Listen to this episode on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, and Substack. We now have transcripts available too (Click on the “transcripts” button in the top right corner of this post to access them).

In today’s episode, I’m speaking with Sam Lessin, an early VP of Product at Facebook and currently co-founder and GP at Slow Ventures, a generalist early-stage VC firm with offices in San Francisco and Boston. We explore how autonomous vehicles—particularly Waymo—are already changing everyday life in San Francisco, and why Sam believes their biggest impact may be on families.

Sam shares what he’s observed about Waymo’s progress over the past few years, why kids and childcare could be the real unlock for autonomy, and how AVs might reduce the financial and career tradeoffs that come with parenting. We also dig into practical questions, including what age it could make sense for a child to ride alone in a robotaxi, how autonomous vehicles could make suburban living more appealing, and what that shift could mean for housing and real estate.

We compare autonomous rides to human-driven services like Uber, discuss Waymo’s pricing and cost structure, and examine how widespread AV adoption could expand the overall ridesharing market. The conversation also covers the short and long term effects of autonomy and automation, from job displacement and birth rates to investment opportunities in AVs.

Chapters

(00:00) Introduction to Sam Lessin

(03:20) What Sam has noticed about Waymo in San Francisco over the last few years

(05:10) Why Waymo’s biggest impact will be with kids and childcare

(08:00) The financial and career cost of having kids, and how Waymo can help

(09:50) What age does Sam think is appropriate for a kid to use a Waymo?

(10:50) How Waymo makes the suburbs more appealing, and it’s impact on real estate

(14:10) How AVs compare to human driven rideshare like Uber

(16:30) Short and long term effects of AV proliferation: Job loss, ridesharing Total Addressible Market (TAM), birth rates

(18:19) Insights on Waymo pricing and cost vs rideshare

(19:58) How AVs and automation could make parenting easier

(22:03) Investment opportunities in the advent of AVs and AI

(25:27) Conclusion and final thoughts

Notes/Links:

* You can find Sam on Linkedin (link).

* You can also find him on Twitter/X (link).

* Sam’s personal website (link).

* Slow Ventures’ website (link).

* Sam’s post about Waymo replacing nanny and parent chauffeur jobs, mentioned at the 05:12 timestamp (link).

* My previous podcast episode with Brad Hargreaves explaining the effect of robotaxis on real estate, mentioned at the 22:11 timestamp (link).

Designing Charging Hubs for Autonomous Fleets

We are excited to partner with Terawatt, one of the leading providers of charging infrastructure. To learn more about Terawatt’s network of AV charging hubs and track record of 99%+ uptime, reach out to Logan Szidik at [email protected]

-Harry

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.thedriverlessdigest.com

Listen to this episode on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, and Substack. We now have transcripts available too (Click on the “transcripts” button in the top right corner of this post to access them).

In today’s episode, I’m speaking with Jeffrey Tumlin, a 30-year transportation leader and former executive director of the San Francisco Municipal Transportation Agency (SFMTA). Jeffrey shares how robotaxis first came onto his radar, what the SFMTA is responsible for, and why San Francisco has long been a proving ground for new transportation technologies.

The conversation centers on autonomous vehicles in San Francisco, including the city’s turning point with AV deployment, how traffic incidents are tracked, and the ongoing challenges around data transparency. Jeffrey explains what AV companies could do better when working with cities, the cultural friction between public agencies and private operators, and practical ways to make early AV rollouts less chaotic.

We also explore congestion, safety, and the broader impacts of autonomy — drawing lessons from rideshare, discussing how AVs could affect traffic, and reflecting on the collapse of Cruise. Jeffrey closes with his perspective on whether cities should embrace AVs, how edge cases requiring human intervention might be addressed, and the most meaningful upsides autonomous vehicles can bring if deployed thoughtfully.

Editor’s Note: Jeffrey’s video unfortunately did not record (I blame Zoom) so that’s why there’s no video of him speaking in this episode. Audio is still great though!

Chapters

(00:00) Introduction to Jeffrey Tumlin

(01:08) When did Robotaxis first come to your radar while at the SFMTA?

(02:08) What is the SFMTA responsible for?

(02:45) San Francisco’s history with transportation technology

(03:50) San Francisco’s turning point with AV technology

(05:19) How San Francisco tracks traffic incidents, and data transparency problems

(08:06) What AV companies could do better on data transparency

(10:07) The cultural clash between cities and AV companies

(11:49) What solutions exist to make these early days of AV introduction smoother for AV companies and cities?

(14:48) The main adverse effects of AV proliferation

(17:36) How did rideshare affect traffic congestion, and lessons learnt

(20:58) How AVs would affect congestion, and solutions that exist

(22:30) Jeffrey’s take on the safety argument for AVs

(27:05) Should cities embrace AVs, and how?

(30:07) The demise of Cruise and lessons learnt

(37:29) How do we solve AV edge cases that require human intervention

(40:26) The main upsides of AV introduction

(44:20) Conclusion and final thoughts

Notes/Links:

* You can find Jeffrey on Linkedin (link).

* You can also find Jeffrey on BlueSky (link).

* Jeffrey’s interview with David Zipper on Bloomberg about robotaxis in San Francisco, mentioned at the 13:49 timestamp (link, no paywall).

* RSG article on how Uber and Lyft affect congestion, mentioned at the 18:10 timestamp (link).

* New York Times op-ed by Dr. Jonathan Slotkin about robotaxi safety, mentioned at the 22:31 timestamp (link, no paywall).

-Harry

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Listen to this episode on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, and Substack. We now have transcripts available too (Click on the “transcripts” button in the top right corner of this post to access them).

In today’s episode, I’m speaking with Farzad Mesbahi, a former Tesla employee, a longtime Tesla investor and popular Tesla YouTuber. We get into why Farzad has become such a well-regarded voice in the Tesla community, how he thinks about the broader Tesla ecosystem, and how public perception has shifted over time. He also walks through a few interesting Tesla stats and facts, along with some of the more common criticisms the company faces.

We then dive into the latest on Tesla’s Robotaxi efforts — what we know, what’s still unclear, and how the rider experience differs from what companies like Waymo offer today. Farzad breaks down where Tesla’s autonomy approach may have advantages, how he thinks about Tesla’s safety profile, and whether Waymo is still ahead. We also compare both companies’ deployment strategies and discuss whether pricing even matters at this stage of the robotaxi rollout.

We wrap up with Farzad’s thoughts on the rest of the AV landscape beyond Tesla and Waymo, how he sees competition evolving, and his final outlook on where autonomy is headed.

Chapters

(00:00) Introduction to Farzad Mesbahi

(04:10) Why is Farzad considered knowledgeable about Tesla?

(05:25) The larger Tesla ecosystem and public perception

(07:35) Interesting Tesla stats/facts

(13:00) Some criticisms of Tesla

(14:40) The latest on Tesla’s Robotaxi

(18:00) The Tesla Robotaxi rider experience vs Waymo’s

(19:13) Advantages of Tesla’s autonomy approach over Waymo’s

(20:46) Quantifying Tesla’s safety profile

(24:03) Is Waymo ahead of Tesla?

(26:15) Thoughts on Tesla’s Robotaxi deployment approach vs Waymo’s

(32:25) Is pricing important at this stage of robotaxi rollout?

(35:05) Thoughts on other AV players apart from Tesla and Zoox

(40:30) Conclusion and final thoughts

Notes/Links:

* Farzad’s YouTube Channel (link).

* Farzad’s Website (link).

-Harry

Thanks for being a subscriber to The Driverless Digest! If you enjoyed this episode, feel free to share it with someone who might like it too. And if this email was forwarded to you, why not subscribe and stick around :)

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Listen to this episode on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, and Substack. We now have transcripts available too (Click on the “transcripts” button in the top right corner of this post to access them).

In today’s episode, I’m speaking with Hansu Kim, longtime San Francisco political consultant with 20+ years of experience in transportation policy and legislation, and Chairman of Flywheel Technologies, one of Uber’s taxi fleet partners, and taxi booking platform. We get into how the Flywheel–Uber partnership actually works, what the customer experience looks like, and how the taxi industry is responding to this model.

Hansu breaks down how Flywheel balances traditional taxi demand with Uber-induced trips, and how their approach boosts utilization while reducing congestion and emissions. We also talk about the benefits this model brings to drivers and TNCs, plus why taxi drivers still have a few meaningful advantages over regular rideshare drivers.

We then shift into the AV world, from how Uber uses similar fleet-partnership frameworks to onboard autonomous vehicle companies, to how robotaxis in San Francisco are affecting demand. Hansu shares where taxis could fill important gaps for AV operators, his take on Waymo’s challenges, how driver income might change as AVs scale, and how Flywheel is preparing for that future, including their work with Nexar on next-gen AI cameras.

Chapters

(00:00) Introduction to Hansu Kim

(01:25) Current state of the Flywheel-Uber partnership and the taxi industry

(03:20) Mechanics of the partnership, and the customer experience

(05:00) Is the Flywheel-Uber partnership model being embraced by the taxi industry?

(08:32) Flywheel’s demand distribution — Traditional taxi demand vs Uber induced demand

(09:21) How Flywheel maximizes vehicle utilization, and reduces congestion/pollution

(10:13) Benefits of the Flywheel-Uber partnership model to drivers and TNCs

(13:00) Flywheel’s business structure

(19:58) Advantages of taxi drivers over regular rideshare drivers

(23:30) How Uber uses the same fleet partnership model for autonomous vehicle companies

(25:10) How AV companies benefit from TNC/taxi partnerships

(26:15) Waymo’s challenges in SF, and how Flywheel could help (Disabled customers etc)

(29:39) How have robotaxis in SF impacted taxi/rideshare demand?

(32:20) How would taxi driver income change with the advent of AVs

(34:18) Would AVs eventually compete with Taxis?

(36:07) How Flywheel is preparing for the AV future

(40:15) How Flywheel is partnering with Nexar for their new generation AI cameras

(42:34) Hansu’s overall assessment of Waymo

(45:12) Conclusion and final notes

Notes/Links:

* Hansu’s previous appearance on The Rideshare Guy podcast: Order An Uber Get A Taxi?! Uber X Taxis | RSG 207 (link).

* RSG contributor Jay Cradeur tried out taxi driving with Flywheel: What’s It Like To Be A Taxi Driver vs an Uber Driver? (link).

-Harry

Thanks for being a subscriber to The Driverless Digest! If you enjoyed this episode, feel free to share it with someone who might like it too. And if this email was forwarded to you, why not subscribe and stick around :)

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Listen to this episode on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, and Substack. We now have transcripts available too (Click on the “transcripts” button in the top right corner of this post to access them).

In today’s episode, I’m speaking with Dawood Mian, a long time NYC fleet owner, and founder of AutoMarketplace, the largest content platform focused exclusively on New York city’s TLC market. We get into what makes the NYC TLC ecosystem unlike any other market in the country — from the regulatory framework and driver pay rules to the insurance realities. And why it’s such an important market for ridehail players like Uber and Waymo. Dawood breaks down how the market has evolved over the past years, the origin of lockouts, and how the economics of operating a rideshare fleet in New York differ dramatically from the rest of the U.S.

Dawood also walks through the details of running a rideshare fleet in NYC: managing insurance costs, sourcing and maintaining vehicles, plate values, and the operational challenges for future AV fleets, like finding real estate for parking, staging, and maintenance.

We also explore what it would take for a robotaxi operator like Waymo to launch in NYC — the regulatory steps, business barriers, and technical constraints that make New York one of the toughest markets for AV deployment. Dawood shares what he sees coming next for mobility in the city, and how both human-driven and future autonomous fleets may coexist in such a dense, tightly managed market.

Chapters

(00:00) Introduction to Dawood Mian

(01:30) What makes the NYC TLC market unique

(04:40) Why is insurance different for rideshare in NYC?

(07:20) How the NYC rideshare/taxi market has evolved

(09:50) NYC’s driver pay model, and the origin of lockouts

(13:19) How the rideshare rental business works in NYC

(16:30) Dawood’s fleet and business strategy

(19:51) Insurance in NYC’s rideshare fleet business

(22:57) Cost of an NYC TLC plate, and transferability

(24:47) The mechanics of Waymo’s entry into the NYC ridehail market

(30:00) Business and regulatory barriers to Waymo’s entry into New York city

(36:35) The future of AVs in NYC

(37:07) Are there technical/additional constraints to the operation of AVs in NYC?

(39:50) Real estate challenges for fleet operators in NYC

(43:55) Key NYC mobility issues to watch

(46:26) Conclusion and final thoughts

Notes/Links:

Check out Dawood’s website (AutoMarketplace), and you can follow his newsletter for the latest in NYC’s TLC market (link).

- Harry

Thanks for being a subscriber to The Driverless Digest! If you enjoyed this episode, feel free to share it with someone who might like it too. And if this email was forwarded to you, why not subscribe and stick around :)

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Listen to this episode on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, and Substack. We now have transcripts available too (Click on the “transcripts” button in the top right corner of this post to access them).

In today’s episode, I’m speaking with Dr. Xiaodi Hou, founder and CEO of Bot Auto, a company making big strides in autonomous trucking. Most recently, they completed their first human-less autonomous truck validation run — a major milestone in the push toward fully driver-out operations.

We talk about Xiaodi’s journey before founding Bot Auto, how the autonomous vehicle landscape has evolved over the years, his perspective on whether autonomous driving has truly been “solved,” and the key milestones Bot Auto has hit on its road to commercialization. Xiaodi also dives into the cost savings from driver-out operations, and the unique economics of running a driverless fleet. We unpack how Bot Auto is able to achieve multiple operational milestones with relatively small capital and what it’ll take to boost revenue beyond their cost per mile.

We also discuss the business side of autonomy — from Bot Auto’s model and approach to optimizing costs, to balancing cutting-edge technology with the realities of operations and customer acquisition. Xiaodi explains why Bot Auto doesn’t see itself as competing against human drivers, but rather solving the industry’s biggest pain points and creating value where it’s needed most.

Chapters

(00:00) Introduction to Dr. Xiaodi Hou

(01:40) Background on Bot Auto

(02:27) Xiaodi’s background and early ventures before Bot Auto

(04:03) The early days of AV development vs now

(06:15) Has autonomous driving been solved?

(08:05) Key milestones in the commercialization of autonomous driving at Bot Auto

(10:20) Cost savings from driver-out operations in autonomous trucking

(13:50) Broad insights into the trucking industry

(15:25) How autonomous trucks solve human/time factor limitations in trucking

(17:10) Bot Auto’s business model

(19:06) Optimizing the cost of autonomous trucking

(24:40) Bot Auto’s human-less validation run, and its significance

(28:35) How were you able to achieve multiple operational milestones with relatively small capital?

(31:32) What would it take for Bot Auto to make money, and increase revenue over cost-per -mile?

(32:53) How to balance the technology and business operations

(34:33) Customer acquisition in autonomous trucking

(35:55) Why does Bot Auto not compete against Humans? and their value proposition

(37:45) How does highway driving compare to urban driving for autonomous trucks vs robotaxis?

(41:25) Conclusion and final thoughts

Notes/Links:

Bot Auto’s first human-less autonomous truck validation run

* Full timelapse (link).

* Article: Bot Auto Completes Human-Less Hub-To-Hub Validation Run In Texas (link, no paywall).

- Harry

Thanks for being a subscriber to The Driverless Digest! If you enjoyed this episode, feel free to share it with someone who might like it too. And if this email was forwarded to you, why not subscribe and stick around :)

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Listen to this episode on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, and Substack. We now have transcripts available too (Click on the “transcripts” button in the top right corner of this post to access them).

Join panelists at the just concluded Urban Autonomy Summit at Newlab in Brooklyn as they discuss how cities, fleets, and regulators can work together to ensure AVs are deployed safely and responsibly. The panel featured Zach Greenberger (CEO, Nexar), Sarah Kaufman (Commissioner, NYC TLC), Jeremy Moskowitz (EVP Rideshare, VGM), and Aparna Paladugu (VP Policy & Government Affairs, Via), moderated by Andrew Hawkins, Transportation Editor at The Verge.

The conversation explores when robotaxis might realistically arrive in New York, how cities can balance safety and job security as AVs scale, and what kinds of data are most important in the AV deployment journey. The panelists also touch on policy pointers for the next NYC mayoral administration, the growing role of computer vision in rideshare and AV operations, and how partnerships between AV companies and public transit can support safer, more efficient streets.

They dive into questions around liability, fleet management, and public trust, and discuss how equitable robotaxi distribution could shape the future of mobility in New York and beyond.

Chapters

(00:00) Introduction to panelists

(00:44) When are robotaxis coming to New York?

(03:08) How to bridge the gap between safety and job security in AV deployment

(05:28) What kind of data is important in the AV deployment journey?

(10:36) Pointers for the next NYC mayoral administration on AV deployment

(13:38) Partnerships between AV companies and public transit

(18:44) Importance of computer vision is AV deployment and rideshare

(22:26) Questions around safety, fleet management, and liability as AVs begin to scale?

(26:57) How to build public trust around robotaxi/rideshare data collection/sharing

(33:25) How can robotaxis distribution be more equitable?

(38:20) Conclusion and final thoughts

- Harry

Thanks for being a subscriber to The Driverless Digest! If you enjoyed this episode, feel free to share it with someone who might like it too. And if this email was forwarded to you, why not subscribe and stick around :)

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.thedriverlessdigest.com

Listen to this episode on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, and Substack. We now have transcripts available too (Click on the “transcripts” button in the top right corner of this post to access them).

Join panelists, at the just concluded Urban Autonomy Summit at Newlab in Brooklyn as they dissect the impact the impact of AVs to existing fleets and driver earnings. The panel featured Ashwini Anburajan (CEO, Obi), Ryan Green (CEO, Gridwise), Daniel Muñoz (Co-Founder & COO, Tower Mobility), and Yariel Diaz (Director of Government Affairs, Serve Robotics), moderated by Natalie Lung, Tech Reporter at Bloomberg.

The conversation explores how AVs are already affecting drivers’ earnings, how drivers and fleets are adapting, and where delivery bots fit into the mix. The panelists also touch on the kinds of new jobs AV deployment could create for humans — from fleet management to remote operations etc. They dive into AV ride pricing dynamics, the importance of pricing transparency for riders and drivers alike, and what the near future could look like for the gig economy.

Chapters

(00:00) Introduction to panelists

(01:30) How AVs are affecting driver earnings

(04:19) How are drivers adapting to AVs?

(06:09) How has fleet management been affected by AVs?

(08:34) The role of delivery robots in AV deployment

(10:18) AV pricing dynamics for riders

(14:23) Importance of rideshare pricing transparency

(15:24) What jobs will AVs create for humans?

(21:43) How is trust from drivers in existing fleets and AV partners maintained?

(29:14) Data sharing between fleets and rideshare/AV companies

(30:30) How do you improve utilization with additional AV deployment?

(31:40) Mitigating adverse weather conditions for delivery robots

- Harry

Thanks for being a subscriber to The Driverless Digest! If you enjoyed this episode, feel free to share it with someone who might like it too. And if this email was forwarded to you, why not subscribe and stick around :)

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.thedriverlessdigest.com

This week’s podcast is brought to you by Terawatt – purpose-built charging for autonomous vehicle fleets.

Listen to this episode on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, and Substack. We now have transcripts available too (Click on the “transcripts” button in the top right corner of this post to access them).

In today’s episode, I’m speaking with David Zipper, a Senior Fellow at the MIT Mobility Initiative known for his writing on transportation policy, technology, and urban planning. He often writes about the impacts of autonomous vehicles (AVs) on cities, emphasizing concerns about increased congestion, safety risks from “car bloat”, and the potential for AVs to undermine public transit.

We discuss the evolution of the ridehail industry and its broader impact on cities and mobility. David shares his perspective on the early days of autonomous vehicles, highlighting both their promise and the risks they pose — particularly around congestion and the potential to draw riders away from public transit.

He breaks down why cheaper AV rides could worsen traffic, the role that policy tools like bus rapid transit, congestion pricing, and deadheading fees could play in addressing it, and whether robotaxis can meaningfully improve road safety. We also touch on the shared responsibilities of governments and AV companies, potential synergies between AVs and transit, and how cities can better design pickup and drop-off zones to serve riders, cyclists, and pedestrians alike.

Chapters

(00:00) Introduction to David Zipper

(02:29) David’s new transportation podcast

(03:39) Overall view of the ridehail industry and its impact on society

(07:30) How do you feel about AVs at this early stage?

(09:34) The biggest potential negative impact of AVs (Congestion)

(11:45) Should ridehail be blamed for congestion in cities?

(15:20) How price reduction in AVs could potentially affect congestion

(17:14) What are the solutions to congestion in the advent of AVs?

(24:11) Can robotaxis reduce road fatalities?

(30:40) The role of Government and AV companies in road safety

(31:01) AVs vs Public Transit

(34:24) Possible synergies between AVs and Transit

(37:13) Improving pickup and drop-off points for ridehail/AVs

(39:30) Cyclists and Pedestrians in the Age of AVs

(43:00) Conclusion and final thoughts

Notes/Links:

* Check out David’s website (link) to join his newsletter and explore his past writing.

* David’s new podcast: Look Both Ways with David & Wes (link).

* David’s Vox Article: A self-driving car traffic jam is coming for US cities (link).

Designing Charging Hubs for Autonomous Fleets

We are excited to partner with Terawatt, one of the leading providers of charging infrastructure. To learn more about Terawatt’s network of AV charging hubs and track record of 99%+ uptime, reach out to Logan Szidik at [email protected]

- Harry

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.thedriverlessdigest.com

It’s less than two days until our first annual Urban Autonomy Summit, presented by Nexar, on October 8th, at Newlab in Brooklyn. We’re down to just a few spots, so this is your last chance to apply and make sure you don’t miss out on the action. Register here to secure your spot!

Listen to this episode on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, and Substack. We now have transcripts available too (Click on the “transcripts” button in the top right corner of this post to access them).

In today’s episode, I’m speaking with Dimitri Strobbe, Director of Road Maintenance at the Brussels Capital Region, who recently joined a study tour in China, testing autonomous vehicles from major local players and engaging with industry leaders to see firsthand how the technology is developing abroad. We discussed the study tour and the impetus behind it, as well as his interactions with Chinese autonomous vehicle companies and executives. He also talked about his experience testing various AV products from companies like Pony.ai, Baidu, Xpeng, and Huawei, and how these experiences measured up to his expectations.

Dimitri dove into some of the things that stood out in Chinese society, including urban infrastructure and technological shocks he experienced during the study tour, as well as his interactions with Chinese AVs and society. He discussed the differences in transparency between Chinese AV companies and American ones like Waymo, and wrapped up with some lessons learned from the trip.

Chapters

(00:00) Introduction to Dimitri Strobbe

(02:02) Details of the China study tour

(03:35) The impetus for the China Study Tour

(06:55) How transparent were Chinese AV companies?

(7:57) Which AV companies did you interact with in China?

(08:42) What was the experience riding Chinese robotaxis and Robobuses?

(11:25) What stood out with the robotaxis

(14:19) Expectations vs reality

(17:35) High-level AV executive interactions in China

(20:35) What stood out with the Chinese society

(23:16) Urban infrastructure shocks

(24:28) Automation of AV maintenance/charging in China

(25:26) DiDi’s giant AV strides

(26:39) Take-home lessons from the China study tour

(32:20) Conclusion and final thoughts

Notes/Links:

* Apply to attend our Urban Autonomy Summit here

* Itinerary for the China study tour (link).

* Dimitri’s first/second post about the China Study Tour.

* Jacco’s post on Neolix’s autonomous cargo delivery robots from the Study Tour (he was another participant).

* Pieter’s video of Chinese AVs demonstrating autonomous maintenance and charging (he was another participant of the Study Tour)

- Harry

Thanks for being a subscriber to The Driverless Digest! If you enjoyed this episode, feel free to share it with someone who might like it too. And if this email was forwarded to you, why not subscribe and stick around :)

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.thedriverlessdigest.com