Ted and Lisa play with the tension between accepting what is and aspiring to excellence, starting with a game of Clover (3:19) and exploring whether mindfulness and improv are easy or hard—and how “hard” often leads to feelings of “not good enough” (7:02). They discuss the importance of a strong biochemical foundation (15:33) and what else gets in the way of our best selves (18:39), ultimately asking if desire to do well actually helps us do well (23:05). Using a Zen koan about picking and choosing (28:17) and a quotation from Alan Watts (47:28), they discuss their own aspirations and why process goals may serve us better than product goals. Enjoy!

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