Welcome to 2024 where a good number of men are still audacious beyond belief and women are still saying "WTF just let me live, dammit" every five seconds. Among them, many of the daughters who grew up Duggar, as in TLC's most viewed show ever, 19 Kids and Counting Duggar. Jill released a memoir at the end of 2023, Counting the Cost, that called out everyone who was complacent in her repressed, abusive and highly controlled religious upbringing, and we are here for it. We talk Jim Bob, IBLP (Institute of Basic Life Principals) and the "Shiny, Happy People" documentary. It's a lot to unpack, but stay with us because at the end we close out the episode with special guest Dr. Janja Lalich, an international authority on cults, extremism, and coercion. She offers some much-needed insight into how cults operate and advice on how to know if that new self-help support group you just joined online is actually a cult. (Heads up, MLMs can be cults, too.) Dr. Lalich can be found at janjalalich.com or lalichcenter.org.

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