Tune in as Kelly Hopping, CMO of Demandbase and Mary Gilbert, fractional CMO at Folloze, discuss the differences between working in scale-ups and large organizations, the value of lateral moves in one's career, and creating safe spaces.

In this conversation, Kelly and Mary explain the importance of systems thinking and understanding how decisions are interconnected to each other and their impact on the organization's goals. Tune in to hear their advice for fostering trust, authenticity, and building stronger relationships with team members through vulnerability.