Jamie and Martin return to discuss 'shadow work' a term now popular referring to the need for genuine transformation of consciousness through integration of the hidden or repressed contents of the unconscious in order to bring about wholeness of the personality.

This podcast looks at correlations between this psychological work and the work of Zen students linked to the Ten Bull Herding pictures, a popular simile for the Zen training.

Jamie Shavdia is a clinical hypnotherapist and musician who can be found at www.jamieshavdia.co.uk

Martin Goodson is a Zen teacher and co-founder of The Zen Gateway which can be found at www.thezengateway.com