What actually is a kangaroo? And how long have they been the giant red or grey hopping things so synonymous with Australia? In this episode of Palaeo Jam, host Michael Mills chats with Dr Isaac Kerr about the origin of kangaroos as “weird possums that lived in the trees a bit”, the significant gaps in the kangaroo origin fossil record, and how we make sense of what we’ve got. In a wide ranging conversation about kangaroo origins, they also discuss why of all the locomotion strategies that could have been adopted, Australia is the only place where large animals have taken to hopping.

You can follow Isaac on Blue Sky at https://bsky.app/profile/isaacarkerr.bsky.social

Isaac’s latest paper, “Limb osteology and functional morphology of the extinct kangaroo Dorcopsoides fossilis”, can be found at…

https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsos.251591

It was in Episode 1 of Season 3 that Michael and Isaac first chatted about the prehistoric group of kangaroos, Protemnodons. Find the episode here…

https://palaeojam.podbean.com/e/the-tale-of-a-giant-prehistoric-kangaroo-or-three/

You can read the full 250 plus pages of Isaac’s remarkable paper on Protemnodon, here…

https://mapress.com/mt/article/view/megataxa.11.1.1

Here’s a link to the Flinders University palaeo team…

https://sites.flinders.edu.au/palaeontology/

You can find Michael on Blue Sky at https://bsky.app/profile/heapsgood.bsky.social

To connect with Dinosaur University on Facebook, follow us at https://www.facebook.com/DinosaurUniversity

At Palaeo Jam, we have an Instagram account at https://www.instagram.com/palaeo_jam

On Thursday October 9th, Dr Jim Gehling OA (Order of Australia) was awarded the Joseph Verco Medal by the Royal Society of South Australia for a remarkable life of research and public engagement in the field of palaeontology. Previous recipients have included Sir Douglas Mawson and Reg Sprigg.

Palaeo Jam host Michael Mills is a long time friend of Jim, with Jim having been a central part of the South Australian Museum's work in the early days of the birth of Michael’s alter ego, singing palaeontologist Professor Flint. Michael notes in this podcast that the work he does as The Prof, is only possible because of the work of people like Jim.

After attending the award ceremony, Michael and Jim decided to arrange a time to catch up and chat about Jim’s life and his research. This is just part of what was a delightful day of sharing memories with Michael, Jim, and wife Inara.

Jim has led Ediacaran research in Australia, and the world, for the last 40 years, collaborating with all significant international experts and co-authoring publications on the Ediacara Biota in Australia, Canada, USA, UK, China, Russia, and Namibia. He has also been intimately involved on the excavation and research of the early Cambrian Emu Bay Shale of Kangaroo Island. The Emu Bay Shale is the only Konservat-Lagerstätte in the Southern Hemisphere and is often mentioned side by side with the likes of the Burgess Shale in British Columbia.

Jim’s research record is extensive. You can find links to some of his research on google scholar at https://scholar.google.com.au/citations?user=kMfMg40AAAAJ&hl=en

Or on Research Gate at… https://www.researchgate.net/profile/James-Gehling

Last year, inspired by Jim’s research on the Ediacarans and early Cambrians, Michael's Professor Flint released an album of songs, for children titled “Creatures of the Slime”. You can find the album on all main platforms via the following link…

https://linktr.ee/ProfessorFlint

You can follow  Michael on Bluesky at https://bsky.app/profile/heapsgood.bsky.social

And his HeapsGood Facebook page at

https://www.facebook.com/HeapsGoodProductions

Australia is land of reptiles, and in particular, a land of lizards. How and when did it become this? And why are there so many venomous snakes? In this episode of Palaeo Jam, host Michael Mills chats with Dr Mark Hutchinson about the evolutionary history of the lizards of Australia, why they become a life long passion, if he has a favourite lizard, (he does, and explains why), and the rewards of being a research supervisor.

Dr Mark Hutchinson is an Australian herpetologist and palaeontologist, long associated with the South Australian Museum, where he served as Curator of Herpetology before becoming an Honorary Researcher. His work has focused on the taxonomy, evolution, and fossil history of reptiles—especially lizards and snakes—across Australia’s arid and southern regions. He has described numerous new species, reconstructed ancient ecosystems from fossil remains, and explored how climate shifts shaped reptile diversity. In addition to his museum role, Dr Hutchinson has held academic posts with the University of Adelaide and Flinders University, and is recognised internationally for his contributions to understanding the deep history and conservation of Australia’s reptiles.

Dr Mark suggests that if you want to learn about Australian lizards, a great intro is “Australian Lizards- A Natural History” by Steve Wilson. And if it’s more on Aussie snakes you’re after, “Australian Snakes: A Natural History” by Dr Richard Shine. Check your local book and ebook retailer for availability.

Host Michael Mills can be found on Insta as The HeapsGood Guy at https://www.instagram.com/heapsgood/

On Bluesky at https://bsky.app/profile/heapsgood.bsky.social

For all things HeapsGood, including links to Michael alter ego, Professor Flint, head to…

https://linktr.ee/heapsgoodproductions

And then what?

It tuned in to this very episode of Palaeo Jam!

Dr Heather Robinson and Professor John Long are the authors of two important books, “Beyond the Books: Culture, value and why libraries matter.” and “The Secret History of Sharks: The Rise of the Ocean's Most Fearsome Predators”, respectively.

Heather and John are also work partners and life partners, and in this episode of Palaeo Jam we explore the essence of each of their very different books, while attempting to find common ground. Along the way we ask, why do libraries matter? Indeed, why do cultural institutions matter? And why do sharks matter? In researching each of the books, what was the most surprising thing you discovered about libraries and sharks? And why are both of these books an important read, right now? Because, yes. They are!

You can find both books on-line, and at all good bookstores.

John’s paleontological CV is vast! A look through profile on The Conversation at https://theconversation.com/profiles/john-long-98402 will give you a small insight into John’s remarkable body of work.

Heather also has an extensive profile on The Conversation, at https://theconversation.com/profiles/heather-l-robinson-155358

Heather and John have created Lifecyle Productions as an instrument to work on a multitude of projects. Their company website is… https://lifecycleproductions.com.au/, and contains information about what they’re working towards, and about the skills they each bring.

We first chatted with Heather and John in episode 3 of season 1 titled "A Marriage of Art and Science" in which amongst other things, we explored the importance of their art/science collaborations, and the things they each bring to their working partnership, and delved into some of the delightful experiences that their working on things together as a married couple has brought them.

Michael and John have collaborated creatively through the creation of the Professor Flint song about the WA fossil emblem, the Gogo Fish. With lyrics by John, and music by Michael, the song features on the Professor Flint album, “Dinosaurs Amongst Us!”… The Gogo Fish song on Spotify

Regional museums in Australia and elsewhere are the custodians of a remarkable collection of stories. What are some of those stories, and why do they matter? Why, indeed, do regional museums matter? And what kinds of science, including palaeontology, takes place in the regions?

Palaeo Jam host Michael Mills recently travelled to Geraldton in Western Australia for a series of National Science Week events. The events were held at Blue Heelers Square and included a family show by emerging, all female dinosaur loving supergroup The Ammonites, a quiz night, and the recording of the first episode of Season 4 of the Palaeo Jam podcast. This is that recording, and we can’t think of a better way to begin our fourth season, than to chat about the importance of science and science engagement in the regions.

In this episode, Michael is joined by Dr Kailah Thorn, Project Coordinator (Biodiversity) Western Australian Museum, Lucy Stokes, Palaeontology PhD Candidate, Curtin University, and Sarah Walker, Learning and Engagement Officer, Western Australian Museum- Geraldton to discuss all things regional and science.

For more information on the Western Australian Museum, head to their website at…

https://visit.museum.wa.gov.au/

For more information on the awesome venue, Blue Heelers Square where we recorded this episode, head to…

https://www.blueheelerssquare.com.au/

For more information on The Ammonites, who we’ll hear from in a future episode, head to…

https://linktr.ee/theammonites

Just over 12 months ago, as part of National Science Week, we spoke with Eleanor Beidatsch, in an episode titled, “A Journey into accessibility: Digging for fossils from a wheelchair.”  Since that episode, Eleanor has graduated from the University of New England with First Class Honours, been awarded the $130,000 #ElevateSTEM scholarship for postgraduate research from the Australian Academy of Technological Sciences and Engineering, and has started her Masters!

As we noted in the notes to last year’s episode, “as a nine year old, Eleanor dreamed of being a palaeontologist, but always presumed her advanced physical disability, and use of a wheelchair would make “digging about in the dirt for fossils” impossible.”

In this episode of Palaeo Jam host Michael Mills chats with Eleanor about another remarkable 12 months, and about what lies ahead as she continues her brilliant journey in the world of palaeontology, and follows her fascination with prehistoric velvet worms!

Check out this story from the ABC about Eleanor’s graduation…

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-05-26/eleanor-beidatsch-graduates-first-class-honours-geoscience/103839886

Here’s a link to last year’s episode with Eleanor…

https://palaeojam.podbean.com/e/a-journey-into-accessibility-digging-for-fossils-from-a-wheelchair/

Check out this video from Eleanor’s YouTube channel of her remarkable adventure in 2016, to a paleontological dig in the opal rich desert town of Lightning Ridge, New South Wales…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTGxIR_yaNo

Here’s a story about Eleanor’s journey on the University of New England’s website…

https://www.une.edu.au/connect/news/2022/09/unearthing-discrimination-in-science

Along with studying palaeontology, Eleanor is a disability rights journalist, and writes for the ABC…

https://www.abc.net.au/news/eleanor-beidatsch/101651018

Here’s a link to the Elevate STEM website…

https://www.atse.org.au/what-we-do/pathways-into-through-stem/elevate/

You can find Eleanor on Instagram at…

https://www.instagram.com/eleanor.beidatsch/

And on Twitter at…

https://twitter.com/EBeidatsch

Here’s a link to Eleanor’s blog Accessible 4 Me…

https://accessible4me.wordpress.com/

For more information on the research being undertaken by the team at University of New England’s Palaeoscience Research Centre, head to 

https://www.une.edu.au/research/research-centres-institutes/palaeoscience-research-centre

You can find Michael at @heapsgood https://twitter.com/Heapsgood

To connect with Dinosaur University on Facebook, follow us at https://www.facebook.com/DinosaurUniversity

At Palaeo Jam, we now have an Instagram account at https://www.instagram.com/palaeo_jam

So, you want to become a fossil? Good luck with that! There’s a whole sequence of things that need to take place in order for that to happen, and in this episode of Palaeo Jam, we explore those steps, and how unlikely it is that you will be able to complete all of them.

Recorded underground in Blanch Cave, in the Naracoorte Caves, South Australia, this episode sees host Michael Mills in conversation with PhD candidate Nerita Turner. Nerita’s work focuses on the modes of accumulation of large animal remains in caves, and we explore the unlikelihood becoming a fossil through the lens of her work. In order to become a fossil in a cave, you need to get into a cave in the first place. How does this impact on the size and kinds of animals that might then become fossils within a cave?

During the conversation Nerita describes the fossil record as “Infamously incomplete”. So, how incomplete is it? Consider the following… There are 1400 dinosaur species of dinosaurs that have been discovered and named across the entire Mesozoic, while right now there are around 11 000 species of living dinosaurs, in birds. How many dinosaur species lived across the entire 186 million year period of the Mesozoic? We will never know.

Of course, what we do know, is truly remarkable, and a testament to the work of so many. Palaeontology is able to provide us with some remarkable insights into past lives. to uncover past lives. It is important, however, to understand, that we get to see will only ever be a tiny glimpse of the extraordinary natural history, of this most astonishing planet.

Nerita Turner is a  PhD Candidate at the University of Adelaide. Her research focuses on the modes of accumulation of large animal remains in caves, with a particular focus on fossil sites within the Naracoorte Caves region.

You can find Nerita on Twitter at https://twitter.com/nerita_turner

Check out the following article, by Nerita and Dr Elizabeth Reed…

“Using historical research to constrain the provenance and age of the first recorded collection of extinct Pleistocene large mammal fossils from the Naracoorte Caves, South Australia.”

https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/M7JARRBWBXBWDCFDGIIY/full?target=10.1080/03721426.2023.2188442

Michael occasionally pops in to the strange place that is Twitter at @heapsgood https://twitter.com/Heapsgood

To connect with Dinosaur University on Facebook, follow us at https://www.facebook.com/DinosaurUniversity

At Palaeo Jam, we now have an Instagram account at https://www.instagram.com/palaeo_jam

In this episode of Palaeo Jam, host Michael Mills begins the conversation with Dr Natalia Jagielska, Engagement & Collections Curator at the Lyme Regis Museum by chatting about palaeontology pioneer Mary Anning, and what it means to be working in the very space Mary’s home in Lyme Regis once occupied. As the conversation continues, we learn about the first pterosaur ever found in Scotland, Dearc sgiathanach, and what it tells us about pterosaur evolution. In so doing, we reflect on the unique connection between Natalia and Mary, given Mary’s discovery of the first known pterosaur in England, Dimorphodon macronyx. The two also discuss a subject central to both Natalia and Michael’s professional working life, the connection between art and science.

This is the first episode of Palaeo Jam to feature a guest from beyond the shores of Australia. May there be many more!

Head to Natalia’s website to see links to her research, public outreach, and  awesome palaeo art…

https://natalia-jagielska.weebly.com/

You can find Natalia on Twitter at… @wrycritic

https://x.com/WryCritic

To access the original paper, authored by Natalia et al on the Scottish pterosaur Dearc sgiathanach, head to…

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S096098222200135X

For links to the Lyme Regis Museum, check out…

https://linktr.ee/lymemuseum

There’s a song about pterosaurs on the Professor Flint/Gemma Dandie album, “These Curious Things”, and you can watch a video of the song here… https://youtu.be/_ZJzRVO8ZK4?si=w2r39cTFVmiRijTo

You can find links to the album, and more information about Mary Anning, here… https://linktr.ee/thesecuriousthings

Michael occasionally pops in to the strange place that is Twitter at @heapsgood https://twitter.com/Heapsgood

To connect with Dinosaur University on Facebook, follow us at https://www.facebook.com/DinosaurUniversity

At Palaeo Jam, we now have an Instagram account at https://www.instagram.com/palaeo_jam

This is the second episode in Season 3 in which pterosaurs feature. Check out Episode 3 in which Michael chats with vertebrate Palaeontologist and expert in Australian pterosaurs Adele Pentland of the “Pals in Palaeo” podcast about Australian pterosaurs, about each of their podcasts, and about science heroes…

https://palaeojam.podbean.com/e/me-and-my-palaeo-pal/

Tens of thousands of years ago, in and around what is known as Lake Callabonna, in outback South Australia, all manner of now extinct Australian animals dwelt. But whether they walked, or slithered, or crawled, or hopped,  or flew, or swam in that place, it was soon to become what has been described in an ABC Australia documentary series as the “Lake of the Dead”.

In this episode of Palaeo Jam we travel back in time with host Michael Mills, and Dr Aaron Camens and Dr Phoebe McInerney of Flinders University to find who it was that once lived in and around this “Lake of the Dead”, and what it might have been like had we the ability to transport ourselves, and take a stroll along the banks of what was once a heathy, freshwater ecosystem.

You can hear more from both Aaron and Phoebe, and several other past Palaeo Jam guests in the remarkable two-part series, from ABC Australia’s Catalyst, in “Megafauna: What Killed Australia’s Giants?”. Head to the ABC iView site at https://iview.abc.net.au/ and search for the series there.

You can follow Aaron on Twitter at https://twitter.com/DiprotoRon, and check out his Flinders University profile at https://sites.flinders.edu.au/palaeontology/home/people/academics/aaron-camens/

Amongst his extensive research work, Aaron co-authored a paper that gave us a more complete picture of the largest marsupial predator known, and a former resident of the area, Thylacoleo carnifex…

https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0208020

Phoebe is on Twitter at https://twitter.com/Phoebyornis

Check out her recent article in The Conversation about the skull of Genyornis, discussed in this episode…

https://theconversation.com/new-fossils-show-what-australias-giant-prehistoric-thunder-birds-looked-like-and-offer-clues-about-how-they-died-out-221599

You can find host Michael Mills on Twitter at @heapsgood https://twitter.com/Heapsgood

To connect with Dinosaur University on Facebook, follow us at https://www.facebook.com/DinosaurUniversity

At Palaeo Jam, you can also follow our Instagram account at https://www.instagram.com/palaeo_jam

In 1990, Mike Cleland was fossicking around a coastal region of the state of Victoria in Australia, when he came across a fossil discovery that was to change his life. The fossil he discovered was to become known as Koolasuchus cleelandi, and in 2022, Koolasuchus to became the state’s official fossil emblem, following a public vote.

In this episode of Palaeo Jam, host Michael Mills chats with Mike, and Lesley Kool, after whom the first part of Koolasuchus, was named, about this extraordinary, prehistoric amphibian. Along the way, we discover Lesley’s role in the discovery and understanding of this remarkable fossil, and what it is about this car sized amphibian that makes it such a worthy fossil emblem.

For more information on the region where Koolasuchus was found, head to…

http://dinosaurdreaming.monash.edu/

You can also check out the Dinosaur Dreaming blog at…

http://dinodreaming.blogspot.com/

And find out more about the Victorian coastal dinosaur trail, here…

https://engage.basscoast.vic.gov.au/dino

You can find host Michael Mills on Twitter at @heapsgood https://twitter.com/Heapsgood

To connect with Dinosaur University on Facebook, follow us at https://www.facebook.com/DinosaurUniversity

At Palaeo Jam, you can also follow our Instagram account at https://www.instagram.com/palaeo_jam