What happens when being a “good” wife, mother, daughter, and friend has always meant putting yourself last?

On today’s deeply honest and enlightening episode of Pursue YOU, Pat Smith sits down with her longtime friend Mariana Devereaux for an honest conversation about perfectionism, self-sacrifice, motherhood, health, forgiveness, friendship, and learning to care for yourself without guilt.

Mariana opens up about the beliefs she inherited around serving others, the pressure to appear perfectly put together, and the realization that “being good” had quietly become tied to doing everything for everyone else. She also shares her decades-long struggle with bulimia, the family patterns that shaped her relationship with her body, and the slow process of learning to approach health from a different place.

Together, Pat and Mariana explore menopause, sleep, boundaries, gratitude, aging, and what it means to enter a season where your children are grown but the guilt of choosing yourself can remain. Their conversation also turns deeply personal as Pat admits why she tends to isolate when she is struggling and the two reflect on the accountability, forgiveness, and grace that have sustained their friendship for more than 25 years.

KEY POINTS 

00:00 — Introduction: Learning to serve yourself after years of serving everyone else.

03:00 — Letting go of perfection and choosing balance.

06:44 — How family and culture shaped Mariana’s instinct to put others first.

10:17 — Why guilt can linger even after your children are grown.

12:45 — Forgiveness, family wounds, and the power of acknowledgment.

19:01 — Mariana’s pivot from fashion and styling into health & wellness.

27:24 — Mariana opens up about her 20-year struggle with bulimia.

34:30 — Pat shares her experience with menopause and asking for help.

52:26 — What long-term friendship requires: honesty, grace, and accountability.

59:12 — Pat on learning to stop defending herself and own her mistakes.

1:01:33 — How losing her sister changed the way Pat thinks about resentment.

QUOTES 

“It’s not about being perfect; it’s about balance.” — Mariana Devereaux

“I used to get so defensive when I did things wrong. I didn’t want to be wrong.” — Pat Smith

“I still have a little guilt that sometimes creeps up on my shoulder that I should still be doing more for everybody else.” — Mariana Devereaux

GUEST RESOURCES 

Mariana Devereaux

M.Ed.

Licensed in Nutrition & Health

Website | morewithmari.com/ 

Health & Wellness coach

214~729~5529

IG | @morewithmari25

RESOURCES

Pat Smith 

IG | @patsmithty 

PURSUE YOU is produced by EPYC Media Network 

What if the dream you thought you lost was actually unfolding in a way you never expected?

In this powerful conversation, Pat Smith opens up about questioning whether she abandoned the vision she had for her life after marriage, motherhood, and unexpected seasons changed her path. Dr. Lamell McMorris shares how his own journey—from working alongside Martin Luther King III to being publicly fired at 27—taught him that life rarely follows a straight line.

Together, they explore purpose, timing, failure, faith, and the possibility that your story may be taking shape in ways you cannot yet see.

GUEST RESOURCES 

Lamell McMorris 

Website | lamellmcmorris.com

IG | @lamellmc

RESOURCES

Pat Smith 

IG | @patsmithty 

PURSUE YOU is produced by EPYC Media Network

Get your copy of The Power to Persist: 8 Simple Habits to Build Lifelong Resilience"

In this powerful episode of Pursue YOU, Pat Smith sits down with author, entrepreneur, and changemaker Lamell McMorris for a deeply human conversation about confidence, calling, childhood formation, and the quiet moments that shape who we become long before the world is watching.

Lamell shares how his early years in Chicago, his mother’s unwavering trust, church experiences, and exposure to leadership planted the seeds for a life rooted in purpose and persistence. He reframes confidence as something that can be nurtured, humility as essential to leadership, and faith as the foundation that keeps the heart aligned with service.

Together, they explore how childhood clues often point toward adult calling, why approachability matters just as much as competence, and how honoring where you come from gives you the courage to step fully into who you are becoming. As Lamell reminds us to “keep a good heart, remain approachable, and have a spirit of service.”

This episode is for anyone who has ever wondered if their early dreams still matter, if confidence can be learned, or if it is too late to pursue the life they once imagined.

KEY POINTS 

00:00 – When Your Story Doesn’t End With Failure

05:55 – Confidence Without Losing Humility

07:52 – How Confidence Is Built Before Success Arrives

09:02 – The Role of His Mother: Freedom to Become Yourself

12:03 – Childhood Passions Can Reveal Future Purpose

15:35 – God’s Timing vs. Our Timeline

18:08 – Losing a Dream and Finding Resilience

20:29 – Gratitude as the Foundation of Resilience

38:48 – Vulnerability Is a Strength, Not a Weakness

51:18 – Faith: Becoming Evidence of What You Once Hoped For

QUOTES 

“There’s a fine line where you exhibit confidence, but you still remain approachable.” – Lamell McMorris

“True friendships are built in spirit and in truth.” – Lamell McMorris

“Confidence is a hybrid. There’s something within all of us, but it has to be nurtured.” – Lamell McMorris

GUEST RESOURCES 

Dr. Lamell McMorris 

Website | lamellmcmorris.com

IG | @lamellmc

RESOURCES

Pat Smith 

IG | @patsmithty 

PURSUE YOU is produced by EPYC Media Network 

What do you need from your friendships in this season of life?

Pat Smith and her longtime friend Millicent Finney reflect on how friendship changes in your 50s and 60s, why different seasons require different kinds of support, and what it really means to show up for someone. From navigating decades of motherhood and family life together to literal late-night rescue calls, Pat and Millicent reveal the kind of friendship where the roles may change—but you still know, “If I need something, you’re there.”

Along the way, Pat catches herself minimizing what she brings to the friendship and realizes that love doesn’t have to look equal to be mutual.

RESOURCES

Pat Smith 

IG | @patsmithty 

PURSUE YOU is produced by EPYC Media Network

What happens when the woman who holds everything together finally admits she is tired?

In this deeply emotional episode of Pursue YOU, Pat Smith is joined by her lifelong friend Millicent Finney for a raw, unscripted conversation about friendship, faith, perfectionism, identity, and the hidden cost of always being the strong one.

For decades, Millicent has been the protector, the problem-solver, the woman who makes everything happen for everyone else. But in this conversation, she opens up about what it looks like to turn that same care inward for the first time. From navigating marriage, motherhood, and career, to confronting people-pleasing, image pressure, and the fear of disappointing others, Millicent shares how God is calling her into a new season of alignment and self-trust.

Tune in as Pat and Millicent explore what it means to pursue yourself without guilt, how friendships evolve across seasons, and why choosing yourself is not selfish; it is a matter of self-care. This episode is for every woman who has put herself last for too long and is finally ready to step into who God created her to be.

KEY POINTS 

00:00 - Introduction — Being the strong friend can cost you yourself

00:38 - Forgetting your purpose while caring for everyone else

00:49 - Finding your way back to God’s purpose

19:23 - Learning to pursue yourself after a lifetime of serving others

21:17 - Confidence, humility, and walking boldly with God

53:23 - The perfectionism that keeps you stuck

55:18 - The exhaustion of trying to look like you have it all together

56:21 - When God creates space for you to rediscover yourself

57:47 - Fighting for yourself as much as you fight for others

1:00:33 - It’s never too late to choose yourself

QUOTES 

“Showing up for myself is not the same as showing up for others.” – Millicent Finney

“You operate under these safety rules, and you get nowhere.”

“It’s a blessing and a burden to always be the one making it happen.”

“Remove boundaries from yourself. Anything you put on yourself, no one gave it to you.”

“It’s never too late. Just stop getting in the way of yourself.”

GUEST RESOURCES 

RESOURCES

Pat Smith 

IG | @patsmithty 

PURSUE YOU is produced by EPYC Media Network 

Pastor and biblical scholar Dr. Delman Coates joins Pat Smith for a candid conversation about the Bible, homosexuality, and the Scriptures Christians have long used to discuss same-sex relationships. Dr. Coates challenges traditional interpretations of Leviticus, Sodom and Gomorrah, Romans, and Matthew 19, explaining why historical context, language, consent, and translation matter when reading Scripture. Whether you agree or disagree, this conversation invites you to look closer, ask deeper questions, and study the text for yourself.

GUEST RESOURCES

Pastor Delman Coates

Website | delmancoates.org

RESOURCES

Pat Smith

IG | @patsmithty

PURSUE YOU is produced by EPYC Media Network

What if the faith you were taught was never meant to imprison you?

In this bold and deeply freeing episode of Pursue You, Pat Smith sits down with Pastor and theologian Dr. Delman Coates for a powerful conversation about Scripture, identity, marriage, sexuality, and the harm caused when faith is stripped of context and compassion.

Together, they unpack how the Bible has been misused to shame people navigating divorce, relationships, sexuality, and major life decisions. 

“Grief, divorce, sexuality… these are complex issues, and the church gives people simple answers.” – Pastor Delman Coates. 

Dr. Coates challenges rigid interpretations of Scripture and explains why many commonly quoted verses have been misunderstood, mistranslated, or weaponized… often leaving people stuck in fear, silence, and self-condemnation.

This episode delves into what it truly means to live a faith rooted in love, justice, and freedom. If you’ve ever felt torn between your faith and your heart, silenced by shame, or afraid to ask hard questions in church, this episode will meet you with clarity, courage, and grace.

👉 Learn more at lifesavingdivorce.com and explore the book The Life-Saving Divorce for deeper guidance. 

KEY POINTS 

00:00 - Introduction 

03:59 – When Scripture creates bondage instead of freedom.

09:26 – Pat redefines what a “successful” marriage actually means.

12:49 – The spiritual weight of believing divorce means disappointing God.

17:11 – God can give us agency to choose a new season.

20:25 – Why context matters when interpreting Scripture.

26:54 – Desire is something to manage, not automatically demonize.

35:42 – Faith does not require everyone to think the same.

41:00 – Reaching the point where you finally choose yourself.

43:34 – How shame caused Pat to silence herself and step away from ministry.

1:27:13 – Why we need more voices in the middle, not just the extremes.

QUOTES 

“We use scripture to put people in bondage instead of freeing them.” – Pastor Delman Coates

“God is not always an either-or God. God is a both-and God.” – Pastor Delman Coates

“There are no texts in Scripture that condemn consensual, same-gender loving people.” – Pastor Delman Coates

“Scripture is about critiquing systemic injustice, not policing personal piety.” – Pastor Delman Coates

“We should come alongside people to help them navigate hard decisions, not demonize them.” – Pastor Delman Coates

GUEST RESOURCES 

Pastor Delman Coates

Website | delmancoates.org

RESOURCES

Pat Smith 

IG | @patsmithty 

PURSUE YOU is produced by EPYC Media Network 

Grief isn't always about losing a loved one. Sometimes it's grieving a marriage, a friendship, your health, or the future you imagined.

In this powerful conversation, Pat Smith and John Onwuchekwa explore ambiguous grief—the hidden losses that come from divorce, broken relationships, chronic illness, and the life you thought you'd have. If you've ever struggled to explain why you're still hurting, this conversation may help you understand why.

GUEST RESOURCES 

John Onwuchekwa

Website | johno.co

IG | @jawn_o

RESOURCES

Pat Smith 

IG | @patsmithty 

PURSUE YOU is produced by EPYC Media Network

What if grief isn’t a journey to finish, but a language to be fluent in? 

In this deeply moving episode of Pursue YOU, Pat Smith is joined by grief educator and faith leader Dr. John Onwuchekwa for one of the most honest conversations about loss, loneliness, and healing you’ll hear. As the author of We Go On: Finding Purpose in All of Life’s Sorrows and Joys biblical book, he highlights the importance of acknowledging one’s true purpose, letting it shape our relationships, careers, and life choices. 

Together, they explore how grief lives in the body, why isolation makes pain heavier, and how faith can both complicate and comfort the grieving process.

Dr. John also challenges the common belief that grief is a journey with an endpoint and reframes it as a language we must learn to speak fluently. From losing parents and siblings to grieving marriages, homes, identities, and seasons of life, this episode validates losses that many people are told they should be “over by now.”

If you have ever felt ashamed of how long you’ve been grieving, confused by why your body hurts, or lonely in your pain, this conversation will meet you with truth, compassion, and permission to heal, without rushing yourself.

KEY POINTS 

00:00 – Introduction

19:18 – Grief is not a journey. It is a language you learn to speak.

21:20 – Loss is not limited to death. Divorce, identity shifts, and endings count too.

43:48 – Shame makes grief heavier and healing harder.

45:13 – Avoiding grief is what causes people to get stuck in it.

51:28 – Your body does not lie. It remembers what your mind tries to avoid.

54:41 – You are not weak for grieving. You are human.

57:44 – Grief done in isolation becomes trauma.

59:07 – You don’t need answers. You need someone to sit with you in the dark.

1:00:52 – Healing happens through connection, not timelines.

QUOTES 

“Grief is not a journey. It is a language.” – John Onwuchekwa

“The goal of a language is not to finish. It is to become fluent.” – John Onwuchekwa 

“Your body does not lie. It tells the truth.” – John Onwuchekwa

“The only people that get stuck in grief are people that try to avoid grief.” – John Onwuchekwa

“Grief is bad when it is done in isolation.” – John Onwuchekwa

“People are not scared of the dark. They are scared of being alone in the dark.” – John Onwuchekwa 

GUEST RESOURCES 

John Onwuchekwa

Website | johno.co

IG | @jawn_o

RESOURCES

Pat Smith 

IG | @patsmithty 

PURSUE YOU is produced by EPYC Media Network 

In PART 2 of this transformative conversation, Pat Smith and relationship coach Ludmila Woodruff move beyond the lessons of marriage and into the relationship that shapes every other one: the relationship with yourself. As Pat courageously confronts the beliefs she's carried for decades, she realizes that the validation, love, and confidence she searched for in others could never replace what she had never learned to give herself.

Together, they explore why self-worth affects the love we receive, how childhood wounds become adult relationship patterns, why so many women struggle to receive compliments, advocate for themselves, and feel financially secure, and how healing begins when we stop rejecting the woman staring back at us in the mirror. This episode is a powerful invitation to finally build the relationship you've been missing all along: the one with yourself.

KEY POINTS 

00:00 – Introduction

01:37 – Why healing starts by building a relationship with yourself. 

04:40 – High-achieving women are often the support for everyone else. 

09:35 – The healthiest relationships begin when you become securely attached to yourself.

10:16 – Ludmila's powerful mirror exercise for learning to genuinely love yourself.

18:42 –  Why self-worth determines the love you're able to receive.

22:46 – The permission slip to rewrite the stories you've believed about yourself for years.

30:04 – Love is not enough: Women must advocate for themselves emotionally and financially.

36:07 – The realization that changes everything.

42:22 – Pat choosing courage, self-compassion, and a brand new relationship with herself.

QUOTES 

"I did not love Pat. I didn't see me. I didn't totally receive all of me." – Pat Smith

"You haven't built a relationship with yourself yet." – Ludmila Woodruff

"I don't think I ever looked at myself as a winner." – Pat Smith

"Your husband doesn't see a woman who feels beautiful. He sees a woman who performs." – Ludmila Woodruff

GUEST RESOURCES 

Ludmila Woodruff

ludmilawoodruff.com 

IG | @ludmilawoodruff 

RESOURCES

Pat Smith 

IG | @patsmithty 

PURSUE YOU is produced by EPYC Media Network