In this episode, Chuck and Howie sit down with Patrick Jester, Founder of Blackthorn Consulting Group, to explore his unconventional path through aviation, military service, metrology, law, and leadership. Patrick shares how mentorship, discipline, and a commitment to excellence shaped his career—from Black Hawk helicopters to ISO/IEC 17025 assessments and consulting. The conversation dives into leadership values, ethics versus morals, the importance of integrity in quality systems, and how proficiency testing, training, and accreditation support long-term technical competence. Patrick also reflects on industry mentorship, writing Pillars of Command, and his vision for leadership within the metrology community.