In this episode of Legal Spirits, Center Director Mark Movsesian talks with legal scholar Steven D. Smith about a question that goes to the heart of American law and politics: What happens when people stop believing in “the consent of the governed”? Drawing on Smith’s new paper, The Collapse of Consent, they explore how this once-powerful idea has shifted over time—from a principle rooted in natural law and divine authority to a secular fiction that’s becoming harder to sustain. In an increasingly polarized society, can America’s founding narrative still hold us together? A deep and thought-provoking conversation about legitimacy, identity, and the future of our legal order.

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