The Punch List

In this episode of The Punch List Podcast, Jon Wright, Kanav Hasija, and Tanmaya Kala break down CoreWeave’s $50 billion debt scare and what it signals for AI data center financing, why general contractors need to keep data center work below 40% of their backlog, and why last week’s housing price headlines are more complicated than they look.

The episode opens with the CoreWeave story: how data centers get financed through special purpose vehicles, why bond yields jumping from 12% to 16% spooked the market, and whether this is a warning sign or just a repricing of risk. From there, the conversation moves into how GCs and MEP subcontractors should think about diversifying their pipelines before the data center boom cools off, and closes with a market by market look at housing prices and affordability in the US.

What You’ll Hear

• How CoreWeave and other neo cloud developers finance data centers through special purpose vehicles and long term contracts
• Why CoreWeave’s bond yields jumped from 12% to 16%, and what that means for their $50 billion in debt
• The two ways companies fund compute: borrowing against contracts versus building on your own balance sheet, with examples from Zuckerberg, SpaceX, and AWS
• TK’s advice to GCs on the risk of signing with special purpose vehicles versus corporately financed projects
• Why mechanical and electrical subcontractors are in high demand, and why some are asking to become the prime contractor instead of the GC
• The “sugar rush” problem: why 40% of a GC’s work in data centers can mean 70% of their profit, and why that’s dangerous
• Kanav’s rule for diversification: keep data centers below 30 to 40% of backlog, and where to diversify into instead
• How data centers are pushing prefab construction forward, and why that could become their lasting legacy for the industry
• Why national housing price headlines are misleading, and what’s actually happening market by market
• US homeownership trends, the role of interest rates, and why John thinks housing is a stabilizing social function worth protecting

This Episode Is For You If You’ve Ever Asked

• Why did CoreWeave’s stock drop, and should that worry other data center builders?
• Is the AI data center boom a bubble?
• How much of a GC’s backlog should come from one market?
• Should GCs be worried about mechanical and electrical subs wanting to become the prime contractor?
• What should GCs diversify into if data center work slows down?
• Is prefab actually cheaper, or just faster?
• Why are national housing price headlines often wrong?
• Is homeownership in the US actually falling behind other developed countries?
• Is a house a good financial investment, or just a stabilizing one?

Connect with us:

Connect with Tanmaya Kala on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanmaya-kala-pe-3324a13/

Connect with Jon Wright on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonpwright/

Connect with Kanav Hasija on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kanavhasija/

Listen to the full podcast on:

• Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/033OOZ7K5P9aDTX8opEYUo?si=2efcf20614814e44
• Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-punch-list/id6790447693
• YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thepunchlistpod

Stay Connected With The Punch List :

• Website: https://thepunchlistpod.com/
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-punchlist-podcast/
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thepunchlistpod/
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thepunchlistpod/
• X: https://x.com/thepunchlistpod
  

In Episode 14 of The Punch List Podcast, Jon Wright, Kanav Hasija, and Tanmaya Kala take on Nvidia CEO Jensen Huang’s claim that data centers take three years to build in the US while China can build a hospital in a weekend. They break down why US construction moves so slowly, how some general contractors are already delivering data centers in 11 to 14 months, and why permits, fragmented contracting, and broken supply chains have become a national security issue.

The episode opens with TK’s story of how a limited engineering branch choice in India turned into a career in buildings, then moves into the speed problem, regulation, and the Tesla Roadster reveal. Three operators inside the AEC industry, talking about what it would actually take to build faster.

What You’ll Hear

• TK’s path from civil engineering in India to designing power plants, Stanford, and turning down software and McKinsey to stay in construction
• Why China builds faster: early BIM adoption, thousands of trained modelers, and prefab at scale
• How the US won World War II by out-producing everyone, and why that capacity still exists
• Kanav’s two root problems: too many companies with competing incentives, and a supply chain the US no longer controls
• How three large GCs delivered data centers in 11 to 14 months by controlling design and subcontractors
• The telemedicine story: software built in seven days once non-safety regulation was dropped
• Jon’s modular homes requiring 24 permits and inspections, and a city that demanded a truckload of printed data center plans
• The Tesla Roadster, Elon Musk’s push to build physical things, and the cost of working at that pace

This Episode Is For You If You’ve Ever Asked

• Why does it take three years to build a data center in the US?
• How does China build infrastructure so much faster?
• Is data center construction speed a national security issue?
• How are some general contractors building data centers in under a year?
• Does fragmented contracting slow down construction projects?
• How much of construction regulation is actually about life safety?
• Why do modular homes still need so many permits and inspections?
• What can the private sector do instead of waiting on government to fix permitting?
• What does the Tesla Roadster tell us about building ambitious physical products?

Connect with us:

Connect with Tanmaya Kala on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanmaya-kala-pe-3324a13/

Connect with Jon Wright on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonpwright/

Connect with Kanav Hasija on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kanavhasija/

Listen to the full podcast on:

• **Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/033OOZ7K5P9aDTX8opEYUo?si=2efcf20614814e44**
• **Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-punch-list/id6790447693**
• **YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thepunchlistpod**

Stay Connected With The Punch List :

• **Website: https://thepunchlistpod.com/**
• **LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-punchlist-podcast/**
• **Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thepunchlistpod/**
• **Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thepunchlistpod/**
• **X: https://x.com/thepunchlistpod**

In Episode 13 of The Punch List Podcast, Jon Wright, Kanav Hasija, and Tanmaya Kala break down the latest Census Bureau construction spending numbers and what they hide: data centers are carrying a market that is otherwise shrinking. They cover what that means for small and mid-size general contractors, why construction layoffs are at their lowest level since 2000, and whether Texas Governor Abbott's data center permit pause is real policy or election-season politics.

This episode starts with Jon's path from a small town in Kentucky to real estate development, then moves into the numbers. Three people who work inside the AEC industry, reading the data the way operators do.

What You'll Hear

• Jon's path from Kentucky, finance, and law school to working in a presidential administration, private equity, and 15 years in real estate development
• Why Jon thinks the best politicians come from other careers, and why he doesn't plan to run for office
• TK's walkthrough of the Census Bureau report: total construction spending down about 1.7% year over year
• Why data centers went from 10% of the office category in 2020 to roughly 60% today, about $85 billion of a $150 billion segment
• Why pulling data centers out of the numbers shows roughly 3.5% compression across the market
• Residential spending down about 5%, manufacturing down 19.2% from $211 billion to $170 billion, and multifamily nearly flat
• Why home improvement spending tends to rise when single family drops
• TK's case that small and mid-size GCs get squeezed as interest rates, supply chains, and tariffs hit them harder than the big players
• Why the top 400 contractors are gaining market share while total construction shrinks
• Why the craft labor ceiling hits small GCs even harder, and why backlog is how you hold on to your best foremen
• Construction layoffs falling about 46% year over year to the lowest level since 2000, and what that says about industry confidence
• The new trade schools training people for data center and fiber work
• What ABC's backlog data shows: about 8.5 months of work booked, with smaller project sizes up and projects over $100 million down
• Four moves for small and mid-size GCs: build your preconstruction team, partner with strong subcontractors, retain your people, and go slightly upmarket
• Jon's call on Governor Abbott's permit halt until ERCOT completes an audit: election signaling, and not likely to slow Texas data center development
• Why data centers have a messaging problem, and the Louisiana parish where data center tax revenue turned into bonuses for teachers and a comeback for the town
• Jon on a former uranium enrichment site in his hometown being repurposed for a data center, and why communities that want data centers should get them
• Why the AI buildout could be the catalyst for new power generation, and how China's power capacity growth compares

This Episode Is For You If You've Ever Asked

• Is the construction market really flat, or are data centers hiding the real picture?
• How much of nonresidential construction spending is actually data centers?
• Why is manufacturing and industrial construction dropping so fast?
• What does the data center boom mean for small and mid-size general contractors?
• Why are construction layoffs so low when the market is soft?
• How much does backlog matter, and what is a healthy backlog right now?
• What can a smaller GC do to compete when the big firms are busy with data centers?
• Is Texas actually pausing data center development?
• Why do communities push back on data centers, and what changes their minds?
• Can the AI buildout finally force the US to expand power generation?

Listen to the full podcast on:

• Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/033OOZ7K5P9aDTX8opEYUo?si=2efcf20614814e44
• Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-punch-list/id6790447693
• YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thepunchlistpod

Stay Connected With The Punch List :

• Website: https://thepunchlistpod.com/
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-punchlist-podcast/
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thepunchlistpod/
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thepunchlistpod/
• X: https://x.com/thepunchlistpod
  • (00:00) - Intro

In Episode 12 of The Punch List Podcast, Jon Wright, Kanav Hasija, and Tanmaya Kala cover three forces shaping construction and development right now: the Bay Area's AI-fueled comeback and the utility bottleneck holding projects back, why condos have nearly vanished from new construction in California, and how a fast-splitting market of AI agents is changing the day-to-day for project managers and developers.

This episode is an honest look at what is actually going on, with no filter. Three people who operate inside the AEC industry, not outside it, sharing what they see on the ground and the tools they actually use.

What You'll Hear

• Why the Bay Area went from "don't touch it with a ten foot pole" to the hottest market in the world, while Southern California faces more structural challenges
• Jon on utility interconnection taking 6 to 12 months, and why long switchgear lead times are back
• Kanav's math on AI IPOs: about $4.2 trillion in first-day value from 3,300 tech IPOs since 1980, against roughly $5.2 trillion from SpaceX, Anthropic, and OpenAI combined
• Why newly minted Bay Area wealth will push up luxury housing demand, and why regulators need to add supply now
• What Austin and Texas got right by building enough supply to keep prices in check
• TK's three-part condo problem: construction defect liability, insurance costs 3 to 4 times higher, and NIMBYism
• Jon on how condos went from almost 30% of California new construction starts to under 4% after SB 800 and its ten year liability tail
• Why Jon says 100% of new condo builds end up in litigation, and why moisture readings are a common trigger
• Buffy Wicks's condo liability reform bill that failed this year, and why it is coming back
• Why general contractors say pricing looks steady only because volume is low, and why you should underwrite a price increase when the boom hits
• Meta's new Muse personal AI assistant and how it stacks up against the other agents
• Kanav on the AI market splitting up: Claude for complex work, OpenAI's Astra for computer use, Grok Bot for cheap daily tasks, and Muse for consumers
• Why a small classifier model can sort invoices, support tickets, and cost codes about 100x cheaper and far faster than a large language model
• Why X is the best place to track AI, and how to ask your favorite model who to follow in construction and real estate
• TK on using Claude to compare estimates, contracts, and change orders across drawing iterations
• Kanav's steelman: employees showing up to offer letter conversations armed with AI-generated questions they don't fully understand
• Jon's picture of a project manager running bid leveling from a 45 minute commute with skill files and a mobile agent
• The story of a second-generation contractor who tried to vibe code his own bid leveling tool and got pointed to a finished product by Claude
• Jon on the family calendar agent and the two month minivan lease negotiation bot that beat the dealership
• Why AI is best at the mundane work, like coding invoices and checking subcontractor bills against contracts

This Episode Is For You If You've Ever Asked

• Why is the Bay Area market turning around while Southern California struggles?
• Why does utility interconnection take so long, and how do I plan around it?
• Will the AI boom push Bay Area housing prices even higher?
• Why won't developers build condos in California anymore?
• Should I underwrite higher construction pricing on projects starting now?
• Which AI model should I use for which task?
• Can AI actually compare estimates, contracts, and change orders for me?
• How can a project manager use AI agents to cut down the paperwork?
• Is it worth connecting an AI agent to my email and calendar?
• How do I stay current on AI without the noise?

Connect with us:

Connect with Tanmaya Kala on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanmaya-kala-pe-3324a13/

Connect with Jon Wright on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonpwright/

Connect with Kanav Hasija on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kanavhasija/

Listen to the full podcast on:

• Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/033OOZ7K5P9aDTX8opEYUo?si=2efcf20614814e44
• Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-punch-list/id6790447693
• YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thepunchlistpod

Stay Connected With The Punch List :

• Website: https://thepunchlistpod.com/
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-punchlist-podcast/
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thepunchlistpod/
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thepunchlistpod/
• X: https://x.com/thepunchlistpod

In Episode 11 of The Punch List Podcast, Jon Wright, Kanav Hasija, and Tanmaya Kala cover three forces reshaping construction and development right now: record copper prices driven by the AI data center build-out, the aging skilled trades workforce and who replaces it, and the promise versus reality of office-to-residential conversions.

This episode is an honest look at what is actually going on, with no filter. Three people who operate inside the AEC industry, not outside it, sharing what they see on the ground and what they think it means.

What You'll Hear

• Why copper jumped roughly 20% in a year, from about $5.50 to $6.60 per pound, and why copper futures climbing 36% means the market is already forward booking
• TK's case for shifting more wiring from copper to aluminum, and why a Canadian supply chain makes it a safer bet on escalation
• Why data center builders won't swap out copper even as prices climb, when a proven 10-month build plan beats a 24-month experiment
• Jon on contingency, padding, and why forward contracts and options hedges are rarely used outside the largest developers
• How owners push material risk onto subcontractors with 60 and 90 day signing windows
• TK's argument that domestic copper sitting in the ground in Nevada, stuck in environmental review, may be the real long-term play
• Why a generation was told the trades were a step down, and how that decision is catching up with the industry today
• Kanav's comparison: a starting lawyer and a union electrician can both earn around $150K, but one carries $150K in debt and the other about $10K
• Why the hosts believe AI will come for white collar jobs long before it comes for the electrician
• Jon's take on the boomer retirement wave as a business acquisition opportunity for millennials and Gen Z already working in the trades
• Why TK leans on a strong superintendent in preconstruction, and why "just ask Claude" can't replace someone who has actually installed the work
• McKinsey's projection of roughly $200 trillion in global construction demand through 2040 against about $160 trillion in labor capacity, a 20% gap
• Why San Francisco office buildings have sold at up to 70% discounts, and why converting to biotech labs was a smarter play than residential
• Jon breaking down the four hurdles to office conversion: debt and "extend and pretend," the buyer-seller standoff, physical design, and zoning
• Why side-core buildings are the ones that actually work for conversion, and why most successful projects are likely subsidized
• TK on plumbing, hidden conditions behind every wall, and mandatory code upgrades that make conversion costs unpredictable
• Why California hospitals facing a 2030 code deadline are being torn down and rebuilt instead of repurposed
• National office vacancy rising from about 16% to 20%, with Boston now leading Class A office construction and the Bay Area at the bottom
• Jon on why workers will return to new, well-designed offices but not to "their father's office"
• Kanav's theory on why New York is the most capitalistic city in the world, and what mixed-use planning gets right
• How long commutes connect the trades shortage to the housing problem, and the case for factory-built construction

This Episode Is For You If You've Ever Asked

• How is the AI data center boom affecting material costs on my projects?
• Should I be hedging copper, or just padding my contingency?
• Is aluminum wiring a realistic alternative to copper in commercial buildings?
• Who is going to replace the retiring skilled trades workforce?
• Is a career in the trades now a better deal than a college degree?
• Is there an opportunity to buy a trades business as owners retire?
• Why aren't more empty office buildings being converted into housing?
• Is it cheaper to convert an old building or tear it down and start over?

Connect with us:

Connect with Tanmaya Kala on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanmaya-kala-pe-3324a13/

Connect with Jon Wright on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonpwright/

Connect with Kanav Hasija on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kanavhasija/

Listen to the full podcast on:

• **Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/033OOZ7K5P9aDTX8opEYUo?si=2efcf20614814e44
• **Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-punch-list/id6790447693
• **YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thepunchlistpod

Stay Connected With The Punch List :

• Website: https://thepunchlistpod.com/
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-punchlist-podcast/
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thepunchlistpod/
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thepunchlistpod/
• X: https://x.com/thepunchlistpod
  • (00:00) - Intro

In Episode 10 of The Punch List Podcast, Jon Wright, Kanav Hasija, and Tanmaya Kala cover three things happening in the real world of construction and development right now: the Dubai construction boom, the uncertainty around interest rates and bond markets, and the AI regulation debate that took over the industry conversation over the weekend.

This episode is an honest look at what is actually going on, with no filter. Three people who operate inside the AEC industry, not outside it, sharing what they see on the ground and what they think it means.

What You'll Hear

• Why Dubai's residential market shrugged off the war while hospitality fell from 85% occupancy to single digits overnight
• How GCs in Dubai are self-performing all trades and what that vertical integration model means for quality, margins, and the future of specialization
• Why Sobha Realty, an $8 billion fully vertically integrated developer, is widely considered to produce the best finished product in the region
• TK's theory on why immature markets trend toward vertical integration and whether fragmentation eventually comes back
• Why cost estimates in Dubai routinely come in 50% below final cost and what that says about where the market is in its maturity
• Jon breaking down the difference between the Fed short rate and the bond market long rate, and why most people have it wrong
• Why construction loan costs, steel prices, diesel, and copper are all moving in the same direction at the same time
• How AI data center construction is adding borrowing pressure to the broader bond market and what that means for the long rate
• Kanav's controversial read on why Dario Amodei, Sam Altman, and Elon Musk all agreed publicly in the same weekend to slow down AI development
• Why Kanav, as an Anthropic investor, still thinks the slowdown call is more about IPO narrative than genuine risk
• The actual facts behind the Hugging Face hacking incident, what OpenAI confirmed, what Hugging Face confirmed, and what nobody knows yet because the prompt logs have not been released
• Why Kanav says the 2024 AI blackmail story falls apart once you know it took 38 rounds of prompting to get there
• TK's argument that we are already building physical infrastructure AI could eventually exploit, and why regulation now matters more than regulation later
• Jon on regulatory capture: what it means, whether it applies here, and why he still wants the labs to show us the data
• Kanav's simpler fix for the rogue nation threat: stop selling Claude outside the US. No Washington hearing required.
• Why anyone designing, building, or supplying data centers needs to pay attention to where this AI regulation debate lands

This Episode Is For You If You've Ever Asked

• Why is Dubai building so fast with 20-year-old technology?
• What is actually happening with interest rates and why is the long rate going up even when the Fed cuts?
• Is the AI slowdown call from Anthropic, OpenAI, and Google genuine or is there something else going on?
• What really happened with the Hugging Face hacking incident and should I be worried about it?
• How do I think about AI risk as someone who builds physical things?
• If there is a regulation pause on AI, what does that mean for data center construction in the near term?

The conversation this weekend around AI was loud. But the loudest voices in the room are also the ones with IPOs on the street and capital needs to meet. That matters.

Meanwhile, the bond market is doing something real, Dubai is building towers faster than anyone thought possible with technology you would not recognize as modern, and the construction industry is sitting at the intersection of all of it.

Connect with us:

[LinkedIn / Website, if applicable]

Connect with Tanmaya Kala on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanmaya-kala-pe-3324a13/

Connect with Jon Wright on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonpwright/

Connect with Kanav Hasija on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kanavhasija/

Listen to the full podcast on:

• **Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/033OOZ7K5P9aDTX8opEYUo?si=2efcf20614814e44**
• **Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-punch-list/id6790447693**
• **YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thepunchlistpod**

Stay Connected With The Punch List :

• **Website: https://thepunchlistpod.com/**
• **LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-punchlist-podcast/**
• **Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thepunchlistpod/**
• **Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thepunchlistpod/**
• **X: https://x.com/thepunchlistpod**
  • (00:00) - Intro

In this episode of The Punchlist Podcast, Jon Wright, Kanav Hasija, and Tanmaya Kala take an honest look at what's actually happening with AI in the architecture, engineering, and construction industry right now. Drawing from their experience as founders, developers, and operators inside the industry, they walk through the real state of AI adoption, why most demos fail, and what firms should actually be doing to prepare.

This episode is an invitation to cut through the noise, get practical about how you evaluate AI tools, and understand where the real gains are coming from and where they aren't yet.

What You'll Hear

• Why construction and engineering firms are experiencing AI demo burnout and what's actually causing it
• How unfinished AI products are burning out the market and creating a false belief that AI doesn't work
• Why construction is one of the most complex human endeavors and why most AI startups underestimate it
• Kanav's two-day vendor test that replaces four months of painful evaluation
• The three things every AEC firm should do right now without a big budget
• Why organizing your own data is the most future-proof move you can make today
• Jon's argument for why documenting your firm's knowledge and processes is the highest-leverage action right now
• TK's process-first framework and why letting tools drive your process is dangerous
• Why the S&P 500 net margins and sales growth are going down when you strip out AI producers
• Where small, AI-native businesses are actually seeing real gains including skipping hires and moving faster on revenue
• Kanav's honest read on the AI hype cycle even as an Anthropic investor
• Why a correction is coming and what to do with your balance sheet before it hits

This Episode Is For You If You've Ever Asked

• Why do the AI demos always look great but fail on our actual data?
• What should we actually be doing right now without a massive budget?
• Are other businesses really seeing dollar gains from AI or is it just talk?
• How do I evaluate an AI vendor without burning four months on it?
• Where is AI genuinely useful in construction and where is it not?
• Is the AI hype cycle real and are we at the top of it?
• What happens to my business if there's a correction in the next two years?
• AI in construction isn't about buying the next shiny tool. It's about understanding the technology well enough to know where it helps, building the internal systems to evaluate it fast, and organizing your data so you're ready when the real gains arrive. The firms that do that work now will be the ones that benefit most when the hype settles and the real era of AI adoption begins.
• You don't have to overhaul everything at once. Start by swimming in the technology yourself. Start by building one tough test. Start by cleaning up your data.

Connect with us:

Connect with Tanmaya Kala on LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanmaya-kala-pe-3324a13/

Connect with Jon Wright on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonpwright/

Connect with Kanav Hasija on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kanavhasija/

Listen to the full podcast on:

• Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/033OOZ7K5P9aDTX8opEYUo?si=2efcf20614814e44 
• Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-punch-list/id6790447693
• YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thepunchlistpod
  
  

Stay Connected With The Punch List : 

• Website: https://thepunchlistpod.com/
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-punchlist-podcast/
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thepunchlistpod/
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thepunchlistpod/
• X: https://x.com/thepunchlistpod

• (00:00) - Trailer

Eric Lamb spent 45 years in construction. For 35 of them he sat on the founding management committee of DPR Construction, helping take it from a startup to a top-ten general contractor doing $14 billion a year. He's blunt about why an industry that can deliver an AI data center on an impossible schedule still crawls everywhere else, and the answer isn't permitting, labor, or technology.

He joins Jon Wright, Kanav Hasija, and Tanmaya Kala to answer an uncomfortable question. If this industry can deliver an AI data center on a schedule no one thought possible, why does everything else still crawl? Eric's answer isn't permitting, labor, or technology. It's trust.

He also walks through the investment DPR passed on in 2012, PlanGrid, which Autodesk later bought for $875 million, and the two lessons he took from it. Plus why AI in construction still needs a human sitting next to the field, and the one culture change he'd make at any contracting firm trying to grow.

Guest: Eric Lamb, DPR Construction / WND Ventures / Blackhorn Ventures — linkedin.com/in/eric-lamb-084916

Topics Covered

• Why data centers get built fast and everything else doesn't
• The $875M investment DPR passed on, and the two lessons from it
• What AI in construction still can't do without a human in the field
• The culture change worth more than any software purchase

Chapters
(00:00) Introduction
(02:17) What the D, the P, and the R stand for
(04:15) The decision that mattered most and the values behind it
(09:47) Building data centers in the 1980s
(15:29) Are we creating our own bottlenecks?
(17:19) The filter for construction tech investing
(18:47) The PlanGrid pass and the $875M lesson
(22:10) What GCs need that the market isn't building
(24:38) Why margins are a thousand small mistakes avoided
(30:04) The boardroom and operator divide on AI
(33:35) Building DPR's estimating database in 1991
(37:58) Advice for executives growing a contracting business

Connect with us:

• Connect with Tanmaya Kala on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanmaya-kala-pe-3324a13/
• Connect with Jon Wright on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonpwright/
• Connect with Kanav Hasija on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kanavhasija/

NASA is planning a permanent Moon base by the 2030s, and building it means solving problems no construction team on Earth has ever faced: zero atmosphere, moonquakes, temperature swings that would destroy anything we build here, and the brutal economics of shipping every material 240,000 miles. Jon, TK, and Kanav sit down with Kenny Cheung, a research scientist at NASA Ames and principal investigator on the ARMADAS project, to break down how NASA is thinking about foundational infrastructure, materials strategy, and robotics for lunar construction, and where that thinking eventually shows up back on Earth's job sites. From mining moon ice for rocket fuel to a "ship it vs. make it" materials framework to the case for modular, LEGO-like construction systems, this is a look at what it actually takes to build off-world.

Guest: Kenny Cheung, NASA Ames Research Center — linkedin.com/in/kennethccheung

Topics Covered

• Foundational infrastructure in an environment with no atmosphere
• Ship it vs. make it: NASA's materials strategy
• The economics of building on the Moon
• Where lunar construction tech lands on Earth first

Chapters
(00:00) Introduction
(02:19) Why NASA needs a permanent Moon base
(05:36) Foundational infrastructure and the lunar environment
(07:04) Moonquakes, building codes, and lunar permitting
(08:14) Mining moon ice for water, oxygen, and fuel
(10:12) Ship it or make it: NASA's materials strategy
(11:42) Structural materials, radiation shielding, and the economics of building on the Moon
(14:46) Robotics, coordination, and construction sequencing
(21:14) Where this technology lands on Earth first
(25:35) Staying up to date on Lunar research

Something strange is happening in real estate right now. The same AI reshaping how we work is also reshaping where we work, and who can afford to live nearby.

This week Jon, Kanav, and TK look at why office space is suddenly in demand again, why product development is now moving faster than marketing teams can keep up, and why San Francisco's housing market has flipped from pandemic ghost town to the most competitive market in the country, largely on the back of AI salaries and secondary stock sales. Then the conversation turns to Seattle's tech layoffs, the current state of capital markets for real estate investors, and a sharp pullback in foreign buyers' purchases of US property.

The Punch List brings together a developer, a founder, and a general contractor every week to debate what's actually moving the AEC and real estate industries, rather than just repeating the headlines.

Topics covered

• The case for in-person collaboration over remote work
• Seattle's tech layoffs versus San Francisco's AI-fueled real estate boom
• How AI salaries and secondary stock sales are reshaping Bay Area home prices
• Why foreign buyers are pulling back from the US real estate market

Timestamps
 (00:00) Introduction
 (01:19) Kanav's update from Bangalore and the return to office
 (01:48) Why office space is in demand again
 (02:58) The case for in-person productivity over remote work
 (07:43) Why AI means you shouldn't become "a markdown file"
 (10:05) Building products faster than we can market them
 (10:57) A tale of two cities: Seattle versus San Francisco
 (14:39) How AI wealth is reshaping San Francisco real estate
 (17:26) Private credit, capital allocators, and real estate investing right now
 (24:03) Why foreign buyers are pulling back from US real estate

Connect with us:

• Connect with Tanmaya Kala on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanmaya-kala-pe-3324a13/
• Connect with Jon Wright on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonpwright/
• Connect with Kanav Hasija on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kanavhasija/

Resources:

• CRE and office leases are back: Office vacancies had a sharp decline - https://www.facilitiesdive.com/news/office-vacancies-drop-sharply-in-q2-as-organizations-seek-space-cbre/826949/
• CREs are top investor picks - https://finance.yahoo.com/real-estate/articles/cre-surges-back-top-investor-162724040.html
• Decline in foreigners' buying real estate in US - https://www.cnbc.com/2026/08/04/foreign-buyers-us-properties.html 
• Tale of two cities: Housing in Seattle dropped due to layoff - https://www.geekwire.com/2026/home-sales-slump-in-seattle-among-nations-worst-as-high-costs-and-tech-layoffs-inject-fear-into-market/
• San Francisco is rising like anything - https://finance.yahoo.com/markets/stocks/articles/san-francisco-homebuyers-officially-lost-082301561.html