Are you moving apps to the cloud? Carl and Richard talk to Richard Reukema about his experience shifting workloads into the cloud. Richard talks about getting beyond virtual machines in the cloud and utilizing the platform services that allow your application to scale up and out. The conversation dives into designing software independent of the implementation, even the cloud provider! This separation between design and implementation, combined with modern practices of deployment and testing automation, get to the true value of the cloud - the ability to rapidly iterate to respond to business needs!