In the last few months, the term “Green New Deal” has been popping up a lot again. And it’s the Trump administration bringing it up — as a boogeyman, as a foil for everything his crew fears about accelerating the clean energy transition.

So I thought it would be a good time to discuss: What actually is the Green New Deal? How far have we gotten on implementing the concepts it includes? And why do those ideas still matter?

My guest for this episode is Rhiana Gunn-Wright, one of the original architects of the Green New Deal. Recently, she was Director of Climate Policy at the Roosevelt Institute. Now, she is consulting and writing a book about the intersections among white supremacy, addiction, and climate change. Suffice it to say, I’ve been eagerly following her work since we met at policy workshop she organized, back in 2019.

Note that this conversation was recorded back in October while I was on my book tour, and the political context has, well,… changed a little bit since then. But there's much more to this conversation than the Green New Deal. And her ideas about what shapes climate policy should take — from industry to employment to health care to democracy — are absolutely as relevant as ever.

This episode was produced and edited by Nora Saks and me, with recording assistance in Chicago from Troy Cruz. And big thank you to Semicolon Books for hosting us.

p.s. Call your representatives!

Get full access to WHAT IF WE GET IT RIGHT? at ayanaelizabeth.substack.com/subscribe