The Operating System Show

Graeme Barlow sold a company at 16 and grew Iversoft from 7 people to more than 50. Today he oversees growth across the AI companies at Martell Ventures, coaches about a hundred companies, and runs FounderLink, a community of more than 2,000 founders.

His rule for finding the bottleneck is simple. Every business is held back by customers, cash, or delivery. Figure out which one is yours, then attack that one thing instead of spreading your effort across everything.

Then he turns the question on Matt, gets an answer, and hands him a challenge: two hours a day, one to create content and one to post it, for sixty days.

## In this episode

- How a growth contest in 2014 started his work with Dan Martell

- The client debt he flew across the country to collect

- What default to action looks like when you also have to keep the team

- Why firing the people who break things kills innovation

- What organizational debt looks like in a real company

- The technical leaders who refused to let agents write the code, and what happened to them

- Why distribution is now harder than building

- Why he built FounderLink

- Hacker, hustler, hipster, and what AI changes about design

- Customers, cash, or delivery, and how to tell which one is yours

- A deal done in a day and a half

- Bringing a camera to every event

- The chief of staff agent he thinks every owner should set up

## Timestamps

00:00 Intro

00:59 How Graeme met Dan Martell

02:08 The client debt that turned into stock

03:30 Running growth at Martell Ventures

03:50 What default to action really looks like

05:46 Firing the people who break things kills innovation

06:15 Rewarding experiments over end results

07:26 What organizational debt looks like

09:39 Matt's background

11:58 The AI tools they use

14:17 Technical leaders who will not adopt AI

18:12 Where he will not build

20:01 What engineers ask about their careers

23:27 Distribution is the new moat

26:03 Why he built FounderLink

27:22 Hacker, hustler, hipster

29:40 AI and designers

30:35 Customers, cash, or delivery

32:04 The offer problem that was a volume problem

33:54 Pick the one thing and attack it

34:58 A deal done in a day and a half

37:07 What are you doing in the next two hours?

38:16 Graeme coaches Matt on his constraint

40:20 Two hours of content a day for sixty days

42:40 Bring a camera to every event

43:46 Set up a chief of staff agent

45:50 Where to find Graeme

## About Graeme Barlow

Graeme Barlow has spent 24 years building, scaling, and exiting technology companies. He sold a company at 16, cofounded ProPet Software, and grew Iversoft, a software development agency, from 7 people to more than 50. He oversees growth across the AI companies at Martell Ventures and founded FounderLink, a curated community for founders, with a mission to help 1,000 entrepreneurs reach $1 million in revenue.

Website: https://www.graemebarlow.com/

FounderLink: https://founderlink.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/graemebarlow/

Listen: https://feeds.transistor.fm/the-operating-system-show

Be a guest: https://crm.frontrangesystems.com/discovery

Mishka Kofman has been writing software for 28 years, from Madden at EA to AWS. Today he runs Paracorp and builds ARC, a platform that modernizes legacy software by pulling out every business rule and rebuilding the system around them.

His warning for owners: AI made code cheap to write, and it did nothing to make code cheap to keep. Teams are shipping faster than ever and creating debt faster than ever, and most leaders cannot see what it is costing them.

His rule for build versus buy is simple. Buy what is not central to you. Build what holds your business rules and gives you an edge.

## In this episode

- Why he left steady employment to build Paracorp

- What AWS and EA each taught him about how teams should run

- Why every decision should be written down, and what that does for AI

- Whether a product owner should read the team's retro notes

- Technical debt in the AI era, and why cheap code is not cheap to keep

- The house that keeps adding rooms while the foundation moves

- Rebuilding software from its business rules

- What he finds in every legacy codebase he opens

- Build versus buy, and keeping what holds your business rules

- How he wins over engineers who do not want AI touching their code

- Who should not modernize right now

## Timestamps

00:00 Intro

01:08 Why he started Paracorp

03:19 What AWS and EA taught him

05:30 Teams that run without top down orders

07:12 Why every decision gets written down

08:57 Should the product owner read the retro notes?

12:36 Technical debt in the AI era

14:20 Cheap to write, not cheap to keep

16:48 The house that keeps adding rooms

20:04 What ARC does

23:27 Business rules are the software

24:37 How you avoid breaking things

27:40 What he finds in every legacy codebase

29:40 Build versus buy now

32:17 Merging three apps into one

33:43 Adding features during a modernization

35:37 Dev teams that do not want AI touching their code

38:57 Who should not modernize right now

40:44 What is next for Paracorp and ARC

44:05 Where to find Mishka

## About Mishka Kofman

Mishka Kofman is the founder of Paracorp and the builder of ARC, the Architecture Refactoring Coordinator. He has spent 28 years in software, including Madden at EA and AWS, and runs workshops on using AI to write predictable, maintainable code.

Paracorp: https://paracorp.io/

ARC: https://try-arc.com/

Listen: https://feeds.transistor.fm/the-operating-system-show

Be a guest: https://crm.frontrangesystems.com/discovery

Jordan Fleming bootstrapped smrtPhone from Poland, with the technical team in Romania, to just under 10 million dollars and nearly 60 people. Along the way it went from a phone system built for Podio to what he now calls an agentic conversation platform. He has since moved from CEO to chairman.

His argument is that most companies spending on AI are not seeing growth from it. They drop very capable agents into processes designed around human limits, and those processes are full of invisible work that people quietly cover. Only about 5 percent of the companies he has worked with have mapped their processes the way the work actually runs.

That is the subject of his book, The AI Workforce: redesign the business, one process at a time, around work shared between agents and people.

## In this episode

- Four owners, distinct roles, and disagree and commit when they can't agree

- Why they built in Eastern Europe, inside the EU legal and IP framework

- The happy accident of building a phone system for Podio, and growing with almost no marketing

- How every product update now flows into a company brain that updates help docs and agents

- An agent that made 220,000 calls in three and a half weeks

- Why AI spend is not turning into growth

- The invisible work that never makes it onto the process map

- Business structures built for one kind of labor, and what changes now

- Hiring a role based AI agent and onboarding it to your company

- Why voice agents built software first sound great in demos and fail in execution

## Timestamps

00:00 Welcome

01:01 Four owners, and stepping up to chairman

02:15 Splitting the roles so nobody deadlocks

03:43 Why build the company in Eastern Europe

05:18 From a PhD in music to Poland

06:08 Bootstrapping a phone system for Podio

08:09 From VoIP company to agentic conversation platform

08:45 How AI changed the way they build

09:40 220,000 calls in three and a half weeks

10:15 Why AI spend is not turning into growth

12:08 Only 5 percent map their real process

13:52 Redesigning process after process

14:42 The AI Workforce, his book

16:08 The four zones of AI

16:39 Business structures built for one kind of labor

18:47 The next 24 months

20:06 What broke as they scaled

22:05 Hiring role based AI agents

23:27 Onboarding an agent: property maintenance

25:01 Latency, and why telecom first matters

26:43 Who smrtPhone is for

28:14 Where to find Jordan and the book

## About Jordan Fleming

Jordan Fleming is the cofounder and chairman of smrtPhone, an agentic conversation platform for voice and text, built for companies of 10 to 500 users. He is the author of The AI Workforce, a framework for redesigning a business around shared execution between AI agents and people.

The AI Workforce, free executive briefing for listeners: https://thefutureworkforce.ai/p/os-show

smrtPhone: https://smrtphone.io

Listen: https://feeds.transistor.fm/the-operating-system-show

Be a guest: https://crm.frontrangesystems.com/discovery

Bryan Clayton started mowing yards in high school and grew it into a Tennessee landscaping company with about 150 people and 90 trucks. Fifteen years in, it was organized chaos every day, and he was the scaffolding holding it up. He never took a vacation longer than two days.

After he sold it, he set out to build the opposite: a business with a system for almost every problem. That became GreenPal, a marketplace for lawn mowing that has handled about 300,000 transactions with fewer than 50 people, no offices, and no lawnmowers.

We get into what he refused to repeat the second time, the difference between hard work and difficult work, how GreenPal keeps quality high with vendors it does not employ, and where he draws the line on what AI should never touch.

## In this episode

- Why his first company was built as scaffolding around the founder

- Every problem you solve unlocks five more, and why that is the job

- Running a marketplace as a never ending series of experiments

- From fragile to antifragile: weekly loops that make the business better on their own

- Hard work versus difficult work, and the partner who wore 15 hour Sundays as a badge

- What breaks in a remote first company, and why even Zoom has an office

- The carrot and stick system that keeps independent lawn pros showing up

- How AI gave a state school founder an MIT data scientist at the table

- Why the founder should still do an hour of customer support every day

- "Stop being lazy and ask Claude," and why AI makes everyone busier

## Timestamps

00:00 Intro

00:49 Under 50 people, 300,000 transactions

02:35 What he did differently the second time

05:45 Landscaping versus software

08:21 A never ending series of experiments

10:01 150 employees, 90 trucks, and a mechanic shop

11:44 From fragile to antifragile

14:19 Hard work versus difficult work

16:57 Running a remote first company

18:46 Quality from vendors you do not employ

21:53 How GreenPal uses AI

24:42 Who should not build a marketplace

26:25 The four zones of AI

27:59 Why the founder should do customer support

29:28 Messy data and "stop being lazy and ask Claude"

32:16 Why AI makes everyone busier

33:26 What is next: a million users

34:11 Where to find Bryan

## About Bryan Clayton

Bryan Clayton is the cofounder and CEO of GreenPal, a marketplace that connects homeowners with local lawn care pros. Before GreenPal he built and sold a landscaping company in Tennessee.

GreenPal: https://www.yourgreenpal.com/

Listen: https://feeds.transistor.fm/the-operating-system-show

Be a guest: https://crm.frontrangesystems.com/discovery

Jay Bourgana took a real estate brokerage from zero to 350 million dollars in sales volume in four years, then sold 70 percent of it to a much larger firm in 2018. Since then he has been on both sides of about 30 acquisitions, buying plumbing, HVAC, and IT companies. Today he runs Foresight Partners.

His favorite deals are what he calls flywheel businesses: no website, no marketing, customers who keep calling anyway, strong margins, and a founder who carries the whole operation in his head. Before he even signs a letter of intent, he starts pulling that knowledge out.

His warning for owners racing toward AI: fix the data first. Most companies run on duplicate records, spreadsheets stitched together by hand, and reports that arrive a month late. Put AI on top of that and it just moves faster in the wrong direction.

## In this episode

- How a manufacturing mindset built a brokerage that answered new leads in seconds

- The cold email he almost deleted, and selling 70 percent of his company 30 days later

- Why he buys businesses that only work because the founder is inside them

- The three engines he maps before closing: clients, talent, and capital

- Why owners grow to five million, hate it, and shrink back to three

- People, then process, then technology, and why speeding up the machine shakes everything loose

- Data before AI: closed loop companies and the cost of lagging numbers

- Why middle managers become the human in the loop for AI agents

- Who should sell to him, and who should not

- Kids Business School, teaching entrepreneurship to kids 7 to 17

## Timestamps

00:00 Zero to 350 million in four years

00:52 Bringing manufacturing thinking to real estate

03:22 How owners can use data better

06:41 Speed to lead, then and now

09:11 The cold email that sold the company

10:43 Retiring, then getting back in

12:02 What he does first when he buys a business

14:02 When everything lives in the owner's head

16:11 Buying to own forever

17:12 Why owners shrink back to three million

20:00 People, process, technology, and the shake

21:01 How he uses AI and why data comes first

23:07 The four zones of AI

24:53 Why middle managers become the human in the loop

28:13 75 states in a 50 state CRM

31:46 If you need Excel, something is wrong

32:35 The company that could not tell him its churn

34:06 Who should sell to him, and who should not

37:50 What is next, and Kids Business School

39:39 Where to find Jay

## About Jay Bourgana

Jay Bourgana is the founder of Foresight Partners, which buys and operates founder led home services and professional services businesses. He built and sold a real estate brokerage, has been on both sides of about 30 acquisitions, and is building Kids Business School, an entrepreneurship program for kids 7 to 17.

Acquisitions Collective: https://acquisitionscollective.biz/

Kids Business School: https://kidsbusinessschool.com/

Listen: https://feeds.transistor.fm/the-operating-system-show

Be a guest: https://crm.frontrangesystems.com/discovery

Craig Wahl coaches CEOs and founders whose companies got bigger, faster than they expected. He runs Njorth, works as a fractional COO for tech companies, and is finishing his first book, The Walk.

His core reframe for CEOs: your job isn't to make all the decisions. It's to make sure they get made, by the right people, and that someone is accountable for them.

He learned most of it scaling a team fast. He chased A players and found a team of solid B and C players was just as strong. He watched long documented processes go unused and swapped them for simple checklists the team actually ran, then tracked everything and kept iterating.

## In this episode

- Why CEOs need a safe place to talk, and who they can't talk to inside the company

- Your job isn't to make the decisions, it's to make sure they get made

- What founders refuse to hand off, and what the CEO should be doing instead

- Why hiring only A players is a fool's errand when you're scaling

- The Sherpa on Everest: stop yelling down the mountain

- A process nobody follows isn't a process

- Trust is boring, and how leaders shortcut it

- The Walk, his practical guide to the long middle of leading people

- Why "use AI more" is one of the most dangerous things an executive can say

- The question to ask anyone selling you AI: have you ever run a business?

## Timestamps

00:00 The show open

00:30 Meet Craig Wahl

01:14 The three things Njorth does

02:20 You don't call an electrician for a leak

02:55 Why CEOs need a safe place to talk

06:30 Make sure the decisions get made

07:33 What founders refuse to hand off

08:55 The leadership triangle

10:25 Can anyone sell as well as the CEO?

12:45 What breaks when the team gets big

13:23 Why hiring only A players is a fool's errand

14:49 The Sherpa on Everest

17:25 A process nobody follows isn't a process

18:36 Simple checklists, track everything

20:45 Trust is boring

23:10 How leaders shortcut trust

25:06 The Walk

27:14 A master's in leadership and a junior manager

29:38 What do you want people to remember about you?

30:20 How he uses AI in his own business

32:25 Why "use AI more" is dangerous

34:24 Have you ever run a business?

35:10 The four zones of AI

35:46 What error rate will you accept from AI?

38:43 Ten salespeople, selling 80% of the time

39:36 Who should hire Craig

39:59 What's next for Njorth

40:39 Where to find Craig

## About Craig Wahl

Craig Wahl is a leadership architect and CEO advisor at Njorth. He coaches founders and CEOs, runs leadership alignment workshops, and works as a fractional COO, mostly for tech companies scaling from Series A to Series C. His first book, The Walk, comes out in spring 2027.

Website: https://njorth.ai

Listen: https://feeds.transistor.fm/the-operating-system-show

Be a guest: https://crm.frontrangesystems.com/discovery

Chris Mader was drafted by the Chicago White Sox, spent four years in the minors, then built a business career that ran all the way to chief revenue officer. Today he runs MTA Consultancy and implements EOS inside companies doing 10 to 50 million a year.

His company is named for the sign that hung over his college baseball coach's desk: Son, make the adjustment. The bad news, he tells owners, is that you are probably the problem in your business. The good news is that you are also the solution.

He runs EOS inside his own company too. Last year he hit every metric on his scorecard and still missed his revenue goal. So he took a hard look at the metric itself, doubled his weekly prospect conversations, and watched revenue climb.

## In this episode

- Why he runs EOS inside his own business, and what his scorecard told him when revenue fell short

- EOS as the way in, and why he teaches the team to run the weekly meeting without him

- Building your company as if you were selling it, even if you never will

- Revenue is vanity: profit, EBITDA, and the leverage of having the choice to sell

- The finance and technology seats most growing companies are missing, and when fractional beats full time

- Coach Mader AI, the digital twin he trained on thousands of his own coaching calls

- Do you want to be right, or do you want to win

- Who EOS is not for, and who should call him

## Timestamps

00:00 From the White Sox to EOS

01:08 Son, make the adjustment

02:45 You are the problem, and the solution

03:12 Inspirationally irritating

04:12 Running EOS inside his own business

04:57 Hit every metric, missed the revenue goal

06:44 EOS as a Trojan horse

08:43 Teaching the team to run it without him

09:55 Getting the founder out of the way

11:15 Build it like you will sell it, even if you won't

12:52 Revenue is vanity, profit is fuel

15:06 Buyers won't pay for a business that is you

16:46 The chef who wants one restaurant

18:36 Why finance and technology are the missing seats

20:23 Fractional or full time

21:47 Where fractional work is headed

23:45 Coach Mader AI, his digital twin

25:55 The four zones of AI

26:39 The one person who knows everything

28:27 Do you want to be right, or do you want to win

29:50 Who should not use EOS

31:06 Who is a great fit

31:51 What is next for MTA Consultancy

33:02 Where to find Chris

## About Chris Mader

Chris Mader is the founder of MTA Consultancy, an EOS implementer, executive coach, and the author of Make the Adjustment. A former professional baseball player, he spent more than a decade leading revenue teams in corporate America, rising to chief revenue officer, before starting his own firm. He works with founders who want to grow, scale, and eventually exit.

Website: https://www.mtaconsultancy.com

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/chrismadermta/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chrismadermta

Listen: https://feeds.transistor.fm/the-operating-system-show

Be a guest: https://crm.frontrangesystems.com/discovery

Derek Fredrickson left Wall Street in 2008 to run operations for his wife's coaching company, which she describes as having been built on toothpicks and band aids. Sixteen years later he runs The COO Solution, putting fractional COOs inside founder led companies between seven figures and twenty million.

His rule for all of it: you can't scale complexity, but you can scale simplicity. The work is making a business process driven instead of people driven, so the founder can stop white knuckling the day to day and move from the operator seat into the owner seat.

He is also living it himself. He runs every sales call for his own company from France, into a US market, and he knows exactly when that turns him into the bottleneck.

## In this episode

- Why he reads every business in the same order: marketing, sales, operations, then finance

- Where the fractional model fits, and why it spreads too thin above twenty million

- Done for you, then done with you, then done by the team, so the COO never holds the keys

- Drive by delegation, and the questions that make a founder sell themselves on their own idea

- What AI is actually doing for his clients right now: filling in the weekly scorecard nobody wanted to update

- Fixing the problem versus solving the issue that caused it

- Who should not hire a fractional COO, including the owner who could not picture it working remotely

- His ten year, three year, one year plan, and handing off his own sales seat

## Timestamps

00:00 A show for founders who are done being the bottleneck

01:03 Leaving Wall Street in 2008 for his wife's business

02:02 Toothpicks and band aids

03:22 Where fractional fits, seven figures to twenty million

05:15 Marketing, sales, operations, finance, in that order

07:30 You can't scale complexity

08:29 Process driven, not people driven

10:35 Three things on the menu

12:15 Where the founder still sits in the business

14:58 Letting go of the sales seat, including his own

16:58 Founders love the hunt and skip the fishing

18:28 Does the system survive after the COO leaves

20:46 Done for you, done with you, done by the team

23:23 Drive by delegation

24:35 Make the founder sell themselves on the idea

27:22 AI starts with the use case

28:52 The scorecard AI fills in for you

31:26 A dashboard nobody can hide from

32:42 Fix the problem or solve the issue behind it

33:40 Who should not hire a fractional COO

36:01 The owner who could not picture a remote COO

37:38 What is next for The COO Solution

39:28 Where to find Derek

## About Derek Fredrickson

Derek Fredrickson is the founder and CEO of The COO Solution, which places fractional COOs with founder led companies. He spent sixteen years as a second in command, first scaling his wife's business coaching company past seven figures, then as a fractional COO for other growing companies. He hosts The COO Solution Podcast.

Website and podcast: https://thecoosolution.com

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/derekfredrickson

Listen: https://feeds.transistor.fm/the-operating-system-show

Be a guest: https://crm.frontrangesystems.com/discovery

David Salerno built Solpak into one of Canada's most recognized packaging companies. Six hundred food sector clients across the country, on a team of sixteen people.

He did not get there by being efficient after the fact. He decided early that headcount was a vanity metric and ran the business that way for twenty years. Zapier for a decade, now Claude. The current policy at Solpak is that nobody gets hired unless the leadership team can make a business case for the hire over automating the work.

The moment it became visible to him was a banker sitting across from him for two hours. Numbers growing, obvious activity everywhere, and in two hours the phone never rang and nobody came to the door. The banker could not explain it. David could not either, until he tried, and what came out of that is the Sherpa Method he now coaches other owners through.

## In this episode

- Why he treated headcount as a vanity metric for twenty years, and what that bought him

- The banker who sat in his office for two hours and could not explain the quiet

- Three challenges, three steps each, and the twenty seven questions behind the Sherpa Method

- Why he thinks owners have a clarity problem rather than an effort problem

- Giving a single number to a single person, and the prefab roof problem that dissolved once someone owned it

- The hiring standard at Solpak: no new hire without a business case against automating the work

- Where AI does not belong, and the call he made to a friend's AI receptionist trying to trick it

- The retreat where a team member asked to stop answering the phone, and what it revealed

- Who should not try to build a self managed business

## Timestamps

00:00 A show for founders who are done being the bottleneck

01:04 Six hundred clients on a team of sixteen

01:30 Why he treated headcount as a vanity metric

02:05 The frameworks that hold the ratio together

02:56 Ten years of Zapier, and what comes next

03:39 The phase where David was the company

04:19 What he took from corporate, and what he refused to rebuild

05:23 The banker who could not explain the quiet office

06:40 Growth, sustainability, and everything after

07:27 What makes a discipline stick when a framework does not

08:00 Give the number to a person and watch what happens

09:12 The prefab roof, the five whys, and a problem that dissolved

10:55 Ninety seven percent would recommend, and the alignment behind it

12:48 The failure point he sees coaching owners

13:06 Founders do not have an effort problem

14:05 Three challenges, three steps, twenty seven questions

15:00 The mindset shift nobody gets to skip

15:55 Build the business as the product

16:30 Claude at Solpak, and no hire without a business case

18:03 The four zones of AI

19:35 Calling a friend's AI receptionist to try to trick it

22:23 The retreat where a team member asked to stop taking calls

23:37 Who should not build a self managed business

25:09 Buy Back Your Time, and the thousand dollar hour

25:54 Who the Sherpa Method is actually for

27:02 What is next for Solpak and Entrepreneur Sherpa

28:01 Where to find David

## About David Salerno

David Salerno founded Solpak, a Quebec based packaging company serving hundreds of food sector clients across Canada, and now works with it as a mentor and guide after selling part of the business to two partners. He wrote Built for Freedom and coaches owners through Entrepreneur Sherpa, built on three pillars, grow, sustain and serve. He is Vice Chairman of the Montreal Economic Institute.

Website and free first chapter: https://davidsalerno.com

Entrepreneur Sherpa: https://entrepreneursherpa.co

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidvsalerno/

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The Operating System Show is for founders who are done being the bottleneck in their own business. If you want to be a guest: https://crm.frontrangesystems.com/discovery

Every founder Kati Peterman meets says a version of the same sentence. I'm just not there yet.

Not there yet for a COO. Not there yet for a real operator. And she has come to believe that sentence almost never means what it sounds like it means. It is rarely about the money. It is that a visionary founder cannot picture what that person would actually do all day, so a big salary looks like a bet on a job description they cannot see.

Her answer is to go find the money first. Outstanding collections, billables, how clients pay and when, merchant services. Unglamorous operational leakage sitting there in almost every company. Fix that in the first weeks and the fractional executive has paid for herself, and the founder stops arguing about whether operations deserves funding.

## In this episode

- What fractional actually means now that the word has gone hot, and what it buys a company not ready for a full time hire

- I'm just not there yet, and why that sentence is usually about understanding rather than budget

- The quick win that funds the role, starting with money the business has already earned and not collected

- A better question than calling a founder a control freak: where does my founder have fear right now

- Placing the right person versus installing the system, and why the operator has to actually enjoy the work

- Education as the thing that makes a system stick after the operator leaves

- Where she refuses to let AI go, including refunds and cancellations, and why the sales conversation is burning leads

- Teams running at 120 to 140% capacity, and what it takes to get back to 70

- Who should not hire a fractional executive

## Timestamps

00:00 A show for founders who are done being the bottleneck

01:10 What fractional actually means, and why the word got hot

03:11 The first COO offer, and the gap she kept seeing

05:04 I'm just not there yet, and what founders really mean by it

08:05 Outstanding collections, billables, and money already on the table

09:10 Founders get a bad rap as control freaks

09:54 The better question: where does my founder have fear right now

14:41 Why the operator has to actually enjoy the work

16:59 Education is true empowerment, and what makes a system stick

23:12 Teams at 120 to 140% capacity, and getting back to 70

24:35 Zero AI in refunds and cancellations

26:08 The thing that is not up for debate: response time

28:50 Who should not hire a fractional executive

30:01 Why franchisee owners became the favorite client

31:40 Where to find Kati

## About Kati Peterman

Kati Peterman came up as a chief of staff and integrator inside seven and eight figure companies, then founded FRX, a national bench of fractional executives placed into small and mid sized businesses. She is also COO of Empire Operating System.

FRX: https://yourfrx.com

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katipeterman/

If your team is at 140% and hiring is not on the table, that is the conversation: https://crm.frontrangesystems.com/discovery