In this episode, I talk to Kent C. Dodds, a software engineer, and teacher. Before starting his entrepreneurial journey, Kent has been working for PayPal. He is a major open source contributor and also the creator and maintainer of the widely used open-source testing-library.

Code that he writes is used by millions of people around the world, and he also teaches thousands of engineers how to test their JavaScript systems, and how to work with React.

We talk about:

- Why you should not mock your software system during testing,

- how "testing library" helps create more meaningful and maintainable tests,

- if and how manual testing is still needed to increase your confidence in the software system.