This week, Women on the Verge fan favorite Kacie Swartz returns, arms in the air, to hold forth on another man money myth. Money shouldn’t be emotional? What the eff are you talking about Uncle Warren?*

Kacie kicks off with the radical notion that your money decisions are supposed to be emotional - we’re humans, not spreadsheets. The actual purpose of financial planning is matching up what’s important to us as individuals, what we’re emotionally attached to, with how we spend and save our money.

She also tells us the name of her next hit single, following the record-topping success of her previous hit “Money is a River Not a Pond.”

Sara bravely breaks new ground in the emotional ecosystem by asking if “fine” is a feeling, and Caitlin makes a groundbreaking metaphor comparing retirement savings to a crock pot. It’s getting deep in here, people.

Together, the trio explore what it looks like to take your emotions seriously when it comes to financial planning, starting with how to figure out what they even are. If there’s a way to do this without a feelings wheel, could someone let Sara know?

You can find fan favorite podcast guest Kacie Swartz at Black Barn Financial.

*That is a reference to Warren Buffet who once said something that sort of sounded like the only rational way to make financial decisions is without emotions.

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This episode was edited by our co-producer Kelly West. Music by Bad Bad Hats and Devmo.