Today Rory Sutherland is here, speaking with his co-author Pete Dyson about their new book, Transport for Humans: Are we nearly there yet?

The book is about how engineers plan transport systems, but people use them.

An engineer's measure of success – speed, journey time, efficiency – are often not the way that passengers think about a good trip.

We might consider habit, status, comfort, variety and many other factors that engineering equations don’t capture at all.

Now with climate change, the pandemic and changing work–life priorities, the time is ripe for a new way forward.

This book maps out how to design transport for humans.

So here’s 42courses founder Chris Rawlinson to ask the questions to Pete Dyson and Rory Sutherland.