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Here we go with the half-dozenth hour of #SeriousVintage, hosted by Nat Moes (@GrandpaBelcher on Twitter), Geoff Moes (@ThallidTosser on Twitter), and Josh Chapple (@joshchapple on Twitter). In the holiday spirit we decided to give you some of our vast knowledge of Vintage; share with you some thoughts on one of our favorte decks, Wizards!; and then relax with some yuletide potent potables in a #SeriousVintage party.
Our thoughts on interactivity aren’t anything new or unexpected, I don’t think, but they are something that players forget. People always talk about interacting with their opponent and how they want to force their opponent to interact etc. Really, that’s not true.
Magic decks want to force their opponent into a position where they can’t interact, to essentially setup a goldfishing scenario where their opponent might as well not exist. Whether this happens when you counter everything relevant your opponent plays, when you bury them under a pile of Spheres, or when you negate their deck by activating and triggering abilities in your graveyard is up to you, but don’t pretend you came here looking to interact with your opponent. You came here looking to ignore them completely.
One of the prime examples of this kind of faux interactivity is the Wizards! deck. We took our build from one presented by Omar Nieto in 2011.
Omar then played a revamped version of this deck, capitalizing on the power of Cavern of Souls, in a 47-person tournament in Spain. I said it was sanctioned in the podcast, but I see now that it allowed nine proxies. Anyway, he split first and second with a UWG Noble Fish player. Also, yes, Nieto’s lists have 61 cards in the maindeck.
Omar’s deck is filled with trump cards against Vintage’s most powerful archetypes and strategies, so if he finds the right trump and plays it uncounterably or for free, using Cavern or Aether Vial, he’s got a good chance of winning. Multiple trumps will just bury an opponent. Grim Lavamancer versus opposing creatures; Voidmage Prodigy and Magus of the Unseen versus blue decks using Yawgmoth’s Will and Tinker, and Qasali Pridemage and Magus of the Unseen versus Workshops are all gamebreaking effects.
The list we created has a more broadly based mana-denial attack to hamstring the opponent and prevent his being able to respond before hate bears take him down.
This version is specifically metagamed for Ohio (USA), which has many Workshops and creature decks. As we discussed in the audio, there are many different options for creatures and spells that can improve your matchup against any deck. We talked a little about some outliers like Bonds of Faith, but the big one we neglected was Baleful Strix, which is a good answer to flipped Delvers, Lodestone Golems, and Tarmogoyves.
We think this deck (and Nieto’s) are both a lot of fun, and frustrating to play against. You can set up many games where your opponent won’t be able to interact with you usefully at all.
Of course we had a lot to talk about here. Holiday gatherings are great opportunities to kick back, relax, and have a few drinks with friends. And when holiday shopping or office- and family-get-togethers get annoying, it’s a great opportunity to kick back, relax, and have a few drinks by yourself…while goldfishing Belcher, in your underwear.
Anyway here’s links to some of the recipes and beverages we talked about:
Eggnog
Mulled Wine
Leopold Bros. Fernet
Last but not least, the beers:
All of these come highly recommended, though I will mention again that the Shiner Holiday Cheer’s peaches and pecans are an odd flavor combination for this time of year. Let us know what you think on Twitter or in the comments with the #SeriousVintage tag!
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Here we go with the half-dozenth hour of #SeriousVintage, hosted by Nat Moes (@GrandpaBelcher on Twitter), Geoff Moes (@ThallidTosser on Twitter), and Josh Chapple (@joshchapple on Twitter). In the holiday spirit we decided to give you some of our vast knowledge of Vintage; share with you some thoughts on one of our favorte decks, Wizards!; and then relax with some yuletide potent potables in a #SeriousVintage party.
Our thoughts on interactivity aren’t anything new or unexpected, I don’t think, but they are something that players forget. People always talk about interacting with their opponent and how they want to force their opponent to interact etc. Really, that’s not true.
Magic decks want to force their opponent into a position where they can’t interact, to essentially setup a goldfishing scenario where their opponent might as well not exist. Whether this happens when you counter everything relevant your opponent plays, when you bury them under a pile of Spheres, or when you negate their deck by activating and triggering abilities in your graveyard is up to you, but don’t pretend you came here looking to interact with your opponent. You came here looking to ignore them completely.
One of the prime examples of this kind of faux interactivity is the Wizards! deck. We took our build from one presented by Omar Nieto in 2011.
Omar then played a revamped version of this deck, capitalizing on the power of Cavern of Souls, in a 47-person tournament in Spain. I said it was sanctioned in the podcast, but I see now that it allowed nine proxies. Anyway, he split first and second with a UWG Noble Fish player. Also, yes, Nieto’s lists have 61 cards in the maindeck.
Omar’s deck is filled with trump cards against Vintage’s most powerful archetypes and strategies, so if he finds the right trump and plays it uncounterably or for free, using Cavern or Aether Vial, he’s got a good chance of winning. Multiple trumps will just bury an opponent. Grim Lavamancer versus opposing creatures; Voidmage Prodigy and Magus of the Unseen versus blue decks using Yawgmoth’s Will and Tinker, and Qasali Pridemage and Magus of the Unseen versus Workshops are all gamebreaking effects.
The list we created has a more broadly based mana-denial attack to hamstring the opponent and prevent his being able to respond before hate bears take him down.
This version is specifically metagamed for Ohio (USA), which has many Workshops and creature decks. As we discussed in the audio, there are many different options for creatures and spells that can improve your matchup against any deck. We talked a little about some outliers like Bonds of Faith, but the big one we neglected was Baleful Strix, which is a good answer to flipped Delvers, Lodestone Golems, and Tarmogoyves.
We think this deck (and Nieto’s) are both a lot of fun, and frustrating to play against. You can set up many games where your opponent won’t be able to interact with you usefully at all.
Of course we had a lot to talk about here. Holiday gatherings are great opportunities to kick back, relax, and have a few drinks with friends. And when holiday shopping or office- and family-get-togethers get annoying, it’s a great opportunity to kick back, relax, and have a few drinks by yourself…while goldfishing Belcher, in your underwear.
Anyway here’s links to some of the recipes and beverages we talked about:
Eggnog
Mulled Wine
Leopold Bros. Fernet
Last but not least, the beers:
All of these come highly recommended, though I will mention again that the Shiner Holiday Cheer’s peaches and pecans are an odd flavor combination for this time of year. Let us know what you think on Twitter or in the comments with the #SeriousVintage tag!