Episode 8 – Fuchsia's Netstack3 with Bruno Dal Bo Silva.

In this episode our guest is Bruno Dal Bo Silva, Staff Software Engineer at Google. We will dive into his path into networking and Rust, and the story behind netstack3, the Rust-based networking stack built for Google’s Fuchsia operating system. We cover its origins from the Go-based netstack, why Rust was chosen, and the challenges of implementing a full range of protocols — from TCP and UDP with their POSIX socket API to the many less-visible but essential pieces like ARP, ICMP, IPv6, DHCP, and more. We hope you brought a bowl as you're in or a juicy letter soup with this one. Bruno also shares insights on where he sees the future of netstack3 — including its potential beyond Google.

Learn more:

• https://fuchsia.dev/
• netstack3 source code: https://fuchsia.googlesource.com/fuchsia/+/refs/heads/master/src/connectivity/network/netstack3/
• netstack3 publishing tracking bug: https://fxbug.dev/448156020
• Fast UDP I/O for Firefox in Rust: https://max-inden.de/post/fast-udp-io-in-firefox
• RFC 2462 - SLAAC: https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc2462
• smoltcp (Rust TCP/IP stack for embedded): https://github.com/m-labs/smoltcp

Rama

If you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.org

Chapters

• 00:00 Intro
• 00:42 Introduction to Bruno and his Journey
• 04:37 Bruno's Engineering Background and Its Impact
• 06:56 Exploring Fuchsia: Overview and Architecture
• 10:08 Transitioning to NetStack 3: The Rust Revolution
• 17:35 Diving into Networking Protocols: Life of a Packet
• 24:45 Understanding ARP and Ethernet Protocols
• 28:00 Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol (DHCP) Explained
• 34:41 The Future of Networking: IPv6 and Happy Eyeballs
• 40:52 QUIC Protocol: User Space vs Kernel Space
• 46:53 More about netstack3 and unsafe code usage
• 55:22 Async usage in Netstack3
• 01:00:36 Comparing netstack3 with smolltcp
• 01:04:50 Running your own TCP stack on the linux platform
• 01:06:25 Roadmap to get fuchsia on crates.io
• 01:11:37 Closing Thoughts and Future Directions
• 01:15:32 Outro

Netstack.FM

• More information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-8
• Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCD
• Reach out to us: [email protected]

Music for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

Episode 7 – Rustls with Dirkjan Ochtman.

In this episode, we go through Dirkjan's extensive experience in software development, particularly focusing on Rust, TLS, and QUIC protocols.

We explore Dirkjan his journey working on QUIC implementations to his contributions to Rust TLS and Hickory DNS. The conversation also delves into the ACME protocol and the Instant Domain Search project.

Dirkjan shares insights on the future of Rustls and the importance of community support in open-source projects.

Learn more:

• https://dirkjan.ochtman.nl/
• https://github.com/rustls/rustls
• rustls 0.24 tracking issue: https://github.com/rustls/rustls/issues/2400
• HickoryDNS Let's Encrypt tracking issue: https://github.com/hickory-dns/hickory-dns/issues/2725
• https://github.com/djc/instant-acme
• https://instantdomainsearch.com/

Rama

If you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.org

Chapters

• 00:00 Intro
• 00:44 Introduction to Dirkjan Ochtman
• 02:02 Dirkjan's Rustls contributor origins
• 04:18 Quic implications on Rustls
• 13:35 Exploring the H3 Protocol and Its Challenges
• 16:47 Contributions to Hickory DNS
• 22:59 instant ACME
• 28:43 R2D2 — Connection Pooling
• 32:13 the EPP Protocol
• 34:40 Insights from Working with Domain Registrars
• 35:36 Rustls and Safety
• 50:31 The Future of Rust TLS and Its Ecosystem
• 54:50 Outro

Netstack.FM

• More information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-7
• Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCD
• Reach out to us: [email protected]

Music for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

Episode 6 – Curl with Daniel Stenberg.

In this episode of netstack.fm, Glen speaks with Daniel Stenberg, the creator and maintainer of Curl, one of the most widely used networking tools on the internet. They discuss Daniel's journey into programming and networking, the evolution of Curl from a simple tool to a comprehensive solution supporting multiple protocols, and the challenges of maintaining such a large open-source project. Daniel shares insights on the importance of community involvement, the complexities of debugging across various platforms, and his reflections on a 30-year journey with Curl. The conversation highlights the significance of open-source contributions and the future of Curl as a project.

Learn more:

• https://curl.se/
• https://daniel.haxx.se/
• https://daniel.haxx.se/blog/
• https://github.com/curl/curl

Rama

If you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.org

Chapters

• 00:00 Intro
• 00:36 Introduction to Curl and Daniel Stenberg
• 05:20 Understanding Protocols and Specifications
• 08:10 The Birth of Curl: From IRC Bot to Networking Tool
• 12:46 Curl's Evolution and Protocol Support
• 15:58 The Decision to Focus on Client-Side Development
• 17:40 Current Protocol Support in Curl
• 22:17 Managing Complexity in Curl's Codebase
• 25:33 The Choice of C as the Programming Language
• 28:33 Continuous Development and Community Engagement
• 30:16 Balancing Work, Family, and Open Source Contributions
• 36:37 Transitioning to Full-Time Work on Curl
• 41:38 The Challenge of Funding Open Source Projects
• 46:44 Exploring Commercial Opportunities with Curl
• 49:53 Ensuring Curl's Longevity and Succession Planning
• 51:58 Tackling Technical Challenges in Open Source Development
• 57:05 Reflecting on a 30-Year Journey with Curl
• 01:00:07 Outro

Netstack.FM

• More information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-6
• Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/29EetaSYCD
• Reach out to us: [email protected]

Music for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

Episode 5 – Tokio with Carl Lerche.

In this episode of Netstack.fm, Glen speaks with Carl Lerche, the creator and maintainer of the Tokio Runtime, about his journey into technology, the evolution of programming languages, and the impact of Rust on the software development landscape. They discuss the rise of async programming, the development of networking libraries, and the future of Rust in infrastructure. Carl shares insights on the creation of the Bytes crate, the implications of io_uring, and his role at Amazon. The conversation also touches on the upcoming Tokio conference and the introduction of Toasty, a new query engine for Rust.

Learn more:

• https://tokio.rs/
• https://www.tokioconf.com/
• https://github.com/carllerche

Rama

If you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.org

Chapters

• 00:00 Intro
• 00:45 Origins of Carl
• 04:01 Parallel between DotCom Bubble and current AI wave
• 05:52 Origins of Carl... Continued
• 09:12 Carl discovers Rust in 2014
• 13:40 Creation of mio
• 17:39 mio, tokio and futures
• 19:15 Powers of Rust
• 25:57 io_uring
• 26:12 The Evolution of IO-URing and Its Practicality
• 29:40 Carl's job at Amazon and Tokio
• 30:51 Maintaining Tokio today and beyond
• 32:30 Toasty
• 38:58 AI in Software Development: A Tool for Productivity
• 49:20 First Tokio Conference
• 53:10 Final words
• 55:17 Outro

Netstack.FM

• More information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-4
• Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/VN77rKHR
• Reach out to us: [email protected]

Music for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

In this episode, Glen interviews Delaney, the creator of DataStar, a lightweight framework designed for building real-time collaborative web applications. Delaney shares his journey from being a 3D artist to a developer, emphasizing the importance of hypermedia and real-time visualization. The conversation delves into the efficiency of DataStar, its use of Server-Sent Events (SSE), and the framework's potential for collaborative web experiences. Delaney also discusses the challenges of WebSockets and introduces future projects like DarkStar, aimed at enhancing networking capabilities. Overall, the episode highlights the transformative potential of DataStar in modern web development. In this conversation, Delaney discusses the intricacies of DataStar, a real-time system for handling large volumes of messages. He emphasizes the importance of simplicity in programming, the significance of measuring performance, and the role of abstraction in software development. Delaney also explains the core functions of DataStar, including patch elements and signals, and how they facilitate real-time interactivity. The discussion touches on offline support, the growth of the DataStar community, and the non-profit model that supports its development. Delaney encourages developers to engage with the community and emphasizes the importance of building solutions to real problems.

Learn more about Datastar and Hypermedia:

• https://data-star.dev/
• https://data-star.dev/reference/datastar_pro
• https://hypermedia.systems/

Rama

If you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.org

Chapters

• 00:00 Intro
• 00:42 Delaney and his background
• 02:39 The Evolution of Hypermedia and Real-Time Systems
• 06:27 SSE and Compression
• 15:33 The Social Web
• 23:01 Why use datastar?
• 29:42 Web Transport and Darkstar
• 33:55 DataStar and Future Directions
• 46:04 Understanding Abstraction in Programming
• 50:19 DataStar: Key Functions and Concepts
• 53:27 Signals in DataStar: When to Use Them
• 57:25 Front-End Validation and User Experience
• 59:27 Offline Support and Web Applications
• 01:02:56 The Growth of DataStar and Community Engagement
• 01:07:09 The Challenges of Web Development
• 01:09:26 AI and Its Role in Development
• 01:13:22 DataStar and WebTransport: Future Directions
• 01:16:33 Dynamic Content and DataStar's Use Cases
• 01:18:35 Funding and Sustainability of Open Source Projects
• 01:31:02 Outro

Netstack.FM

• More information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-4
• Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/VN77rKHR
• Reach out to us: [email protected]

Music for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

In this conversation, Chris Batterbee, co-founder of Metoro, discusses the importance of observability in modern software systems, particularly in Kubernetes environments. He explains how Metoro leverages eBPF technology to simplify observability by automatically instrumenting applications. The discussion also covers the integration of OpenTelemetry, the challenges faced by developers in implementing observability, and the potential of AI in diagnosing issues. Chris shares insights from his experience with Y Combinator and the competitive landscape of observability tools, emphasizing the unique position of Metoro in the market.

Learn more about OpenTelemetry, eBPF and Metoro:

• https://opentelemetry.io/
• https://ebpf.io/
• https://metoro.io/
• metoro demo: https://demo.us-east.metoro.io/guardian?startEnd=&service=
• OpenTelemetry metric examplar: https://opentelemetry.io/docs/specs/otel/metrics/data-model/#exemplars

Rama

If you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.org

Chapters

• 00:00 Intro
• 00:41 Chris Batterbee his background
• 02:27 eBPF intro in context of Metoro
• 04:20 eBPF + OpenTelemetry
• 06:37 Opentelemetry Experience
• 14:19 WASM
• 16:10 eBPF and Windows
• 16:59 Y Combinator Experience
• 23:52 OpenTelemetry standard
• 25:50 Platform is king
• 26:53 eBPF accessibility
• 28:30 Future of Prometheus
• 29:41 Metoro and LLMs
• 32:14 Replacing Sentry and the like
• 33:46 Profiling
• 35:39 Metoro Subscription Models
• 36:37 Final words
• 38:57 Outro

Netstack.FM

• More information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-3
• Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/VN77rKHR
• Reach out to us: [email protected]

Music for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

In this episode, Glen interviews Sean McArthur, the creator and maintainer of the Hyper ecosystem. They discuss Sean's journey in software engineering, the evolution of Rust and asynchronous programming, and the growth of Hyper from its inception at Mozilla to its current status in the web development landscape. Sean shares insights on the creation of hyper, hyper-util, http, headers, the Warp framework, and the challenges of integrating HTTP/3 and QUIC. The conversation also touches on collaboration with cURL, the FFI layer, and Sean's aspirations for the future of Hyper and the broader ecosystem.

Learn more about Sean McArthur, Hyper and Warp:

• https://seanmonstar.com/
• https://seanmonstar.com/sponsor/
• https://hyper.rs/
• https://seanmonstar.com/blog/async-hyper/
• https://github.com/hyperium/hyper
• https://github.com/seanmonstar/warp
• https://seanmonstar.com/blog/warp/

Rama

If you like this podcast you might also like our modular network framework in Rust: https://ramaproxy.org

Chapters

• 00:00 Intro
• 00:45 Introduction to Sean and the Hyper Ecosystem
• 01:48 Sean's entrance into Rust
• 06:17 The Impact of Mozilla on Sean's Career
• 07:54 The Development of Hyper and Its Challenges
• 13:20 Realizing Hyper's Long-Term Potential
• 15:32 The Creation of hyper-util and Its purpose
• 17:32 http and headers crates
• 22:40 Navigating API Design Challenges
• 22:47 The Philosophy Behind Warp Framework
• 26:43 Integrating HTTP/2 and HTTP/3 Support
• 28:54 The Evolution of the Requests Library
• 30:17 Commercial Aspects of Hyper
• 31:31 The Complexities of HTTP/3 Integration
• 34:35 Reflections on the cURL and Hyper Collaboration
• 38:50 Maintaining Open Source Independence
• 40:16 Future Aspirations for Hyper
• 41:23 Encouraging Community Engagement in Open Source
• 42:28 Final words
• 43:57 Outro

Netstack.FM

• More information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-2
• Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/VN77rKHR
• Reach out to us: [email protected]

Music for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.

In the inaugural episode of NetStack FM, hosts Elizabeth and Glen introduce themselves and the purpose of the podcast, which is to explore the intersection of protocols and people in the tech industry. Glen shares his personal journey into technology, discussing his background in software development, gaming, and networking.

The conversation highlights the challenges and learning experiences that shaped his careers, leading to the creation of Rama, a modular framework for building network services.

The episode concludes with a preview of upcoming guests and topics, emphasizing the podcast's goal to educate and engage listeners in the world of networking and Rust.

More information: https://netstack.fm/#episode-1

Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/VN77rKHR

Reach out to us: [email protected]

Music for this episode was composed by Dj Mailbox. Listen to his music at https://on.soundcloud.com/4MRyPSNj8FZoVGpytj.