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US Intervention Undermines Haitian Stability
Joining us to delve into the details on Haiti and so much more, our guest this week is Dr Jemima Pierre, professor at the Institute for the Study of Gender, race, sexuality and Social Justice at the University of British Columbia in Vancouver, Canada.
You can find me and the show on social media by searching the handle @DrWilmerLeon on X (Twitter), Instagram, and YouTube.
Our Facebook page is www.facebook.com/Drwilmerleonctd
All our episodes can be found at CTDpodcast.com.
TRANSCRIPT:
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Connecting the dots with Dr. Wilmer Leon, where the analysis of politics, culture, and history converge.
Dr Wilmer Leon (00:48):
Welcome to the Connecting the Dots podcast with Dr. Wilmer Leon. I'm Wilmer Leon. Here's the point. We have a tendency to view current events as though they occur in a vacuum, failing to understand the broader historical context in which most events take place. During each episode of this podcast, my guests and I will have probing, provocative, and in-depth discussions that connect the dots between current events and the broader historical context in which the events occur. This will enable you to better understand and analyze the events that are impacting the global village in which we live on today's episode. The question before us is why is the United States working to reinve and colonize Haiti? My guest is a professor at the Institute for the Study of Gender, race, sexuality and Social Justice at the University of British Columbia in Vancouver, Canada. She's a member of the Black Alliance for Peace and an editor of the Black Agenda Review segment of the Black Agenda Report. And she's the author of a very, very substantive piece, Haiti as Empire's Laboratory, Dr. Jamima Pierre. Dr. Pierre, welcome to the show and let's connect some dots.
Dr Jemima Pierre (02:12):
Thank you so much for having me. It's a pleasure to be here.
Dr Wilmer Leon (02:15):
You write in your piece that the Global Fragility Act presents new strategies for deploying us hard and soft power in a changing world. It focuses US foreign policy on the idea that there are so-called fragile states, countries prone to instability, extremism, conflict, and extreme poverty, which are presumably threats to US security. Explain first, what is the Global Fragility Act and why should Americans, not to mention its victims, be so concerned about it?
Dr Jemima Pierre (02:52):
Yes, so the Global Fragilities Act was actually presented in 2019, I think under Donald Trump, and then was ratified under the Biden administration. And it really is a way to be brand new as foreign policy. And I don't know if your listeners know about the Monroe Doctrine, which the US passed about a hundred years ago, which basically said that the US had access that no one can encroach in US' influence in the Western Hemisphere. And through the Monroe Doctrine, the US was able to assert its influence, occupy invade nations whenever it deemed necessary, and got away with it for a hundred years. And so the upheaval that we've seen throughout Latin America, the regime changes, the support for support for military dictatorships and so on and so forth has occurred through the Monroe Doctrine. But the Global Fragility Act was really brought by the conservative think tank, the US Peace Institute, which is actually misnamed as far as I'm concerned.
(04:10)
But it was really a way to look at US foreign policy in a different light or to rebrand it. And what I mean by rebrand is that to basically come together to make it seem like the US was not doing what it was doing, and it was basically bringing together the work of the Department of Defense, the Department of the State, and the U-S-A-I-D. So linking together aid defense as well as political state department moves. And the idea was basically an opportunity to change the way that the US did business to using local partners by not necessarily doing the dirty work of putting boots on the ground if it needed to invade a place. But it was really trying to figure out how to actually change the internal politics of a place to really prevent adversary. And they say in the ACT adversaries such as China and Russia from expanding their influence in this way, they use civil society, they use military, and then they use, so-called diplomacy bringing together.
(05:19)
But what's key to this, they also use local regional partners such as other states, other formations such as the Caribbean community and so on and so forth to actually assert US power. And so what's interesting about the Global Fragilities Act is that it was passed by Trump, but ratified under Biden and then was implemented. And at first they said they were going to focus on a set of countries, which Haiti being the very first. So what it is, so it's Haiti first and then Libya, Mozambique, Papua New Guinea, along with they call the coastal countries of West Africa. What's fascinating about this order is that Haiti and Libya are the states, two of the states besides Iraq that are probably most destroyed by the US and its allies. And it is going under the guise that these people are, that these states are so fragile, they're a mess, they're full of corruption and so on and so forth without really talking about the underlying problem, which is these states are fragile because of us constant interventions and us creating instability in this state. So I'll stop there to just give as a short background,
Dr Wilmer Leon (06:42):
One of the things that popped in my mind when you said Haiti and then you said Libya, one of the common threads between the two are the Clintons, because if I remember my history correctly, it was then Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton that convinced then President Obama, then President Barack Obama to invade Libya and assassinate more Mark dfi. And we know that Hillary Clinton, again, was very much involved in the destabilization, the most recent destabilization of Haiti.
Dr Jemima Pierre (07:21):
Oh, definitely. Well, the Clintons, they've got dirt all over them. I mean, when it comes to Haiti, the Clintons, I have a piece that I wrote a long time ago, about 11 years ago. I say the Clintons are omnipotent, omni, the present, they're everywhere. And so we have to think about what Bill Clinton did by killing Haiti's rice production facility by dumping the rise of his Arkansas farmers into Haiti and destroying Haiti's rise economy. So we have to think about what he did when he was president, but they've been dealing with Haiti for a long time. And we have to think also about after the earthquake where Obama put Clinton and Georgia re bush in charge of Haiti eight. And the people that benefited the most from the earthquake that killed 300,000 Haitians was the Clinton Foundation, which raised tons of money. And Haiti saw nothing except for these fancy hotels that they're making profits off.
(08:17)
So there's that. But what's most important is in 2011 during the So-called Arab Spring, Hillary Clinton flew to Haiti and changed the election results that actually put in power, the current political, so-called political party that's there now, Michelle Marli, who actually was just named in the UN report as one of the biggest funders for gangs in Haiti, who's also the president, the former president, right? And so they forced Haiti to have elections, right, eight months after an earthquake that destabilized the whole country where about a million people were still living in tents outside, but they forced these elections because this is how they could control Haiti. And when their favorite candidate, Martin Lee did not make the first round, they decided that they're going to force that. So Hillary Clinton flew into Haiti and threatened the sitting president would exile if he did not allow the change to the ballots to make this guy who did not make the first round president. And everything has been bad since then.
Dr Wilmer Leon (09:24):
You mentioned Bill Clinton decimating the domestic Haitian rice production in his book, the Choice Sam yet talks about the tie of rice to the start of the Vietnam War and how many people don't discuss one of the major motivating factors for the United States to go into Indo-China had to do with protecting American rice interest because they didn't want Asian rice flooding the market. And then that also made me think about nafta. And what NAFTA did to the domestic corn production in Mexico decimated the production of Mexican corn, which then decimated the livelihoods for Mexican farmers, which has contributed to immigration of Mexicans into the United States. So again, the show is called Connecting the Dots. And so any thoughts on that?
Dr Jemima Pierre (10:25):
Well, definitely I think, I don't even remember where I saw that recently that rice farmers, is it Rice? Rice producers were looking forward to having access back again to Haiti's market once this military invasion happened. And so there's a lot of things to think about under Reagan. Haiti, the Haitian government was forced to kill its local pigs, the black pigs, I don't know if people have heard about this, but you can look up Haiti black pigs. Black pigs are indigenous to that region. And Haiti was told that the pigs had some disease and they had to basically kill the entire population of black pigs on the island in order. And then they were replaced by the white pigs from the south of the US and pigs who are from the US not are not used to the climate in the Caribbean. So then they required very specific kinds of feeding food to eat.
(11:30)
And so those had to be imported. So that decimated the Haitian economy. So there's a way that you can see all these connected. The other thing is I don't think people always ask, well, you're making a big deal about Haiti. Haiti's not that important. Why would the US spend so much time and energy trying to destabilize Haiti? And then you realize then you have to ask these people, well, why is the fourth largest US embassy in the world in Haiti? If Haiti was not so important, why did the US feel that they have to do it? And why? Despite everything going on this week, despite the fact that you have the genocidal Zionist state killing thousands of Palestinians, they forced the UN to have a meeting about this intervention in Haiti over gangs, right? Supposedly over gangs. So that tells you there's something in there because Haiti actually becomes a big manufacturing hub for the us. And so I think a lot of us have been saying as the us, as the US moves towards a war with China, they will need a replacement of their manufacturing hubs. And Haiti already within 11 million strong population Haiti already provides is a space for a large manufacturing hub already. So as they lose Asia, they're going to rely more on Haiti. And so we have to think about that in terms of the economics of that as well as the politics, which we can get into later on as we speak more.
Dr Wilmer Leon (13:01):
You write in your piece in April of 22, the Biden Harris administration affirmed its commitment to the Global Fragilities Act by outlining a strategy for its implementation as detailed in the strategies prologue, the US government's new foreign policy approach depends on willing partners to address common challenges and share costs. Ultimately, the document continues. No US or international intervention will be successful without the buy-in and mutual ownership of trusted regional, national and local partners. And you touched on that in your open, but I think it's very important for people to really understand. That's really nice flowerly language, but it's not innocuous. That is a very nice way of saying that the United States is going to use organizations, indigenous organizations in order to promote American interests.
Dr Jemima Pierre (14:15):
Oh, definitely. Not just indigenous organizations, local states. I mean the recent upcoming invasion, military invasion of Haiti supposedly over gangs is actually being led supposedly by Kenya. And so all of a sudden you're asking yourself, Kenya's, all the way across the world on the east side of the African continent, what does Kenya have to do with Haiti? Well, before Kenya, the US tried to use Racom, which is a community of Caribbean states and nations. And that didn't work as well before them. They tried to get clac, which is the central and Latin American communities to lead in the invasion. Before them, they tried to get Brazil. So before them, they tried to get Canada to lead the invasion. And before that they tried to get Brazil to lead the invasion. The thing is to not have boots on the ground, as we've seen in the US in Ukraine, for example.
(15:14)
The point is to use other, so-called stakeholders, get other people to do the dirty work of US intervention and foreign policy and to get buy-in. And the reason I say Haiti's a laboratory, this is not the first time this is happening. And in the piece I outlined the Canada, France and US back Kuta that happened in Haiti in 2004, where the US and France, who our membership in the security council, they were behind the Kuta in 2004, immediately after the US Marines landed, took our president, put him on a plane and flew him to Africa. You had French Canadian and US soldiers there, but these two UN security council members were able to use their position to call an emergency security council meeting to push for a multinational. So-called stabilization force in Haiti. So to me, the UN is bankrupt with this security council in this particular sense.
(16:23)
So these people were able to use that, and then they convinced the UN that Haiti needed a chapter seven deployment. And chapter seven deployment is only for countries that are at war with other, there's a civil war. There was no civil war in Haiti, but they managed to convince the un. So then what they ended up doing was sending, getting a un, so-called peacekeeping mission to Haiti in a country that was not at civil war. But what it meant that was that you can have up to 50 to 60 nations participate in an occupation of Haiti. And that's what ended up happening. Brazil led that meeting and you had people from all over the world, police and military from all over the world occupying Haiti on behalf of the US under the guise of providing civility. That group stayed there from 2004 to 2017 when they drew down and brought back a smaller force.
(17:15)
But so Haiti is still under un occupation. And this is what this amazing law scholar, and I'm forgetting her name, I think it's China Mayville calls multilateralism as terror because the new, and this is what the Global Fragility Act, and that's why Haiti's always a laboratory is because you use Haiti. They tried it on Haiti and it worked. In fact, the WikiLeaks paper said the Minister peacekeeping mission in Haiti the cheapest was a foreign policy bonanza for the US because it was so cheap they can use the UN and then they can use all the local Latin America countries to do the dirty work. And so it's just really important to think about that and to think about how they're going to move forward from that on. And now the other thing to talk about aid is that they've already established a second phase of the Global Fragilities Act in the summer, and they're saying they're going fund, they're going to fund 260, so-called civil society NGOs on the ground in order to basically shape policy in Haiti as they leave for elections. So the plan is to actually take over the political structure of Haiti using the guise of civil society and Haitian solutions.
Dr Wilmer Leon (18:32):
So to that point, what this results in and what the Global Fragilities Act does is it takes the Department of State and it combines the Department of State and the Pentagon. And it's using, as you said in your piece, the hard power is the Pentagon. The soft power is the Department of State and under the pretext or pretense of bringing stability to the country, that enables the United States to go in with the military and engage in regime change and engage in control of the domestic space, but leaving out the fact that the reason the country is unstable in the first place is because of American policy in the country.
Dr Jemima Pierre (19:34):
Oh, definitely. And that's one of the key things we have to remember is this 2004 coup deta is a coup deta where Canada Friends and the US got together in Ottawa and Canada in 2003 and decided they needed to get rid of our elected democratically elected president. And then they follow through with this coup deta. And then it was given a go ahead by the UN because they run the security council and the other states on the permanent council also need to be held accountable because they sat quietly and let the US and France run this right the same way they did with Libya allowing a no fly zone of Libya. And so Haiti has been under occupation since 2004. And so at the beginning of the coup DTA in 2004, Haiti had about 7,000 elected officials. As of today, Haiti has zero elected officials, the US and the UN through the core group, which is a group of unelected non Haitian officials from the European Union, the organization of American states that meet that.
(20:40)
So-called court that meet to make plans for Haiti. They're the ones that have been running Haiti since 2004. So if there's a problem in Haiti, if there hasn't been any elections where we have no regional elections, no local elections, no presidential elections, it's because they have allowed that if there are guns in the country, because Haiti does not manufacture guns, it's because, and the guns are coming from the us, it's because they control what comes in and out of Haiti. They know who it is. In fact, the UN put out a report just last week stating explicitly that the former president that Hillary Clinton installed actually was funding two major gangs in Haiti to go after his enemies and to wreak havoc in the neighborhoods. And so all this tells me that everything that's happened in the last 19 years has been why Haiti is under occupation. And what they want to do is wreak havoc. And I don't know if people know this, the US has been trying to get an intervention force in Haiti for two years since the assassination of the president. And I have to say, as an aside, the
Dr Wilmer Leon (21:46):
Assassination was that Ju Moiz the
Dr Jemima Pierre (21:47):
Assassination, Jon Moiz, right? I have to put that an aside, that assassination happened about a month after Moiz came back from Russia trying to establish relationships with Russia. And I have to, this is an important piece that I think matters. And that was the first time Haiti was trying to establish relations with Russia. So part of that is because Haitians were protesting against intervention from the very beginning. They were always in the streets. And people forget that Haitians have been protesting against us, meddling for the longest times from 2018 19, in 2020, there were millions of Haitians on the street protesting to get rid of this public government that the US had installed and so on. People were protesting over and over again, and the US could not get this passed. And I don't know if you realize it. And then so all of a sudden, this gang problem emerges and it seems out of hand because the amount of guns entering the country the past two years has been unprecedented. And they're dumping guns and ammunition into the country. The guns are coming directly from Haiti. So they're fomenting this idea that there's this gun
Dr Wilmer Leon (22:58):
Coming directly to Haiti,
Dr Jemima Pierre (22:59):
To Haiti through the ports that are owned by the elite, the ports that are owned by the elite, the Haitian oligarchy that a couple of 'em have been named in the UN report just last week, that they need to be sanctioned. The US hasn't sanctioned any of them. They have not followed through the embargo that the Chinese government said that they should put. So they basically created, exacerbated the gang problem. That's what I should say. They exacerbated the gang problem. So then every news media you see about Haiti the past year has been about gangs, not about the fact that Haitians were protesting the fact that this illegitimate government signed this deal with the IMF to remove fuel subsidies and made life extremely expensive for Haiti, or the fact that the people were protesting this prime minister that was installed by the US in the core group. And so we forget that people are protesting against US Empire protesting against a defacto government that they didn't elect, and now we're only focusing on gangs. And it's easy to do that because they can manufacture that consent because they can control everything that's going on Haiti. So then they create the basket case, and then they come in and they say, well, we have to fix this problem because they need help.
Dr Wilmer Leon (24:10):
What is the average daily income for a Haitian?
Dr Jemima Pierre (24:15):
Oh, I haven't checked that in a while, but it's under three us. I think it's under five US dollars per day.
Dr Wilmer Leon (24:21):
Okay. Okay. $5 a day under.
(24:24)
Well, let's just for simple math, $5 a day, seven days a week, $35 a week, okay. A Beretta 40 caliber handgun costs about $600, a heckler and cock, 40 caliber handgun. It's about $800. An AR 15 style rifle is about $1,200. How does a person making $35 a week and that's on the high side afford a $600 handgun, a $1,200 assault rifle, assault style rifle, unless they're being supplemented, supplemented in quotes by some external force. So I wanted to make that point so that people could understand when you say that they're being imported by the elite, that you're not just spewing a just random foolishness. There's a logic to this and talk about the gangs because we've been hearing about the gang problem, but it's not just simply not all gangs are gangs. How about that?
Dr Jemima Pierre (25:54):
Yes, definitely. Well, in addition to the guns, you have to think about ammunition. You can have a gun if you don't have ammunition, what can you do with it?
Dr Wilmer Leon (26:03):
Throw it at somebody.
Dr Jemima Pierre (26:06):
And so I have to say, so in the past three years, a number of high powered military grade guns in the country has gone up to almost a million. And so you're trying to figure out these, and then when you see the pictures, you see pictures of young men in flip-flops and mismatched shorts and rioty shirts,
Dr Wilmer Leon (26:30):
Raggedy t-shirts and shorts,
Dr Jemima Pierre (26:31):
Raggedy T-shirts where they dump us youth clothes in Haiti. That's what they're wearing,
Dr Wilmer Leon (26:38):
That a lot of that clothing is made in Haiti, right,
Dr Jemima Pierre (26:44):
Right. Am I right? Exactly. And then set back as charity right after people stopped wearing them. Right. But yeah, so you have to ask yourself and you're like, well, is this really what is this problem? It's not like militaries are fighting against people. It's not like there's a civil war in Haiti. It's like these young men who are being paid to wreak havoc. And because the unemployment is so high in Haiti, it's really easy to find some young men and give 'em some guns and make them think that they're doing something or you send them annual ammunition. And just recently the Haitian police stopped a van that was full of ammunition coming from the Dominican border into Haiti. So we have to think about that. And this is the other part is Haiti has had a problem paramilitary since the US occupied Haiti in the 1915, changed our constitution and set up the Haitian police when they left 19 years later, which became the bane of our existence, but also led to the coming to power of Papa Doc and his really horrible military force, paramilitary force, Tonto Maku.
(27:57)
So we've had this long history of us sponsored terror through police, and then what ends up happening is with the end of the Risid government through ata, you have a lot of former police, former military disbanded the military because he said the military was always the bane of Hades existence. So he abandoned the military, and a lot of them actually became part of these paramilitary troops that would come back and be paid by the CIA to try and overthrow him. And so what you talk about gangs is this ragtag the news media likes to show these pictures of burning tires, rack tack, guys holding AK 47, whatever they're holding as if Haiti is engulfed. And the reality is, a lot of this is in the Capitol city with these groups. Some of them are right near the US Embassy, so they know who they are.
(28:51)
But the other thing is you have the police, the former police who also have formed what we call paramilitary groups. You have the local elite who fund armed groups to do what they needed to do. So you have a combination of things, but to me, there's also racialized part of this because it's easy to say, well, Hades filled with gangs, and these black people look at them, look at the pictures, but look at this. There's a mass shooting in Maine with this guy holding a gun. They still can't find him. Many mass shootings in the US are with white guys holding guns, but you don't see the breathless report. Imagine if we report about US mass shooting the way they report about hate
Dr Wilmer Leon (29:35):
537 mass shootings in the United States the 1st of January, 2023. And
Dr Jemima Pierre (29:44):
That's right. And we only have 360 days, 365 days in the year. The reality is in places like Jamaica, they've been under state of emergency because of gang violence. And so why is Haiti and you have to think there's something else going on. It can't be just about the gangs. The other thing is the biggest gangsters in Haiti, as I always say, is the us, the core group and the UN mission there, because how gangster can you get meet in a different country, France, Canada and the us, they meet and they decide they're going to remove an elected president, or how gangster can you get any more gangster than Hillary Clinton flying in and changing the election results of a supposedly sovereign country? So we have to redefine how we're thinking about this gang thing and really think about, well, who's funding these young men and who are the real gangsters of the world that can allow this to happen or that make this happen and then turn around and present themselves just because they're wearing suits, they present themselves as the real people that can bring solutions.
Dr Wilmer Leon (30:52):
The name of this podcast is connecting the dots. Who did the United States follow into Vietnam, France? Who is the United States following t, Niger, France? Who is the United States following into Haiti, France? Should we be connecting these dots? Dr. Pierre? Are these relevant dots to connect?
Dr Jemima Pierre (31:20):
I think on some level, I think for West Africa, it's very interesting in terms of seeing the fall of French influence and empire. And I think the US is coming in to clean up to make sure that West Africa doesn't fall in the hands of supposed Russia. And so as France wanes, they're jumping in to do that. And I think with Haiti, it was the same thing. It was like the US came in, especially in the early 19 hundreds and through its Monroe doctrine, was basically to get rid of the European presence. And because there were a group of Germans actually that were trying, that owned a lot of stuff in Haiti that were doing business in Haiti, and the US did not want to have anyone outside of themselves to control the political and economic situation in the region. And so that's exactly what's happening. The US took over from France way early in the early 19 hundreds, and it's been doing that, and then France then just turns around and becomes a junior partner and continues the work of the White West Elite.
Dr Wilmer Leon (32:25):
Well, and not to get too deep into the weeds, but wasn't the basic premise of the Monroe Doctrine. It was an agreement between the United States and Europe. The United States committed to staying out of the affairs of Europe if Europe agreed to stay out of the affairs of the Americas, leaving the Americas to the United States.
Dr Jemima Pierre (32:48):
Exactly. Exactly. Except that now the Global Fragility Act, the US is viewing Europe as junior partners, as intensifies its control of the region,
Dr Wilmer Leon (33:03):
Who was the face of US policy going into Haiti and ushering out Jean Beron aee. Was it Colin Powell? Was he the face? The story that I understand is he was the messenger that went in to Haiti and told President Risid, you got to go. There's a plane on the tarmac if you don't get on it.
Dr Jemima Pierre (33:36):
Yeah, it wasn't Colin Powell, it was the US Ambassador to Haiti. I forgot his name at the time that actually the Marines had, but it was Colin Powell that was with Georgia re bush threatening. And if you go back to the media, you'll see it's always a black face. I mean, there's always a black face to do that work,
Dr Wilmer Leon (33:56):
Right? That's the point I want. That's the dot. I want to connect because it's now Secretary of Defense, Lloyd Austin that went to Kenya with the bag of cash to establish what a five year defense agreement with Kenya in order to entice them. So another black face on American imperialism. I call that minstrel diplomacy. Your thoughts.
Dr Jemima Pierre (34:27):
Definitely. And that's the most disappointing part, is that this has been going on. It
Dr Wilmer Leon (34:35):
Doesn't always Wait, wait minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. And it was, when we want to talk about the Racom and the Global Fragilities Act, it was a, not Gregory Meeks, it was the minority leader in the house from New York,
Dr Jemima Pierre (34:55):
Hakeem Jeffries.
Dr Wilmer Leon (34:56):
Hakeem Jeffries, and it was Hakeem Jeffries. It was Vice President Kamala Harris,
Dr Jemima Pierre (35:02):
Kamala Harris
Dr Wilmer Leon (35:03):
That went to Caricom. And when you mentioned Global Fragilities Act, I think that was Co-sponsored by Karen Bass.
Dr Jemima Pierre (35:13):
Karen Bass, and I forgot the name of the other person. Yes. It was two black
Dr Wilmer Leon (35:19):
Faces on two
Dr Jemima Pierre (35:20):
Black faces of the Empire. And if
Dr Wilmer Leon (35:22):
We go to the un, Linda Thomas Greenfield,
Dr Jemima Pierre (35:27):
And the State Department representative for the region is Brian Nichols. And this is the most disturbing part to me is because it wasn't always this way. So for Frederick Douglas, the great abolitionist, Frederick Douglas was sent to Haiti as a US representative in the late 18 hundreds, wasn't he? Ambassador? Yes. To sent to Haiti, and they really went, they sent him to actually negotiate to get this Bay Molson Nicola, which they still want actually to basically set up a base there, a US military base there. The Haitians have always gone against that, which is why they ended up setting up the base in Guantanamo Bay. So if you look at the map, it's a perfect way place for, it's between Cuba and Haiti, and this bay is there. And so it is perfect for the US ships to go through, get through the Panama Canal, wherever they need to get through to get to the Pacific.
(36:20)
And so Frederick Douglass came back and advocated against that on behalf of Haitians. He felt a responsibility. And he also have the NAACP wrote writing on behalf of Haiti during the occupation from 1915 to 1934, saying that this is talking about how Citibank was behind the occupation and how badly the US is treating Haitians and so on and so forth. It wasn't always this way. Now you have Colin Powell, Condoleezza Rice, and then you have Barack Obama because it was under Barack Obama that this latest political party was put in power. This neo Deval political party was put into power. And so you have this, and then you have them sending Brian Nichols who's trying to, who's behind pushing this intervention. So meeting with all of these people, getting the Caribbean, getting these, I call neo-colonial coons, whatever you want to call them, the head of Jamaica, the head of Barbados, the head neo motley, right?
(37:38)
Who's the UN's darling? Because apparently the word on the street is that she's up for the UN Security Council secretary general job. And so she's doing whatever needs to be done to get there. So the US has managed to get all these black people. Now, Kenya, who knows nothing about Haiti get this, Kenya did not even have diplomatic relations to Haiti with Haiti until last month right before the un vote. So Kenya knows nothing about Haiti. They're talking about training their police to speak French when the majority of Haitian people don't speak French, they speak Creole, right? And so part of that is to think about how easy it is to use black people to use black faces to do empires bidding. And I actually think China and Russia had been pushing against this intervention for the past two years. And I think this last time, after two years of pushing back, they abstained. And I think part of the reason they abstained is because you had all these black countries pressuring them. And I think one of the things is I also think they're looking out for themselves and their relationship with these countries in Africa and the Caribbean. So they stepped back and allowed this intervention to go forward. But I think they stepped back because it was the onslaught of pressure from the black countries on
Dr Wilmer Leon (38:56):
Them. But why abstain? Why not vote no and kill the deal?
Dr Jemima Pierre (39:03):
Right? Because that's what I'm saying. I think they're looking out for their own best interests. I think they don't want to ruin their relationships with these black countries who are pushing. I think that's part of that, right? So they voted no all along and this time, so if you have Nia Motley, you have Ruto, you have all these people saying, this is Pan-Africanism. We're going to go help our brothers and sisters in Haiti by sending a military intervention. That's what Ruto is using. They're using the language of Pan-Africanism Racom is using the language of helping our brothers, even though Caricom has some of the most draconian anti Haiti immigration policies, deportation rules, but they're all using this language. And I do think that actually applied the pressure that the US got them to apply on China. Russia actually worked to get them to abstain. At least they didn't vote yes. But the abstention, I think, is a result of the pressure.
Dr Wilmer Leon (39:55):
You mentioned the training of Haitian police through these Kenyan interlocutors or these Kenyan invaders, and these Kenyan forces have been labeled as Kenyan police. But from what I've read, they're not Kenyan police. They're Kenyan paramilitary forces that have a reputation of being incredibly, incredibly brutal against their own countrymen.
Dr Jemima Pierre (40:29):
Yeah, definitely. And what's most distressing about this situation is that the only solution that these people think that they can have for Haiti and Haitian is a violent military. One is the one that has to do with force. They never tried. They never tried diplomacy. They never tried actually sanctioning these elites that they know run guns into the country. So yeah, the thousand police is not police. It's pe, military force, but also Kenya has a terrible reputation in Somalia in the proxy war there going in there and devastating Somalis. And so for me, just because they're black, in fact, if anything, I think these police officers will treat Haitians worse because they're black in a way that they wouldn't, can you imagine sending a Kenyan police force to Europe? Or why not send a Kenyan police force to Ukraine to help? And so part of that to me is it is telling, and I want to quickly just say
Dr Wilmer Leon (41:36):
Briefly, oh, well, the reason you won't send those black Kenyan forces to Ukraine is because the Nazis, the racist Nazis in Ukraine would chop off their heads. That's why.
Dr Jemima Pierre (41:47):
Well, definitely. But this idea that it's easier to watch one black group kill another. Oh, no, no,
Dr Wilmer Leon (41:52):
No. I truly understand the basis of the
Dr Jemima Pierre (41:54):
Question. No, I know.
Dr Wilmer Leon (41:56):
Go ahead.
Dr Jemima Pierre (41:58):
Yes, yes, we know. We know. It's really distressing to think about that because look at what's happening right now in the Occupy territories where you have Zionist state destroying killing. And right now, as we know, more than 7,000 people, 3000 children, and we have an internal, so-called gang problem, but we're getting a chapter seven military deployment to invade Haiti. But Zionist state Z, its entity can get away with killing how many people, and nobody's thinking about sending a military force to stop this bombing. So just think about that. No, the
Dr Wilmer Leon (42:38):
Military force that's being sent is facilitating the bombing
Dr Jemima Pierre (42:41):
Is to facilitate it. And so I want people to make those connections because you have to think, well, why isn't it absurd to send an armed military force to deal with gangs? So-called gangs in Haiti, but you're not doing it for Jamaica, which has been under state of emergency for two years over gangs. You're not doing it in the Middle East. And so we have to think about, well, this makes no sense. This idea of a military invasion of Haiti makes no sense in light what's going on in light of Ukraine and in light of what's going on in the occupied territories.
Dr Wilmer Leon (43:13):
You mentioned China a little bit earlier, and I always say to folks, when you engage in these type of conversations, it's usually a good idea to have a map in front of you so that you can understand the geopolitics. So we know that China has been establishing relationships with Nicaragua. We know that China is establishing relationships with Guatemala, and those are in Central America. And we know that there's been discussions about China building a canal to rival a Panama Canal through Nicaragua. And we know that the United States does not want that to happen. And we'd also know that the United States has been anxious to build a naval base in Haiti. So if you could connect those dots. Am I wrong to, again, the show is connecting the dots. Am I wrong to connect those dots?
Dr Jemima Pierre (44:19):
No, you're not wrong at all. The Global Fragilities Act specifically names China and Russia. So let's get that clear. And so one of the things is the waning power of the empire, right? Because they know that what their military used to be able to do, they can't do anymore. Look, they got beat by the Taliban 20 years later. How many trillions of dollars they destroyed Iraq, when was the last time the US won a war? I mean, let's be real, except maybe World War ii. And even that,
Dr Wilmer Leon (44:51):
They
Dr Jemima Pierre (44:51):
Had a lot of help from the Red Army. Let's be real
Dr Wilmer Leon (44:54):
Panama,
Dr Jemima Pierre (44:55):
Right? Panama or
Dr Wilmer Leon (44:58):
A big, huge military power called Panama,
Dr Jemima Pierre (45:01):
Right? Grenada, we just celebrated the 40th anniversary of the invasion of Grenada. Or you land in Haiti and you send special forces and you remove the sitting president. So they know that they're losing militarily. They know that they cannot sustain the multiple fronts, but they also know the rise of China and Russia is inevitable. Not even. They're already there. And so they know that they can't compete. And so they have to figure out how to mitigate that. And I do think so. That connection is good. Do you know that Haiti is only one of 11 countries that recognizes Taiwan, right? So what does that tell you? And they were forced to recognize Taiwan. And I think, I don't remember if it was under Duvalier who was a staunch anti-communist and really terrorized
Dr Wilmer Leon (45:57):
Who forced Haiti to recognize Taiwan.
Dr Jemima Pierre (46:00):
It was the US government to right,
Dr Wilmer Leon (46:02):
But wait a bit, Dr. Pierre, that can't be because we have a one China policy. So how could that be?
Dr Jemima Pierre (46:09):
No, it's just really fascinating. The more I think about it, the more I come to know this history, and you realize, well, why is Haiti only one of 11 countries to recognize Taiwan? And why was Taiwan coming to Haiti to sign bilateral deals and so on and so forth? And so part of that is they've been able to keep Haiti as one of the few in the region as one of the few people to recognize Taiwan as opposed to China, even though the US itself, as you say, has a one China policy. So I do think this is all connected. I think the US is trying to entrench itself. It wants to be near Haiti, closer to Haiti because it's worried about Venezuela. It is still mad about Cuba. It's worried about this. You're right, this canal that Nicaragua wants to get with the help of China and war with China is inevitable.
(47:01)
They all know that because they know that that's the only way they can try to hold on to this flailing empire. And so they're going to need to do as much as they can, but because they don't have the strength from military numbers to the capacity, you have 800 bases. That's a vulnerability. So they're going to get other, look what's happening right now in the Middle East. Your bases are being attacked. They're sitting ducks. And so if you have all of these things there, if you can talk, some people still into the dirty work for you, which is why they have military exercises with the Caribbean operation Tradewinds, they have military exercises with West Africa, and so they want to use these as proxies the way that they use Ukraine as a proxy against Russia. So they're going to use these as proxies against China. And that's the connection, right? The connection is all about trying to maintain global dominance, but not having enough firepower, not having enough political power to do so. So then using these others while you still can to do the dirty work for you,
Dr Wilmer Leon (47:59):
Talk if you would please, about the Dominican Republic, the Dominican Republic's role as it relates to Haiti and Columbia as well. Because I think that I read a number of reports that some of the assassins that went into Haiti and assassinated President Maise were Columbia or were out of Columbia, and we know that Columbia is one of the training bases for the CIA as the CIA projects this power in Central and South America.
Dr Jemima Pierre (48:37):
Yeah. Well, so Columbia also outsources mercenaries, and so it's very easy to use trained
Dr Wilmer Leon (48:47):
By the
Dr Jemima Pierre (48:47):
United States, right? 23 out of the 26 mercenaries come out of Columbia. Columbia's interesting. And I'm not a Columbia expert. What's interesting is the fact that they elected this leftist president, but Columbia has a long history of, right-wing governments also would fey to the us. And so we have to ask Columbia, well, why are there still US military bases in Columbia, right? So why did they sign an agreement to be with NATO to be like a NATO ally, NATO ally? And so Columbia is definitely part of that. I think I forgot your question, but No,
Dr Wilmer Leon (49:25):
I was asking about the relationship between the Dominican Republic and Columbia as it relates to being proxies basically for the United States.
Dr Jemima Pierre (49:37):
Well, definitely, and I don't know. I know the relationship with Dominican Republic, with Haiti, and one of the things, Haiti during the Haitian Revolution took over the entire island to get rid of the Spanish and to end slavery. And it's a very complicated history. And after Haitians beat the French, they had to take over the entire island in order to stop the constant attacks that were coming around, but also they got rid of slavery. And so then the Spanish help the elites get back. That part of the island and the relationship has always been fraught. The Dominican Republic has a deep anti-Asian, which is very much deep in racism. And so then that you have is our legacy with the Dominican Republic is in 19 seven massacre, parsley massacre, where they chop down about 30,000 Haitians and dumped them in the river, which is why that river, if you've heard that, and it uses called Massacre River, is the Dominican Republic massacre.
(50:41)
And Haitians, they've always, with the 2004 Kuta, a lot of the paramilitaries were trained in the military in the Dominican Republic. A lot of the arms are going into from the Dominican Republic and this ab, who's one of the most racist, right-wing presidents of Dominican Republic has had been going after Haitians forever. So for example, in 2013, the Dominican Republic nationalized 240,000 people, Dominicans of Haitian descent going back eight generations. So these people were Dominicans and basically removed citizenship from them. And Ab Nair has been rounding up the Haitian workers that have been in the Dominican Republic for generations cutting cane and so on and so forth. And that itself is a result of policies in the region that impoverish people and force them to go out and provide cheap labor. So the Dominican Republic and Haiti have had a really acrimonious history, but then the US Border Patrol is helping the Dominican Republic build a wall to separate Haiti in the dr.
(51:45)
So the US' hand is always in there, and we always have to, it is not to take away agency from the Dominicans or from the Haitians, but the truth is the reason that Haiti becomes significance because one of the few places that's still fight back, and I don't think people realize it. And that's one thing you have to think about, HAES, not that it's a mess. The reason they're still going after is because it's still fighting back places like Jamaica, for example. I don't know if people saw, there's a report recently that Jamaicans have no regular, Jamaicans no longer have access to their beaches. They have all been privatized and owned by foreigners. And so what they've become is a captive labor force to provide labor for these resorts. Well, Haiti, we don't have that yet. I mean, we have it in the northern part where in La Bai, which the Duval sold to, I think Royal Caribbean cruises. But this is what they want for Haiti. They want to remove the people from the land where people still own a lot of their land, where the country's still predominantly agriculture. They want to remove them from the land, privatize everything, steal the land, and turn it into a captive labor force for capital. And so,
Dr Wilmer Leon (53:00):
Wait a minute. To that point, I read and that the Clintons have purchased an inordinate amount of land in Haiti to build a private resort. Basically the model, what's been done in Jamaica.
Dr Jemima Pierre (53:16):
Jamaica, definitely Jamaica, Barbados, all those places that the other thing we have to talk about, the mineral wealth in Haiti. Wait,
Dr Wilmer Leon (53:24):
And one more point real quick is that you talked about resistance. I believe if those Kenyan forces make land on Haiti,
Dr Jemima Pierre (53:38):
They won't know what's coming.
Dr Wilmer Leon (53:39):
They got to fight on their hands that be prepared to manage.
Dr Jemima Pierre (53:45):
Yeah, I don't think it is going to be as easy as they think. And
Dr Wilmer Leon (53:50):
You wanted to hit on the mineral.
Dr Jemima Pierre (53:52):
On the mineral. And people also don't remember, don't know that Haiti, you can look this up. There are all these reports that Haiti has millions minerals and that people want, in fact, when they decided to start mining for gold, the first person that got a mining permit was Hillary Clinton's brother,
Dr Wilmer Leon (54:14):
Brother out of Canada, right?
Dr Jemima Pierre (54:18):
And so we have to think about Canada too, because Canada's people think of Canada as like Little Brother and Peter, but Canada has been front and center. In fact, Canada still has big manufacturing hubs. Gildan still produces T-shirts and stuff like that in Haiti. So it's just really interesting to think about how I wanted to end by saying, this is not a victimization. I think people like to say, oh, poor Haitians. Oh, look at this. People suffer so much they can't get a break. And I'm like, well, the truth is they've been fighting back, which is why they can't get a break, and they're going to continue to fight back. And you can't only see them as perpetual victims. What you need to see is do analysis and connect the ways that all the, the ways that Empire has tried to keep the people down, despite the fact that they're standing up to fight back.
Dr Wilmer Leon (55:03):
You've got a hard stop. I greatly appreciate you giving me the time today. You talked about minerals. There are geological reports that show there may be more oil off the coast of Haiti than there is in Venezuela. Venezuela, and Venezuela has the largest reserv of oil in the world. Dr. Jamima Pierre, how can people find you, connect with you if they need to?
Dr Jemima Pierre (55:30):
Yeah. Well, you can find me on YouTube through all these various interviews and my publications all over just a basically
Dr Wilmer Leon (55:37):
Black agenda report
Dr Jemima Pierre (55:38):
And black agenda report, as well as the Black Alliance for Peace. We have a whole Haiti resource page.
Dr Wilmer Leon (55:43):
Dr. Jamima Pierre, thank you so much for your time. Really, really appreciate it.
Dr Jemima Pierre (55:48):
Thanks so much for having me.
Dr Wilmer Leon (55:50):
Thank you folks. I got to thank my guest, Dr. Jamima Pierre for joining me today. And thank you all so much for listening to the Connecting the Dots podcast with me, Dr. Wilmer Leon. Stay tuned for new episodes every week. Also, please follow and subscribe, leave a review, and please, please, please, please, baby. Please baby. Please share my show. Follow us on social media. You can find all the links below in the show description. Remember, this is where the analysis of politics, culture, and history converge because talk without analysis is just chatter, and we don't chatter on connecting the dots. See you again next time. Until then, I'm Dr. Woman Leon. Have a great one. Peace and blessings. I'm out
Speaker 1 (56:47):
Connecting the dots with Dr. Wilmer Leon, where the analysis of politics, culture, and history converge.
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Joining us to delve into the details on Haiti and so much more, our guest this week is Dr Jemima Pierre, professor at the Institute for the Study of Gender, race, sexuality and Social Justice at the University of British Columbia in Vancouver, Canada.
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TRANSCRIPT:
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Connecting the dots with Dr. Wilmer Leon, where the analysis of politics, culture, and history converge.
Dr Wilmer Leon (00:48):
Welcome to the Connecting the Dots podcast with Dr. Wilmer Leon. I'm Wilmer Leon. Here's the point. We have a tendency to view current events as though they occur in a vacuum, failing to understand the broader historical context in which most events take place. During each episode of this podcast, my guests and I will have probing, provocative, and in-depth discussions that connect the dots between current events and the broader historical context in which the events occur. This will enable you to better understand and analyze the events that are impacting the global village in which we live on today's episode. The question before us is why is the United States working to reinve and colonize Haiti? My guest is a professor at the Institute for the Study of Gender, race, sexuality and Social Justice at the University of British Columbia in Vancouver, Canada. She's a member of the Black Alliance for Peace and an editor of the Black Agenda Review segment of the Black Agenda Report. And she's the author of a very, very substantive piece, Haiti as Empire's Laboratory, Dr. Jamima Pierre. Dr. Pierre, welcome to the show and let's connect some dots.
Dr Jemima Pierre (02:12):
Thank you so much for having me. It's a pleasure to be here.
Dr Wilmer Leon (02:15):
You write in your piece that the Global Fragility Act presents new strategies for deploying us hard and soft power in a changing world. It focuses US foreign policy on the idea that there are so-called fragile states, countries prone to instability, extremism, conflict, and extreme poverty, which are presumably threats to US security. Explain first, what is the Global Fragility Act and why should Americans, not to mention its victims, be so concerned about it?
Dr Jemima Pierre (02:52):
Yes, so the Global Fragilities Act was actually presented in 2019, I think under Donald Trump, and then was ratified under the Biden administration. And it really is a way to be brand new as foreign policy. And I don't know if your listeners know about the Monroe Doctrine, which the US passed about a hundred years ago, which basically said that the US had access that no one can encroach in US' influence in the Western Hemisphere. And through the Monroe Doctrine, the US was able to assert its influence, occupy invade nations whenever it deemed necessary, and got away with it for a hundred years. And so the upheaval that we've seen throughout Latin America, the regime changes, the support for support for military dictatorships and so on and so forth has occurred through the Monroe Doctrine. But the Global Fragility Act was really brought by the conservative think tank, the US Peace Institute, which is actually misnamed as far as I'm concerned.
(04:10)
But it was really a way to look at US foreign policy in a different light or to rebrand it. And what I mean by rebrand is that to basically come together to make it seem like the US was not doing what it was doing, and it was basically bringing together the work of the Department of Defense, the Department of the State, and the U-S-A-I-D. So linking together aid defense as well as political state department moves. And the idea was basically an opportunity to change the way that the US did business to using local partners by not necessarily doing the dirty work of putting boots on the ground if it needed to invade a place. But it was really trying to figure out how to actually change the internal politics of a place to really prevent adversary. And they say in the ACT adversaries such as China and Russia from expanding their influence in this way, they use civil society, they use military, and then they use, so-called diplomacy bringing together.
(05:19)
But what's key to this, they also use local regional partners such as other states, other formations such as the Caribbean community and so on and so forth to actually assert US power. And so what's interesting about the Global Fragilities Act is that it was passed by Trump, but ratified under Biden and then was implemented. And at first they said they were going to focus on a set of countries, which Haiti being the very first. So what it is, so it's Haiti first and then Libya, Mozambique, Papua New Guinea, along with they call the coastal countries of West Africa. What's fascinating about this order is that Haiti and Libya are the states, two of the states besides Iraq that are probably most destroyed by the US and its allies. And it is going under the guise that these people are, that these states are so fragile, they're a mess, they're full of corruption and so on and so forth without really talking about the underlying problem, which is these states are fragile because of us constant interventions and us creating instability in this state. So I'll stop there to just give as a short background,
Dr Wilmer Leon (06:42):
One of the things that popped in my mind when you said Haiti and then you said Libya, one of the common threads between the two are the Clintons, because if I remember my history correctly, it was then Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton that convinced then President Obama, then President Barack Obama to invade Libya and assassinate more Mark dfi. And we know that Hillary Clinton, again, was very much involved in the destabilization, the most recent destabilization of Haiti.
Dr Jemima Pierre (07:21):
Oh, definitely. Well, the Clintons, they've got dirt all over them. I mean, when it comes to Haiti, the Clintons, I have a piece that I wrote a long time ago, about 11 years ago. I say the Clintons are omnipotent, omni, the present, they're everywhere. And so we have to think about what Bill Clinton did by killing Haiti's rice production facility by dumping the rise of his Arkansas farmers into Haiti and destroying Haiti's rise economy. So we have to think about what he did when he was president, but they've been dealing with Haiti for a long time. And we have to think also about after the earthquake where Obama put Clinton and Georgia re bush in charge of Haiti eight. And the people that benefited the most from the earthquake that killed 300,000 Haitians was the Clinton Foundation, which raised tons of money. And Haiti saw nothing except for these fancy hotels that they're making profits off.
(08:17)
So there's that. But what's most important is in 2011 during the So-called Arab Spring, Hillary Clinton flew to Haiti and changed the election results that actually put in power, the current political, so-called political party that's there now, Michelle Marli, who actually was just named in the UN report as one of the biggest funders for gangs in Haiti, who's also the president, the former president, right? And so they forced Haiti to have elections, right, eight months after an earthquake that destabilized the whole country where about a million people were still living in tents outside, but they forced these elections because this is how they could control Haiti. And when their favorite candidate, Martin Lee did not make the first round, they decided that they're going to force that. So Hillary Clinton flew into Haiti and threatened the sitting president would exile if he did not allow the change to the ballots to make this guy who did not make the first round president. And everything has been bad since then.
Dr Wilmer Leon (09:24):
You mentioned Bill Clinton decimating the domestic Haitian rice production in his book, the Choice Sam yet talks about the tie of rice to the start of the Vietnam War and how many people don't discuss one of the major motivating factors for the United States to go into Indo-China had to do with protecting American rice interest because they didn't want Asian rice flooding the market. And then that also made me think about nafta. And what NAFTA did to the domestic corn production in Mexico decimated the production of Mexican corn, which then decimated the livelihoods for Mexican farmers, which has contributed to immigration of Mexicans into the United States. So again, the show is called Connecting the Dots. And so any thoughts on that?
Dr Jemima Pierre (10:25):
Well, definitely I think, I don't even remember where I saw that recently that rice farmers, is it Rice? Rice producers were looking forward to having access back again to Haiti's market once this military invasion happened. And so there's a lot of things to think about under Reagan. Haiti, the Haitian government was forced to kill its local pigs, the black pigs, I don't know if people have heard about this, but you can look up Haiti black pigs. Black pigs are indigenous to that region. And Haiti was told that the pigs had some disease and they had to basically kill the entire population of black pigs on the island in order. And then they were replaced by the white pigs from the south of the US and pigs who are from the US not are not used to the climate in the Caribbean. So then they required very specific kinds of feeding food to eat.
(11:30)
And so those had to be imported. So that decimated the Haitian economy. So there's a way that you can see all these connected. The other thing is I don't think people always ask, well, you're making a big deal about Haiti. Haiti's not that important. Why would the US spend so much time and energy trying to destabilize Haiti? And then you realize then you have to ask these people, well, why is the fourth largest US embassy in the world in Haiti? If Haiti was not so important, why did the US feel that they have to do it? And why? Despite everything going on this week, despite the fact that you have the genocidal Zionist state killing thousands of Palestinians, they forced the UN to have a meeting about this intervention in Haiti over gangs, right? Supposedly over gangs. So that tells you there's something in there because Haiti actually becomes a big manufacturing hub for the us. And so I think a lot of us have been saying as the us, as the US moves towards a war with China, they will need a replacement of their manufacturing hubs. And Haiti already within 11 million strong population Haiti already provides is a space for a large manufacturing hub already. So as they lose Asia, they're going to rely more on Haiti. And so we have to think about that in terms of the economics of that as well as the politics, which we can get into later on as we speak more.
Dr Wilmer Leon (13:01):
You write in your piece in April of 22, the Biden Harris administration affirmed its commitment to the Global Fragilities Act by outlining a strategy for its implementation as detailed in the strategies prologue, the US government's new foreign policy approach depends on willing partners to address common challenges and share costs. Ultimately, the document continues. No US or international intervention will be successful without the buy-in and mutual ownership of trusted regional, national and local partners. And you touched on that in your open, but I think it's very important for people to really understand. That's really nice flowerly language, but it's not innocuous. That is a very nice way of saying that the United States is going to use organizations, indigenous organizations in order to promote American interests.
Dr Jemima Pierre (14:15):
Oh, definitely. Not just indigenous organizations, local states. I mean the recent upcoming invasion, military invasion of Haiti supposedly over gangs is actually being led supposedly by Kenya. And so all of a sudden you're asking yourself, Kenya's, all the way across the world on the east side of the African continent, what does Kenya have to do with Haiti? Well, before Kenya, the US tried to use Racom, which is a community of Caribbean states and nations. And that didn't work as well before them. They tried to get clac, which is the central and Latin American communities to lead in the invasion. Before them, they tried to get Brazil. So before them, they tried to get Canada to lead the invasion. And before that they tried to get Brazil to lead the invasion. The thing is to not have boots on the ground, as we've seen in the US in Ukraine, for example.
(15:14)
The point is to use other, so-called stakeholders, get other people to do the dirty work of US intervention and foreign policy and to get buy-in. And the reason I say Haiti's a laboratory, this is not the first time this is happening. And in the piece I outlined the Canada, France and US back Kuta that happened in Haiti in 2004, where the US and France, who our membership in the security council, they were behind the Kuta in 2004, immediately after the US Marines landed, took our president, put him on a plane and flew him to Africa. You had French Canadian and US soldiers there, but these two UN security council members were able to use their position to call an emergency security council meeting to push for a multinational. So-called stabilization force in Haiti. So to me, the UN is bankrupt with this security council in this particular sense.
(16:23)
So these people were able to use that, and then they convinced the UN that Haiti needed a chapter seven deployment. And chapter seven deployment is only for countries that are at war with other, there's a civil war. There was no civil war in Haiti, but they managed to convince the un. So then what they ended up doing was sending, getting a un, so-called peacekeeping mission to Haiti in a country that was not at civil war. But what it meant that was that you can have up to 50 to 60 nations participate in an occupation of Haiti. And that's what ended up happening. Brazil led that meeting and you had people from all over the world, police and military from all over the world occupying Haiti on behalf of the US under the guise of providing civility. That group stayed there from 2004 to 2017 when they drew down and brought back a smaller force.
(17:15)
But so Haiti is still under un occupation. And this is what this amazing law scholar, and I'm forgetting her name, I think it's China Mayville calls multilateralism as terror because the new, and this is what the Global Fragility Act, and that's why Haiti's always a laboratory is because you use Haiti. They tried it on Haiti and it worked. In fact, the WikiLeaks paper said the Minister peacekeeping mission in Haiti the cheapest was a foreign policy bonanza for the US because it was so cheap they can use the UN and then they can use all the local Latin America countries to do the dirty work. And so it's just really important to think about that and to think about how they're going to move forward from that on. And now the other thing to talk about aid is that they've already established a second phase of the Global Fragilities Act in the summer, and they're saying they're going fund, they're going to fund 260, so-called civil society NGOs on the ground in order to basically shape policy in Haiti as they leave for elections. So the plan is to actually take over the political structure of Haiti using the guise of civil society and Haitian solutions.
Dr Wilmer Leon (18:32):
So to that point, what this results in and what the Global Fragilities Act does is it takes the Department of State and it combines the Department of State and the Pentagon. And it's using, as you said in your piece, the hard power is the Pentagon. The soft power is the Department of State and under the pretext or pretense of bringing stability to the country, that enables the United States to go in with the military and engage in regime change and engage in control of the domestic space, but leaving out the fact that the reason the country is unstable in the first place is because of American policy in the country.
Dr Jemima Pierre (19:34):
Oh, definitely. And that's one of the key things we have to remember is this 2004 coup deta is a coup deta where Canada Friends and the US got together in Ottawa and Canada in 2003 and decided they needed to get rid of our elected democratically elected president. And then they follow through with this coup deta. And then it was given a go ahead by the UN because they run the security council and the other states on the permanent council also need to be held accountable because they sat quietly and let the US and France run this right the same way they did with Libya allowing a no fly zone of Libya. And so Haiti has been under occupation since 2004. And so at the beginning of the coup DTA in 2004, Haiti had about 7,000 elected officials. As of today, Haiti has zero elected officials, the US and the UN through the core group, which is a group of unelected non Haitian officials from the European Union, the organization of American states that meet that.
(20:40)
So-called court that meet to make plans for Haiti. They're the ones that have been running Haiti since 2004. So if there's a problem in Haiti, if there hasn't been any elections where we have no regional elections, no local elections, no presidential elections, it's because they have allowed that if there are guns in the country, because Haiti does not manufacture guns, it's because, and the guns are coming from the us, it's because they control what comes in and out of Haiti. They know who it is. In fact, the UN put out a report just last week stating explicitly that the former president that Hillary Clinton installed actually was funding two major gangs in Haiti to go after his enemies and to wreak havoc in the neighborhoods. And so all this tells me that everything that's happened in the last 19 years has been why Haiti is under occupation. And what they want to do is wreak havoc. And I don't know if people know this, the US has been trying to get an intervention force in Haiti for two years since the assassination of the president. And I have to say, as an aside, the
Dr Wilmer Leon (21:46):
Assassination was that Ju Moiz the
Dr Jemima Pierre (21:47):
Assassination, Jon Moiz, right? I have to put that an aside, that assassination happened about a month after Moiz came back from Russia trying to establish relationships with Russia. And I have to, this is an important piece that I think matters. And that was the first time Haiti was trying to establish relations with Russia. So part of that is because Haitians were protesting against intervention from the very beginning. They were always in the streets. And people forget that Haitians have been protesting against us, meddling for the longest times from 2018 19, in 2020, there were millions of Haitians on the street protesting to get rid of this public government that the US had installed and so on. People were protesting over and over again, and the US could not get this passed. And I don't know if you realize it. And then so all of a sudden, this gang problem emerges and it seems out of hand because the amount of guns entering the country the past two years has been unprecedented. And they're dumping guns and ammunition into the country. The guns are coming directly from Haiti. So they're fomenting this idea that there's this gun
Dr Wilmer Leon (22:58):
Coming directly to Haiti,
Dr Jemima Pierre (22:59):
To Haiti through the ports that are owned by the elite, the ports that are owned by the elite, the Haitian oligarchy that a couple of 'em have been named in the UN report just last week, that they need to be sanctioned. The US hasn't sanctioned any of them. They have not followed through the embargo that the Chinese government said that they should put. So they basically created, exacerbated the gang problem. That's what I should say. They exacerbated the gang problem. So then every news media you see about Haiti the past year has been about gangs, not about the fact that Haitians were protesting the fact that this illegitimate government signed this deal with the IMF to remove fuel subsidies and made life extremely expensive for Haiti, or the fact that the people were protesting this prime minister that was installed by the US in the core group. And so we forget that people are protesting against US Empire protesting against a defacto government that they didn't elect, and now we're only focusing on gangs. And it's easy to do that because they can manufacture that consent because they can control everything that's going on Haiti. So then they create the basket case, and then they come in and they say, well, we have to fix this problem because they need help.
Dr Wilmer Leon (24:10):
What is the average daily income for a Haitian?
Dr Jemima Pierre (24:15):
Oh, I haven't checked that in a while, but it's under three us. I think it's under five US dollars per day.
Dr Wilmer Leon (24:21):
Okay. Okay. $5 a day under.
(24:24)
Well, let's just for simple math, $5 a day, seven days a week, $35 a week, okay. A Beretta 40 caliber handgun costs about $600, a heckler and cock, 40 caliber handgun. It's about $800. An AR 15 style rifle is about $1,200. How does a person making $35 a week and that's on the high side afford a $600 handgun, a $1,200 assault rifle, assault style rifle, unless they're being supplemented, supplemented in quotes by some external force. So I wanted to make that point so that people could understand when you say that they're being imported by the elite, that you're not just spewing a just random foolishness. There's a logic to this and talk about the gangs because we've been hearing about the gang problem, but it's not just simply not all gangs are gangs. How about that?
Dr Jemima Pierre (25:54):
Yes, definitely. Well, in addition to the guns, you have to think about ammunition. You can have a gun if you don't have ammunition, what can you do with it?
Dr Wilmer Leon (26:03):
Throw it at somebody.
Dr Jemima Pierre (26:06):
And so I have to say, so in the past three years, a number of high powered military grade guns in the country has gone up to almost a million. And so you're trying to figure out these, and then when you see the pictures, you see pictures of young men in flip-flops and mismatched shorts and rioty shirts,
Dr Wilmer Leon (26:30):
Raggedy t-shirts and shorts,
Dr Jemima Pierre (26:31):
Raggedy T-shirts where they dump us youth clothes in Haiti. That's what they're wearing,
Dr Wilmer Leon (26:38):
That a lot of that clothing is made in Haiti, right,
Dr Jemima Pierre (26:44):
Right. Am I right? Exactly. And then set back as charity right after people stopped wearing them. Right. But yeah, so you have to ask yourself and you're like, well, is this really what is this problem? It's not like militaries are fighting against people. It's not like there's a civil war in Haiti. It's like these young men who are being paid to wreak havoc. And because the unemployment is so high in Haiti, it's really easy to find some young men and give 'em some guns and make them think that they're doing something or you send them annual ammunition. And just recently the Haitian police stopped a van that was full of ammunition coming from the Dominican border into Haiti. So we have to think about that. And this is the other part is Haiti has had a problem paramilitary since the US occupied Haiti in the 1915, changed our constitution and set up the Haitian police when they left 19 years later, which became the bane of our existence, but also led to the coming to power of Papa Doc and his really horrible military force, paramilitary force, Tonto Maku.
(27:57)
So we've had this long history of us sponsored terror through police, and then what ends up happening is with the end of the Risid government through ata, you have a lot of former police, former military disbanded the military because he said the military was always the bane of Hades existence. So he abandoned the military, and a lot of them actually became part of these paramilitary troops that would come back and be paid by the CIA to try and overthrow him. And so what you talk about gangs is this ragtag the news media likes to show these pictures of burning tires, rack tack, guys holding AK 47, whatever they're holding as if Haiti is engulfed. And the reality is, a lot of this is in the Capitol city with these groups. Some of them are right near the US Embassy, so they know who they are.
(28:51)
But the other thing is you have the police, the former police who also have formed what we call paramilitary groups. You have the local elite who fund armed groups to do what they needed to do. So you have a combination of things, but to me, there's also racialized part of this because it's easy to say, well, Hades filled with gangs, and these black people look at them, look at the pictures, but look at this. There's a mass shooting in Maine with this guy holding a gun. They still can't find him. Many mass shootings in the US are with white guys holding guns, but you don't see the breathless report. Imagine if we report about US mass shooting the way they report about hate
Dr Wilmer Leon (29:35):
537 mass shootings in the United States the 1st of January, 2023. And
Dr Jemima Pierre (29:44):
That's right. And we only have 360 days, 365 days in the year. The reality is in places like Jamaica, they've been under state of emergency because of gang violence. And so why is Haiti and you have to think there's something else going on. It can't be just about the gangs. The other thing is the biggest gangsters in Haiti, as I always say, is the us, the core group and the UN mission there, because how gangster can you get meet in a different country, France, Canada and the us, they meet and they decide they're going to remove an elected president, or how gangster can you get any more gangster than Hillary Clinton flying in and changing the election results of a supposedly sovereign country? So we have to redefine how we're thinking about this gang thing and really think about, well, who's funding these young men and who are the real gangsters of the world that can allow this to happen or that make this happen and then turn around and present themselves just because they're wearing suits, they present themselves as the real people that can bring solutions.
Dr Wilmer Leon (30:52):
The name of this podcast is connecting the dots. Who did the United States follow into Vietnam, France? Who is the United States following t, Niger, France? Who is the United States following into Haiti, France? Should we be connecting these dots? Dr. Pierre? Are these relevant dots to connect?
Dr Jemima Pierre (31:20):
I think on some level, I think for West Africa, it's very interesting in terms of seeing the fall of French influence and empire. And I think the US is coming in to clean up to make sure that West Africa doesn't fall in the hands of supposed Russia. And so as France wanes, they're jumping in to do that. And I think with Haiti, it was the same thing. It was like the US came in, especially in the early 19 hundreds and through its Monroe doctrine, was basically to get rid of the European presence. And because there were a group of Germans actually that were trying, that owned a lot of stuff in Haiti that were doing business in Haiti, and the US did not want to have anyone outside of themselves to control the political and economic situation in the region. And so that's exactly what's happening. The US took over from France way early in the early 19 hundreds, and it's been doing that, and then France then just turns around and becomes a junior partner and continues the work of the White West Elite.
Dr Wilmer Leon (32:25):
Well, and not to get too deep into the weeds, but wasn't the basic premise of the Monroe Doctrine. It was an agreement between the United States and Europe. The United States committed to staying out of the affairs of Europe if Europe agreed to stay out of the affairs of the Americas, leaving the Americas to the United States.
Dr Jemima Pierre (32:48):
Exactly. Exactly. Except that now the Global Fragility Act, the US is viewing Europe as junior partners, as intensifies its control of the region,
Dr Wilmer Leon (33:03):
Who was the face of US policy going into Haiti and ushering out Jean Beron aee. Was it Colin Powell? Was he the face? The story that I understand is he was the messenger that went in to Haiti and told President Risid, you got to go. There's a plane on the tarmac if you don't get on it.
Dr Jemima Pierre (33:36):
Yeah, it wasn't Colin Powell, it was the US Ambassador to Haiti. I forgot his name at the time that actually the Marines had, but it was Colin Powell that was with Georgia re bush threatening. And if you go back to the media, you'll see it's always a black face. I mean, there's always a black face to do that work,
Dr Wilmer Leon (33:56):
Right? That's the point I want. That's the dot. I want to connect because it's now Secretary of Defense, Lloyd Austin that went to Kenya with the bag of cash to establish what a five year defense agreement with Kenya in order to entice them. So another black face on American imperialism. I call that minstrel diplomacy. Your thoughts.
Dr Jemima Pierre (34:27):
Definitely. And that's the most disappointing part, is that this has been going on. It
Dr Wilmer Leon (34:35):
Doesn't always Wait, wait minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. And it was, when we want to talk about the Racom and the Global Fragilities Act, it was a, not Gregory Meeks, it was the minority leader in the house from New York,
Dr Jemima Pierre (34:55):
Hakeem Jeffries.
Dr Wilmer Leon (34:56):
Hakeem Jeffries, and it was Hakeem Jeffries. It was Vice President Kamala Harris,
Dr Jemima Pierre (35:02):
Kamala Harris
Dr Wilmer Leon (35:03):
That went to Caricom. And when you mentioned Global Fragilities Act, I think that was Co-sponsored by Karen Bass.
Dr Jemima Pierre (35:13):
Karen Bass, and I forgot the name of the other person. Yes. It was two black
Dr Wilmer Leon (35:19):
Faces on two
Dr Jemima Pierre (35:20):
Black faces of the Empire. And if
Dr Wilmer Leon (35:22):
We go to the un, Linda Thomas Greenfield,
Dr Jemima Pierre (35:27):
And the State Department representative for the region is Brian Nichols. And this is the most disturbing part to me is because it wasn't always this way. So for Frederick Douglas, the great abolitionist, Frederick Douglas was sent to Haiti as a US representative in the late 18 hundreds, wasn't he? Ambassador? Yes. To sent to Haiti, and they really went, they sent him to actually negotiate to get this Bay Molson Nicola, which they still want actually to basically set up a base there, a US military base there. The Haitians have always gone against that, which is why they ended up setting up the base in Guantanamo Bay. So if you look at the map, it's a perfect way place for, it's between Cuba and Haiti, and this bay is there. And so it is perfect for the US ships to go through, get through the Panama Canal, wherever they need to get through to get to the Pacific.
(36:20)
And so Frederick Douglass came back and advocated against that on behalf of Haitians. He felt a responsibility. And he also have the NAACP wrote writing on behalf of Haiti during the occupation from 1915 to 1934, saying that this is talking about how Citibank was behind the occupation and how badly the US is treating Haitians and so on and so forth. It wasn't always this way. Now you have Colin Powell, Condoleezza Rice, and then you have Barack Obama because it was under Barack Obama that this latest political party was put in power. This neo Deval political party was put into power. And so you have this, and then you have them sending Brian Nichols who's trying to, who's behind pushing this intervention. So meeting with all of these people, getting the Caribbean, getting these, I call neo-colonial coons, whatever you want to call them, the head of Jamaica, the head of Barbados, the head neo motley, right?
(37:38)
Who's the UN's darling? Because apparently the word on the street is that she's up for the UN Security Council secretary general job. And so she's doing whatever needs to be done to get there. So the US has managed to get all these black people. Now, Kenya, who knows nothing about Haiti get this, Kenya did not even have diplomatic relations to Haiti with Haiti until last month right before the un vote. So Kenya knows nothing about Haiti. They're talking about training their police to speak French when the majority of Haitian people don't speak French, they speak Creole, right? And so part of that is to think about how easy it is to use black people to use black faces to do empires bidding. And I actually think China and Russia had been pushing against this intervention for the past two years. And I think this last time, after two years of pushing back, they abstained. And I think part of the reason they abstained is because you had all these black countries pressuring them. And I think one of the things is I also think they're looking out for themselves and their relationship with these countries in Africa and the Caribbean. So they stepped back and allowed this intervention to go forward. But I think they stepped back because it was the onslaught of pressure from the black countries on
Dr Wilmer Leon (38:56):
Them. But why abstain? Why not vote no and kill the deal?
Dr Jemima Pierre (39:03):
Right? Because that's what I'm saying. I think they're looking out for their own best interests. I think they don't want to ruin their relationships with these black countries who are pushing. I think that's part of that, right? So they voted no all along and this time, so if you have Nia Motley, you have Ruto, you have all these people saying, this is Pan-Africanism. We're going to go help our brothers and sisters in Haiti by sending a military intervention. That's what Ruto is using. They're using the language of Pan-Africanism Racom is using the language of helping our brothers, even though Caricom has some of the most draconian anti Haiti immigration policies, deportation rules, but they're all using this language. And I do think that actually applied the pressure that the US got them to apply on China. Russia actually worked to get them to abstain. At least they didn't vote yes. But the abstention, I think, is a result of the pressure.
Dr Wilmer Leon (39:55):
You mentioned the training of Haitian police through these Kenyan interlocutors or these Kenyan invaders, and these Kenyan forces have been labeled as Kenyan police. But from what I've read, they're not Kenyan police. They're Kenyan paramilitary forces that have a reputation of being incredibly, incredibly brutal against their own countrymen.
Dr Jemima Pierre (40:29):
Yeah, definitely. And what's most distressing about this situation is that the only solution that these people think that they can have for Haiti and Haitian is a violent military. One is the one that has to do with force. They never tried. They never tried diplomacy. They never tried actually sanctioning these elites that they know run guns into the country. So yeah, the thousand police is not police. It's pe, military force, but also Kenya has a terrible reputation in Somalia in the proxy war there going in there and devastating Somalis. And so for me, just because they're black, in fact, if anything, I think these police officers will treat Haitians worse because they're black in a way that they wouldn't, can you imagine sending a Kenyan police force to Europe? Or why not send a Kenyan police force to Ukraine to help? And so part of that to me is it is telling, and I want to quickly just say
Dr Wilmer Leon (41:36):
Briefly, oh, well, the reason you won't send those black Kenyan forces to Ukraine is because the Nazis, the racist Nazis in Ukraine would chop off their heads. That's why.
Dr Jemima Pierre (41:47):
Well, definitely. But this idea that it's easier to watch one black group kill another. Oh, no, no,
Dr Wilmer Leon (41:52):
No. I truly understand the basis of the
Dr Jemima Pierre (41:54):
Question. No, I know.
Dr Wilmer Leon (41:56):
Go ahead.
Dr Jemima Pierre (41:58):
Yes, yes, we know. We know. It's really distressing to think about that because look at what's happening right now in the Occupy territories where you have Zionist state destroying killing. And right now, as we know, more than 7,000 people, 3000 children, and we have an internal, so-called gang problem, but we're getting a chapter seven military deployment to invade Haiti. But Zionist state Z, its entity can get away with killing how many people, and nobody's thinking about sending a military force to stop this bombing. So just think about that. No, the
Dr Wilmer Leon (42:38):
Military force that's being sent is facilitating the bombing
Dr Jemima Pierre (42:41):
Is to facilitate it. And so I want people to make those connections because you have to think, well, why isn't it absurd to send an armed military force to deal with gangs? So-called gangs in Haiti, but you're not doing it for Jamaica, which has been under state of emergency for two years over gangs. You're not doing it in the Middle East. And so we have to think about, well, this makes no sense. This idea of a military invasion of Haiti makes no sense in light what's going on in light of Ukraine and in light of what's going on in the occupied territories.
Dr Wilmer Leon (43:13):
You mentioned China a little bit earlier, and I always say to folks, when you engage in these type of conversations, it's usually a good idea to have a map in front of you so that you can understand the geopolitics. So we know that China has been establishing relationships with Nicaragua. We know that China is establishing relationships with Guatemala, and those are in Central America. And we know that there's been discussions about China building a canal to rival a Panama Canal through Nicaragua. And we know that the United States does not want that to happen. And we'd also know that the United States has been anxious to build a naval base in Haiti. So if you could connect those dots. Am I wrong to, again, the show is connecting the dots. Am I wrong to connect those dots?
Dr Jemima Pierre (44:19):
No, you're not wrong at all. The Global Fragilities Act specifically names China and Russia. So let's get that clear. And so one of the things is the waning power of the empire, right? Because they know that what their military used to be able to do, they can't do anymore. Look, they got beat by the Taliban 20 years later. How many trillions of dollars they destroyed Iraq, when was the last time the US won a war? I mean, let's be real, except maybe World War ii. And even that,
Dr Wilmer Leon (44:51):
They
Dr Jemima Pierre (44:51):
Had a lot of help from the Red Army. Let's be real
Dr Wilmer Leon (44:54):
Panama,
Dr Jemima Pierre (44:55):
Right? Panama or
Dr Wilmer Leon (44:58):
A big, huge military power called Panama,
Dr Jemima Pierre (45:01):
Right? Grenada, we just celebrated the 40th anniversary of the invasion of Grenada. Or you land in Haiti and you send special forces and you remove the sitting president. So they know that they're losing militarily. They know that they cannot sustain the multiple fronts, but they also know the rise of China and Russia is inevitable. Not even. They're already there. And so they know that they can't compete. And so they have to figure out how to mitigate that. And I do think so. That connection is good. Do you know that Haiti is only one of 11 countries that recognizes Taiwan, right? So what does that tell you? And they were forced to recognize Taiwan. And I think, I don't remember if it was under Duvalier who was a staunch anti-communist and really terrorized
Dr Wilmer Leon (45:57):
Who forced Haiti to recognize Taiwan.
Dr Jemima Pierre (46:00):
It was the US government to right,
Dr Wilmer Leon (46:02):
But wait a bit, Dr. Pierre, that can't be because we have a one China policy. So how could that be?
Dr Jemima Pierre (46:09):
No, it's just really fascinating. The more I think about it, the more I come to know this history, and you realize, well, why is Haiti only one of 11 countries to recognize Taiwan? And why was Taiwan coming to Haiti to sign bilateral deals and so on and so forth? And so part of that is they've been able to keep Haiti as one of the few in the region as one of the few people to recognize Taiwan as opposed to China, even though the US itself, as you say, has a one China policy. So I do think this is all connected. I think the US is trying to entrench itself. It wants to be near Haiti, closer to Haiti because it's worried about Venezuela. It is still mad about Cuba. It's worried about this. You're right, this canal that Nicaragua wants to get with the help of China and war with China is inevitable.
(47:01)
They all know that because they know that that's the only way they can try to hold on to this flailing empire. And so they're going to need to do as much as they can, but because they don't have the strength from military numbers to the capacity, you have 800 bases. That's a vulnerability. So they're going to get other, look what's happening right now in the Middle East. Your bases are being attacked. They're sitting ducks. And so if you have all of these things there, if you can talk, some people still into the dirty work for you, which is why they have military exercises with the Caribbean operation Tradewinds, they have military exercises with West Africa, and so they want to use these as proxies the way that they use Ukraine as a proxy against Russia. So they're going to use these as proxies against China. And that's the connection, right? The connection is all about trying to maintain global dominance, but not having enough firepower, not having enough political power to do so. So then using these others while you still can to do the dirty work for you,
Dr Wilmer Leon (47:59):
Talk if you would please, about the Dominican Republic, the Dominican Republic's role as it relates to Haiti and Columbia as well. Because I think that I read a number of reports that some of the assassins that went into Haiti and assassinated President Maise were Columbia or were out of Columbia, and we know that Columbia is one of the training bases for the CIA as the CIA projects this power in Central and South America.
Dr Jemima Pierre (48:37):
Yeah. Well, so Columbia also outsources mercenaries, and so it's very easy to use trained
Dr Wilmer Leon (48:47):
By the
Dr Jemima Pierre (48:47):
United States, right? 23 out of the 26 mercenaries come out of Columbia. Columbia's interesting. And I'm not a Columbia expert. What's interesting is the fact that they elected this leftist president, but Columbia has a long history of, right-wing governments also would fey to the us. And so we have to ask Columbia, well, why are there still US military bases in Columbia, right? So why did they sign an agreement to be with NATO to be like a NATO ally, NATO ally? And so Columbia is definitely part of that. I think I forgot your question, but No,
Dr Wilmer Leon (49:25):
I was asking about the relationship between the Dominican Republic and Columbia as it relates to being proxies basically for the United States.
Dr Jemima Pierre (49:37):
Well, definitely, and I don't know. I know the relationship with Dominican Republic, with Haiti, and one of the things, Haiti during the Haitian Revolution took over the entire island to get rid of the Spanish and to end slavery. And it's a very complicated history. And after Haitians beat the French, they had to take over the entire island in order to stop the constant attacks that were coming around, but also they got rid of slavery. And so then the Spanish help the elites get back. That part of the island and the relationship has always been fraught. The Dominican Republic has a deep anti-Asian, which is very much deep in racism. And so then that you have is our legacy with the Dominican Republic is in 19 seven massacre, parsley massacre, where they chop down about 30,000 Haitians and dumped them in the river, which is why that river, if you've heard that, and it uses called Massacre River, is the Dominican Republic massacre.
(50:41)
And Haitians, they've always, with the 2004 Kuta, a lot of the paramilitaries were trained in the military in the Dominican Republic. A lot of the arms are going into from the Dominican Republic and this ab, who's one of the most racist, right-wing presidents of Dominican Republic has had been going after Haitians forever. So for example, in 2013, the Dominican Republic nationalized 240,000 people, Dominicans of Haitian descent going back eight generations. So these people were Dominicans and basically removed citizenship from them. And Ab Nair has been rounding up the Haitian workers that have been in the Dominican Republic for generations cutting cane and so on and so forth. And that itself is a result of policies in the region that impoverish people and force them to go out and provide cheap labor. So the Dominican Republic and Haiti have had a really acrimonious history, but then the US Border Patrol is helping the Dominican Republic build a wall to separate Haiti in the dr.
(51:45)
So the US' hand is always in there, and we always have to, it is not to take away agency from the Dominicans or from the Haitians, but the truth is the reason that Haiti becomes significance because one of the few places that's still fight back, and I don't think people realize it. And that's one thing you have to think about, HAES, not that it's a mess. The reason they're still going after is because it's still fighting back places like Jamaica, for example. I don't know if people saw, there's a report recently that Jamaicans have no regular, Jamaicans no longer have access to their beaches. They have all been privatized and owned by foreigners. And so what they've become is a captive labor force to provide labor for these resorts. Well, Haiti, we don't have that yet. I mean, we have it in the northern part where in La Bai, which the Duval sold to, I think Royal Caribbean cruises. But this is what they want for Haiti. They want to remove the people from the land where people still own a lot of their land, where the country's still predominantly agriculture. They want to remove them from the land, privatize everything, steal the land, and turn it into a captive labor force for capital. And so,
Dr Wilmer Leon (53:00):
Wait a minute. To that point, I read and that the Clintons have purchased an inordinate amount of land in Haiti to build a private resort. Basically the model, what's been done in Jamaica.
Dr Jemima Pierre (53:16):
Jamaica, definitely Jamaica, Barbados, all those places that the other thing we have to talk about, the mineral wealth in Haiti. Wait,
Dr Wilmer Leon (53:24):
And one more point real quick is that you talked about resistance. I believe if those Kenyan forces make land on Haiti,
Dr Jemima Pierre (53:38):
They won't know what's coming.
Dr Wilmer Leon (53:39):
They got to fight on their hands that be prepared to manage.
Dr Jemima Pierre (53:45):
Yeah, I don't think it is going to be as easy as they think. And
Dr Wilmer Leon (53:50):
You wanted to hit on the mineral.
Dr Jemima Pierre (53:52):
On the mineral. And people also don't remember, don't know that Haiti, you can look this up. There are all these reports that Haiti has millions minerals and that people want, in fact, when they decided to start mining for gold, the first person that got a mining permit was Hillary Clinton's brother,
Dr Wilmer Leon (54:14):
Brother out of Canada, right?
Dr Jemima Pierre (54:18):
And so we have to think about Canada too, because Canada's people think of Canada as like Little Brother and Peter, but Canada has been front and center. In fact, Canada still has big manufacturing hubs. Gildan still produces T-shirts and stuff like that in Haiti. So it's just really interesting to think about how I wanted to end by saying, this is not a victimization. I think people like to say, oh, poor Haitians. Oh, look at this. People suffer so much they can't get a break. And I'm like, well, the truth is they've been fighting back, which is why they can't get a break, and they're going to continue to fight back. And you can't only see them as perpetual victims. What you need to see is do analysis and connect the ways that all the, the ways that Empire has tried to keep the people down, despite the fact that they're standing up to fight back.
Dr Wilmer Leon (55:03):
You've got a hard stop. I greatly appreciate you giving me the time today. You talked about minerals. There are geological reports that show there may be more oil off the coast of Haiti than there is in Venezuela. Venezuela, and Venezuela has the largest reserv of oil in the world. Dr. Jamima Pierre, how can people find you, connect with you if they need to?
Dr Jemima Pierre (55:30):
Yeah. Well, you can find me on YouTube through all these various interviews and my publications all over just a basically
Dr Wilmer Leon (55:37):
Black agenda report
Dr Jemima Pierre (55:38):
And black agenda report, as well as the Black Alliance for Peace. We have a whole Haiti resource page.
Dr Wilmer Leon (55:43):
Dr. Jamima Pierre, thank you so much for your time. Really, really appreciate it.
Dr Jemima Pierre (55:48):
Thanks so much for having me.
Dr Wilmer Leon (55:50):
Thank you folks. I got to thank my guest, Dr. Jamima Pierre for joining me today. And thank you all so much for listening to the Connecting the Dots podcast with me, Dr. Wilmer Leon. Stay tuned for new episodes every week. Also, please follow and subscribe, leave a review, and please, please, please, please, baby. Please baby. Please share my show. Follow us on social media. You can find all the links below in the show description. Remember, this is where the analysis of politics, culture, and history converge because talk without analysis is just chatter, and we don't chatter on connecting the dots. See you again next time. Until then, I'm Dr. Woman Leon. Have a great one. Peace and blessings. I'm out
Speaker 1 (56:47):
Connecting the dots with Dr. Wilmer Leon, where the analysis of politics, culture, and history converge.