The Courage Effect

Listener Favorite: Courageous Communication with Julie Pham

Listen Later

What happens when we avoid the hard conversations? Dr. Julie Pham, Founder/CEO of Curiosity Based and author of "Seven Forms of Respect," shares the messy truth about when she got it wrong—and what changed when she finally chose directness over avoidance.

Julie opens up about quitting a job through manufactured martyrdom rather than honesty, workplace gossip that spectacularly backfired, and the uncomfortable question that kept her up at night. When her boss told her to "let it go," she trusted her gut instead—and ended up modeling the behavior her entire team needed.

Drawing on her parents' journey fleeing Vietnam by boat, Julie reminds us that courage is relative. And sometimes the bravest thing we can do is slow down, stop judging ourselves and others, and have the direct conversation—even when it takes months to get there.

Key Insights:

  • Courage doesn't have to be immediate. Julie took months to process before having a difficult conversation. "Sometimes our expectations of having to respond right away actually gets us to maybe respond in a way that is just more reactive than thoughtful."
  • You can't outsource your courage. When Julie complained about her boss to a peer, that peer spread her words around the organization. "I can't expect other people to fight my battles for me. I can't expect other people to save me."
  • Trust your gut over bad advice. Against her boss's advice to ignore an uncomfortable situation, Julie had direct conversations and apologized. Her boss later told her: "You actually modeled the behavior that we should have here."
  • Building relationships requires risk. "We don't know how they're going to take it. All I can do is stay true to myself and maybe that'll work and we'll have a deeper relationship and for other people it's gonna isolate us even more."

    • Connect with Julie: 

    • LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/juliepham2/
    • Instagram:https://www.instagram.com/juliephamphd
    • Website: https://curiositybased.cominstagram 

      • Connect with The Courage Effect:

      • Host: Suzanne Weller / Weller Collaboration
      • Website: https://wellercollaboration.com/thecourageeffect
      • Social Media: https://linktr.ee/suzanneweller
      • Substack: Sign up for Suzanne’s Reimagine Growth newsletter at https://suzanneweller.substack.com/about 

        • Support the Show:

        If this episode resonated with you:

        • Leave a review on your podcast platform
        • Share this episode with someone who would benefit from Suzanne’s story

          • Stay courageous.

          ...more
          View all episodesView all episodes
          Download on the App Store
          The Courage EffectBy Suzanne Weller - Weller Collaboration