Talib interviews Jonathan Wilson, one of the preeminent football writers of our time. His new book, The Power and the Glory, is the definitive history of the World Cup. Each chapter is dedicated to the 22 tournaments that have gone before, from Uruguay 1930 to Qatar 2022. Wilson is unrivaled in his ability to set up political and economic context, show the soccer stakes, and weave through compelling and funny anecdotes.

The discussion is about the 2026 World Cup—and the issues explored on this newsletter and podcast—through a lens of historical parallels and precedents. They get into everything from Mussolini to the Falklands War, and OJ Simpson to Christian Pulisic. Wilson reveals one of his favorite World Cup memories, on a night train in Russia. And he explains why this tournament has the potential to be a goals-galore thriller… or a sterile dud.

00:00 Intro

04:01 FIFA and Government Interactions

05:56 Immigration and the World Cup

08:59 Diversity and US Soccer

11:49 Geopolitical Tensions in World Cup History

15:14 World Leaders and the World Cup

19.05 Protests, Flags, and Israel/Palestine

22.12 Game Relocation and Fan Impact

25:53 Security Concerns at World Cups

27:48 Expansive Geography and Multiple Co-Hosts

30:40 Comparison to USA ’94

37:13 Expectations on the Pitch for 2026

40.22 Hosts that Have Overcome Doubt

42.54 Favorite World Cup Memory

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