In this episode entrepreneur Mark Barnes and Daily Maverick editor at large Tim Cohen discuss branding - and that's not the kind you do to the cow. How important are brands (very), how do you work out what a brand is worth (complicated), and most importantly, how is Brand South Africa doing? (Even more complicated). Conclusion: SA’s brand has taken a knock, but it's holding up, and potentially could be a lot better. How? Listen up.Production and Editing by Tevya Turok Shapiro.

Music & Design by Bernard Kotze.

Created by Mark Barnes, Tim Cohen, Bernard Kotze & Branko Brkic.