidic Servant   

42:22 Shane Baldwin Deep Dive   

48:08 Apps Fraud and Correlation   

51:29 How People Get Pulled In   

52:24 Meeting Shane at Church HQ   

01:01:34 Folklore Lost Tribes Under Ice   

01:07:06 Myth Points to Christ   

01:08:04 Wrap Up and Next Episode 

 LDS Uncorrelated: Mormon Cinema, Acting Origins & the Java Jive Coffee Date (with Brad Whitt) On LDS Uncorrelated, the hosts welcome guest Brad Whitt (Ward Radio, Escape from Germany, BYU Physical Science course videos) and discuss acting backgrounds, LDS culture, and LDS “homegrown” cinema. Arantxa shares starting acting at seven through auditions and agents, while Brad traces his start to school improv and studying acting at BYU, plus his mission in New York. The group debates key LDS films like God’s Army, Brigham City, and Singles Ward, and talks about Mormon-adjacent films like Napoleon Dynamite and Gentlemen Broncos. They highlight Brett and Jessica Bergen’s short film Java Jive, about an awkward first date at a coffee shop and the pressure around the Word of Wisdom, then digress into stories about schismatic figure Phil Davis and other Mormon folklore. They close by encouraging more LDS-coded filmmaking and teasing a future episode analyzing Hollywood depictions of the temple endowment. 

00:00 Cold Open Banter 

00:35 Show Intro Guest Brad 

10:56 Arantxa Acting Origins 

12:14 Stage Names Bits 

13:29 Three Nephites Sitcom Pitch 

14:06 Ages And Generations 

15:24 LDS Cinema Beginnings 

17:51 Gods Army And Dutcher 

22:06 Singles Ward And Stars 

24:51 Broadway Will Swenson Story 

25:43 Acting as Service 

26:39 Brad Acting Origins 

28:58 Loving the Character 

30:39 Napoleon Dynamite Mormon Cinema 

32:10 Gentlemen Broncos Deep Cut 

35:12 Java Jive Spotlight 

36:29 Word of Wisdom Comedy 

39:48 Chocolatier Prophet Lore 

45:18 Tin Pot Messiahs Folklore 

47:52 Make the Movies 

49:56 Utah Storytelling Call 

52:36 Wrap and Next Episode Tease 

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has opened the "Temple Experience" at its Salt Lake City Visitor Center a year before the re-dedication of the Salt Lake Temple. In it, people can see a replica of the actual temple rooms, including a Celestial Room and a sealing altar. What is the experience like? Plus, the gang debates how the temple can be implemented more fully in our lives and how we can better prep the Saints for their endowments? 

 LDS Uncorrelated: Hats, Correlation, Temple Culture, and Ghost Stories Five friends announce their new “LDS Uncorrelated” podcast and discuss Latter-day Saint culture versus doctrine through topics like hat etiquette during prayer, “Mormon Standard Time,” manners, and posting photos from a public temple media tour. They explore music in worship and the temple, including historical temple hymn-singing and hopes for more music today. The group explains church correlation beginning under David O. McKay in the 1960s, its role in standardizing teachings amid rapid growth, and its centralization of power (including changes to Relief Society autonomy), while noting correlation can also spread standardized errors. They critique folk doctrines and overreach (e.g., Mormon Doctrine, face-card taboos, beards), share examples of local “weird” Mormonism, and debate ghosts and spiritual experiences, including a ghost-hunting flashlight incident and early LDS views on dreams and spirits. They preview a future episode on social media, public temple content, and spirituality. 00:00 Podcast Kickoff and Temple Tales 00:36 Hats Prayer and Mormon Manners 04:25 Music Memories and Mission Rules 08:13 Why No Singing in the Temple 10:16 Correlation Origins and Americanization 14:45 Social Media Hot Takes and Mormon Doctrine 18:57 Independence Authority and Beard Folklore 29:28 Correlation Failures and Manual Horror Story 32:42 Trying To Be Palatable 34:04 Correlation Guardrails 35:32 Idaho Mormonism Stories 38:42 Millennial Panic Cycles 40:17 Emily Song Break 41:26 Folklore Versus Doctrine 44:13 Haunted House Banter 45:29 Ghost Hunter Flashlight 49:41 Doctrinal Limits And Openness 53:58 Pratt On Dreams 57:00 Catholic Convert Perspective 01:03:25 Modern Reenchantment 01:06:40 Wrap Up And Next Episode