Why do so many people encounter churches that seem nothing like Jesus? In this episode of Two Priests on the Patio, Jeff and Sue Ann Ward explore one of the most important spiritual questions they’ve ever received from a listener: If the Church is supposed to be the Body of Christ, why do so many people experience something that looks nothing like Jesus? Using the story of Zacchaeus from Luke 19, they reflect on radical inclusion, judgment, belonging, compassion, and the difference between rule-centered religion and Christ-centered living. Together they discuss:

• why Jesus consistently chose people over purity rules

• how fear and power distort faith communities

• the spiritual danger of exclusion and “insider” religion

• how love transforms people more deeply than shame

• real examples of churches living out radical compassion through refugee sponsorship, disability inclusion, food security, and community care

This is a conversation about the kind of Christianity that heals rather than harms—and what it means to truly reflect the heart of Christ in today’s world.

Come as you are.