Episode 135 - Allan Chapman - The Victorians and the Holy Land

In this episode of Still Unbelievable! Matthew chats with Allan Chapman, who teaches history of science at Oxford University, and has written extensively on history and science, including the relationship between the two. He is a Fellow of the Royal Astronomical Society and a founder member of the Society for the History of Astronomy. He is the author of several books, including the one we will be discussing this episode. If you have any interest in the history of Christianity, then we recommend this book as an enjoyable read. As always, see the show notes to for links to the book and topics that are referenced in the book. There are items in the links that we do not specifically cover in this conversation, so please to check them out for a taste of what the book covers.

1) The Victorians and the Holy Land: Adventurers, Tourists, and Archaeologists in the Lands of the Bible

https://amzn.eu/d/j7QAYC5

2) Ozymandias By Percy Bysshe Shelley - referenced in Chapter 2

https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/46565/ozymandias

3) A description of the East, and some other countries ... / By Richard Pococke - referenced in Chapter 2

https://wellcomecollection.org/works/me6h66jf/items

4) Petra by John William Burgon - referenced in chapter 2

http://www.poetryatlas.com/poetry/poem/3771/petra.html

5) Johann Ludwig Burckhardt - explorer

(includes links to his published works)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Ludwig_Burckhardt

6) Lady Amytis, wife of Nebuchadnezzar

https://www.historyofroyalwomen.com/amytis-of-babylon/amytis-of-babylon-the-queens-hanging-gardens-of-babylon/

7) Remarkably preserved shrines recovered at Assyrian temple of Ninurta in Nimrud, Iraq

https://archaeologymag.com/2024/12/remarkably-preserved-shrines-recovered-in-nimrud/

8) Biblical Researches - by Edward Robinson & Eli Smith - referenced in chapter 7

https://archive.org/details/biblicalresearc01smitgoog

9) Sinai & Palestine - by AP Stanley - referenced in chapter 7

https://archive.org/details/sinaipalestinei00stan/page/n9/mode/2up

10) A thousand miles up the Nile by Amelia B. Edwards - referenced in chapter 13

https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/70565

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Episode 134 - Apostate - Jo Lloyd Johnson

In this episode of Still Unbelievable, Matthew chats with Jo, one of the contributors of the book Apostate, Stories of Deconversion. Jo is already an author and has written her own memoir of deconstruction. Please be aware that this conversation touches on sexual violence from the opening minutes, but it is not all that is talked about, other topics are covered as well. Jo's book does talk about her experience of sexual violence and proceeds from her book go to the fantastic charity, Louder Than Silence, see the notes for links to the books and the charity.

1) Silenced in Eden - Jo's book

https://a.co/d/cap1YWt

2) Louder than Silence

https://www.louderthansilence.org/

3) Apostate Book

https://apocryphilepress.com/book/apostate-stories-of-deconversion/

4) The Inverse Cowgirl

https://msmagazine.com/2023/09/25/inverse-cowgirl-book-intersex/

https://www.waterstones.com/book/inverse-cowgirl/alicia-roth-weigel/9780063295285

5) Pidgeon Pagonis - Nobody Needs to Know: A Memoir

https://pid.ge/

https://www.npr.org/2023/08/15/1193862556/pidgeon-pagonis-reveals-a-long-held-secret-in-nobody-needs-to-know

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/151908228-nobody-needs-to-know

6) Jo on the Graceful Atheist podcast

https://gracefulatheist.com/2023/05/07/joanna-johnson-silenced-in-eden/

7) RAINN

https://rainn.org/

To contact us, email: [email protected]

our YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@reasonpress2901

Our Theme Music was written for us by Holly, to support her and to purchase her music use the links below:

https://hollykirstensongs.com/

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Episode 132 - How to Kill God the easy Way

In this episode of Still Unbelievable!, Matthew chats with Alan Bondar about his provocatively titled book, How to Kill God the Easy Way. We enjoyed this book and recommend it to anyone who is seeking to engage with a critical review of Christian apologetics. If you have any sympathies for Christianity and it's proponents, then this book will challenge those thoughts. If you have doubts about Christianity, then this book will help you to focus your thoughts and put words to those doubts.

We hope you enjoy listening to this episode as much as we did recording it.

1) Contact Alan:

https://howtokillgod.com/

[email protected]/

2) Buy the Book - How to Kill God the Easy Way

https://a.co/d/6BC6C24

3) Other books by Alan

https://a.co/d/3vNyo3s

https://a.co/d/cppZcPQ

4) Apostate: Stories of Deconversion

https://youtu.be/_hKSjwfnfms?si=yK6mbvfHUqWJVTMn

5) Alan on Jen Fishbourne's YouTube channel

part 1: https://youtu.be/Pq3zh5Od55I?si=5JombE2Iofgsv9rI

part 2: https://youtu.be/PyYUQk9vLKU?si=73HfowMH_QZSVGMo

To contact us, email: [email protected]

our YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@reasonpress2901

Our Theme Music was written for us by Holly, to support her and to purchase her music use the links below:

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In December 2024 Matthew asked Amy and Greg who made them experts on what makes someone a Christian. They answered.

In this episode Matthew takes their answer and explains why he's unimpressed. Especially because of the way their comments negatively affect LGBTQ+ people and those who want abortion to be a valid choice.

1) The Jan 2025 episode being responded to

https://www.str.org/w/-strask-who-made-you-the-experts-on-what-makes-someone-a-christian-

2) the Dec 2024 episode that prompted Matthew's question

https://www.str.org/w/-strask-how-can-so-many-professing-christians-support-things-that-are-anti-christian-

3) When the ‘Biblical View’ for Evangelicals Was That Life Begins at Birth

https://religiondispatches.org/when-the-biblical-view-for-evangelicals-was-that-life-begins-at-birth/

4) EP105 Answering the STR challenge

https://open.spotify.com/episode/54nXmumqLbErTTXE4PtYWD?si=glUJty8XTVadUfNvJwWW7g

5) Godwin's Law

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law

6) Gay Men under the Nazi Regime

https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/gay-men-under-the-nazi-regime

7) Trump curtails protections around diversity, LGBTQ rights

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-sign-orders-ending-diversity-programs-proclaiming-there-are-only-two-sexes-2025-01-20/

To contact us, email: [email protected]

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Our Theme Music was written for us by Holly, to support her and to purchase her music use the links below:

https://hollykirstensongs.com/

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1) Full text of the ruling

https://supremecourt.uk/cases/judgments/uksc-2024-0042

2) legal cheek commentary

https://www.legalcheek.com/2025/04/supreme-court-rules-woman-has-biological-meaning/

3) Lauren on the T Elders podcast

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yO4_9hJCQFI

To contact us, email: [email protected]

our YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@reasonpress2901

Our Theme Music was written for us by Holly, to support her and to purchase her music use the links below:

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Mark's account is chapter 16, it is the earliest, and also the shortest.There are no angels, no soldiers, Jesus is not there. Women are the only witnesses, besides the unidentified young man.Verse 9 onwards, reads differently, it contradicts the fear and silence of the women it includes hints and pointers to events described in greater detail in the other gospels. It's almost as though it was added after those stories were written.The note says some early manuscripts do not have verses 9 to 20. What it doesn't say is that manuscripts from as late the 4th century do not include these verses, they appear in manuscripts from the 5th century. This is strong evidence this text is forged. But you won't learn this from the bible. You have to engage with scholars. Why would christians downplay the truth here?Matthew's account is in chapter 28Matthew introduces an angel to roll away the stone, and an earthquake for added drama.Matthew also adds the soldiers for drama and conspiracy. Including the suggestion that Jews circulated that the disciples stole the body. Have you tried looking for evidence that the Jews actually perpetrated this? Apologists love to reference it, but I've never actually seen evidence that the claim is true. Matthew is the only one to make this claim, he is also the only one to reference guards. This is evidence of inserted fictionalisation. Matthew's account ends with the great commission and the familiar expression of Father, Son and Holy Spirit, it's almost as if this was a well known phrase and the writer of Matthew incorporated it to help create familiarity.Luke's account is chapter 24No earthquake, the stone is already rolled away. The drama about the empty tomb has two unidentified persons and a longer conversation. The women are no longer silent and afraid. The alleged appearances of Jesus are more detailed. How did Mark know the details of the conversation on the road? who is Cleopas? Why is this the only place he is mentioned? Yet another clue to added detail as the story gains momentum! Why is it Mark had access to the words of Jesus rebuking the two men, but not the words said afterwards where he explained everything in the scriptures about himself?When Jesus appears to the disciples it is he who offers to them to look at his hands and feet. Thomas is not a feature of this dialogue. Like with the road to Emmaus, Jesus opens their minds so they can understand. We have no written record of what that understanding is. There is no actual book in the bible that details what it was that Jesus had them understand. This text does not exist, and given the context, it would be a very key piece of knowledge to put into writing, more important than the details of what food Jesus ate in front of the disciples that evening. This sort of thing is evidence that the gospels are not true accounts of history, they are fictionalised accounts of events that mostly did not happen.John's account is chapter 20John inserts himself as Jesus favourite disciple. And god forbid that the women are recorded as first seeing that Jesus has risen. It has to be the men! Mary does still get to have a conversation with the angels, two of them now. Then Jesus is in the garden.The meeting where Jesus appears gains added detail, he breaths on them to impart his holy spirit. Thomas was not there, so we have the convoluted conversation to bring Jesus back to them a week later. As time progresses, and each new gospel is written, the writing becomes more dramatic and more details are included. When you read the passages consecutively like this, it becomes absolutely clear that this is what is happening. The standard apologetics excuse that this is each writer having a different focus simply does not work. These accounts are not safe to believe.

The deaths of JesusMark 15 21-41Being the earliest account, we would expect Mark to be the simplest, with the least detail.This account contains the key elements we are familiar with, Simon of Cyrene (who the hell is this guy anyway and why is he not mentioned anywhere else?) It feels like this is an inserted character to help create the narrative of Jesus being special. Even with early accounts we have suspicious detail. Has anyone ever pinpointed where Golgotha is?There is the familiar bit about Jesus' clothes being divided up. The note about Jesus being king of the Jews.The two people crucified with Jesus are called rebels. They both mocked him.All versions have the sun darkening, some suggest this is an eclipse, but that's not possible because of the length of time indicated and the point in the moons phase when Passover happens. The temple curtain being torn is also in all accounts.Reading Marks account, it's easy to see how even early versions of stories will contain fictionalised detail.Matthew 27 32-55Matthew is very similar to Mark, much of it considered to be a straight copy. Yet even here we see new details being inserted.The note about being king of the Jews gains words, it is placed above Jesus' head. Jesus gets two drinks. The mocking of Jesus has more words, those being crucified with him are still rebels and they also both still mock him.The tearing of the temple curtain isn't enough, so an earthquake is added, but that's still not enough, so rocks are split and dead people come back to life. I wonder why the earthquake didn't topple the crosses.This time it's not the centurion who declares him the son of god, but multiple people who were there watching.Luke 23 26-49Jesus gains a few lines of dialogue during the journey to the crucifixion. And while he is on the cross. We are introduced to the phrase "father forgive them for they know not what they do", you'd think that such a memorable phrase would have been included in all accounts. The mocking of Jesus has changed. The notice above his head has changed, again.We also have the significant change of only one of those being crucified with Jesus mocking him. You'd think that all accounts would have a detail as critical as this. This is exactly the sort of difference that indicates a narrative that is evolving over time.The post death phrase recognising Jesus as being righteous is back to just the centurion saying it. The earthquake has disappeared, but Jesus death is a little more dramatic. It's this kind of subtle detail differences that lead scholars to suggest that those who wrote Luke and Matthew copied from Mark. Each using Mark as a base and adding their own embellishments. John 19 16-36Simon of Cyrene is dropped, as though he's taking too much attention from Jesus and instead Jesus carried his own cross.The note is still there, the text has changed again, and this time it's in multiple languages to really drive the point home. The writers obviously could not agree on what it was that had been written about Jesus. Pilot gets a chance to justify what he wrote. Who had a contact with the chief priests to find this out? Yet another detail that feels like it's inserted fiction.The separating of Jesus clothes gains new detail. What happened to that untorn garment, that would have been very valuable. There is extra detail testing for the death of Jesus with the spear in his side. This is a crucial detail that seems to be forgotten by the earlier accounts, is this another addition?When you read the different accounts of Jesus crucifixion and death, there is clear progression in the narrative, details are added to increase drama and mundane parts are removed. This is exactly the kind of changes that happen when stories evolve over years and decades of retelling.

This is why I, and others, simply can not accept the gospels, or the bible as anything other than a human book telling human stories.

Did Jesus really wash his disciples feet?Christian apologists like to make a point of the gospels being written by eye witnesses and that being written close to the original events makes then less likely to be polluted by the passage of time. The issue with this is that we don't know who wrote any of the gospels. That aside, using the logic that earlier is better, we should expect to see progression of the story, we should expect to see addition of details in the later accounts.Mark's account of the last supper is in chapter 14.A couple of things stand out in this passage, firstly, there is mention of the Festival of unleavened bread, it starts on the 15th day of Nissan, the day after Passover. How come they haven't had Passover yet? Why are they only now preparing for it? This seems odd.It has the very familiar account of Jesus predicting his betrayal, and the breaking of bread. Judas is not identified, even though the preceding passage is about judas agreeing the betrayal.Matthews's account of the last supper is in chapter 26.Matthew is almost identical to Mark. The same details, the same phrases and the same order. Some scholars do say that Matthew copied from Mark, and reading this I can see why. Notice too the extra detail. Verse 15 has the extra detail of Judas asking and Jesus responding. Reading this, and knowing that Matthew was written after Mark, and probably copied from Mark, this verse does indeed feel like a later addition, a piece of conversation that never happened but was inserted for the benefit of readers with a short memory.Luke's account of the last supper is in chapter 22.A new fact, but it's wrong. The festival of Unleavened bread is not the same as the Passover. It's almost as if this was written by someone who was not a practising jew, or who didn't pay attention to detail.This time, instead of just instructing his disciples, Jesus now instructs a specific pair. The story is evolving.Notice how this account has the bread and wine being shared out twice, and the part about betrayal isn't there.Even as an English translation, this version is more awkward to read, it doesn't flow and feels like it's had cuts and edits. Weird.The bit about swords, is plain odd. As if the next bit of the chapter requires a sword, and the editor realised that no one had one so they had to explain the presence of a sword so that the incident on the mount of Olives made sense.We also lost the singing of hymns.Then finally we get to John's account of the last supper, which is in chapter 13.This version feels a whole lot darker than the previous three. It's very different. As though it has had a longer period of time to evolve before getting written down.Little details like sending the disciples to find the room are lost, along with bigger details like the breaking of bread and sharing of wine. Instead there is a version of the judas scene, with judas now leaving the meal.What's odd for me is the rest of the chapter is Jesus preaching and interacting with the disciples, this goes on for so long that it extends into the next chapter, don't worry, I won't be reading it all, but there is a bit I want to draw attention to. Chapter 14, verse 22, Judas asks a question. But Judas has already left. Ah, this bit in parenthesis saying not Judas Iscariot. Did a later editor have an oh shit moment and hurriedly cover up the mistake. This is exactly what I'd expect from narratives that evolve over time, been subject to multiple embellishments from multiple contributors. I know that apologists have an explanation for this, and they have to explain it because on face value it is a problem, there is no other disciple called Judas. Invent an explanation they must. Any explanation is better than admitting it is fiction.The four versions evolve, progress, get darker and show clear signs of editing and embellishment. This is why I can't believe the bible is true and why I can't take Christianity seriously.

This bonus episode of Still Unbelievable! is the audio part of a video uploaded to the ReasonPress YouTube channel. All episodes of Still Unbelievable now also get uploaded to YouTube, and as a bonus, we also do a few videos that, for practical purposes, are available on YouTube only, link in the show notes. As a special treat for this easter, there will be additional videos on our channel addressing issues with the Easter story.

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Our Theme Music was written for us by Holly, to support her and to purchase her music use the links below:

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In this episode of Still Unbelievable! Matthew is in conversation with Phil from the flawed theology podcast. Phil is a fellow contributor of the Apostate book that is now available and tells the stories of 21 people who have left Christianity. Links in the show notes for the book and Phil's podcast content.

1) Apostate

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DPNBSCBG

2) Flawed Theology podcast

https://www.flawedtheologypodcast.com/

3) Capitol riots with Christian aligned flags and symbols

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/01/09/us/capitol-hill-insurrection-extremist-flags-soh/index.html

4) Epicurean paradox

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epicurean_paradox

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Our Theme Music was written for us by Holly, to support her and to purchase her music use the links below:

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