Two key issues have been on the discernment and consideration list for the Plenary Council members these past two days:

Reconciliation: Healing Wounds, Receiving Gifts - with an apology to Aboriginal and Torres Straight Islander peoples and the role of Catholic education in the life of the Church. And as we'll hear, in the wider Australian community.

In this episode, Geraldine speaks to John Lochowiak, chair of NATSICC, the National Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Catholic Council, born in Cooper Pedy to an Aboriginal mother and Polish father.

And to Jacinta Collins, head of the National Catholic Education Commission, and former Labor Senator.

Both guests are intimately connected with these stories. In their different ways, they bring alive big visions for the role played in the past by the Church, where it could include new elements of worship and especially in the case of education, where it could broadcast how much it has offered wider society and why it will continue to do so.

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