Sign up to save your podcasts
Or
Share What It Means to Know an Animal
Share to email
Share to Facebook
Share to X
Share to email
Share to Facebook
Share to X
Or
What It Means to Know an Animal
An elephant pauses at a crossroads. Her trunk rises, testing the air. She weighs memory, social awareness, the quality of the wind — then commits to a path. What does she know? And what follows, for science and for ethics, if we take that question seriously? In this talk, Liv Baker shows that animals are knowers — beings with rich, embodied, relational knowledge of their worlds — and that this singular recognition, pursued with rigor and honesty, unsettles much of what we think we know about animal wellbeing, autonomy, and what it even means to study animal lives. Drawing on her research with elephants and a framework she calls Spheres of Wellbeing, Baker makes the case that taking animal inner lives seriously is not simply a methodological adjustment. It is a commitment — to treating animals as subjects rather than objects, in how we ask our questions, design our studies, and decide what we are and are not willing to do in the name of knowledge.
HOSTS & GUESTS
Dr. Liv Baker, PhD, is a conservation behaviourist, and a founder of the emergent field of compassionate conservation. She is Fellow and Chair of the Board at PAN Works, Research Director for Mahouts Elephant Foundation, and honorary adjunct professor at the University of British Columbia, where she earned her PhD in Animal Welfare Science and Applied Animal Biology. https://panworks.io/team/name/liv-baker/
William S. Lynn, PhD (Bill) is President and founder of PAN Works and host of the PAN Thinks podcast. https://panworks.io/team/name/william-lynn/
Production is by Gary Sheer. https://garysheerphotography.com/
Recorded on 28 May 2026.
Episode art by Rohit Varma on UnSplash. https://unsplash.com/photos/a-group-of-elephants-playing-KB4M14SbvXA
FROM THIS EPISODE
Baker, L. (2025). Should (and Can) Declarations on Animal Consciousness Go Further? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zY_fw6pmJCE
Baker, L., King, B. J., & Lynn, W. S. (2024). Rethinking Animal Consciousness Research to Prioritize Well-Being. Cambridge Quarterly of Healthcare Ethics, 1–5. https://doi.org/10.1017/S0963180124000501
Baker, L., Pauketat, J., Blaine, S., Greer, C., Howansky, K., Massiot, E., Maarschalkerweerd, M. V., & Winkler, R. (2025). Autonomy: An Indicator of Wellbeing in Rewilded Asian Elephants Connected to Karen Communities in Thailand. Society & Animals, 1–26. https://doi.org/10.1163/15685306-bja10252
🎧 Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/pan-thinks/id1870689174
▶️ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@panworksio
🌐 Learn More: https://panworks.io/
🐾 Support: https://www.zeffy.com/en-US/donation-form/donate-for-animal-wellbeing
View all episodes
By PAN WorksAn elephant pauses at a crossroads. Her trunk rises, testing the air. She weighs memory, social awareness, the quality of the wind — then commits to a path. What does she know? And what follows, for science and for ethics, if we take that question seriously? In this talk, Liv Baker shows that animals are knowers — beings with rich, embodied, relational knowledge of their worlds — and that this singular recognition, pursued with rigor and honesty, unsettles much of what we think we know about animal wellbeing, autonomy, and what it even means to study animal lives. Drawing on her research with elephants and a framework she calls Spheres of Wellbeing, Baker makes the case that taking animal inner lives seriously is not simply a methodological adjustment. It is a commitment — to treating animals as subjects rather than objects, in how we ask our questions, design our studies, and decide what we are and are not willing to do in the name of knowledge.
HOSTS & GUESTS
Dr. Liv Baker, PhD, is a conservation behaviourist, and a founder of the emergent field of compassionate conservation. She is Fellow and Chair of the Board at PAN Works, Research Director for Mahouts Elephant Foundation, and honorary adjunct professor at the University of British Columbia, where she earned her PhD in Animal Welfare Science and Applied Animal Biology. https://panworks.io/team/name/liv-baker/
William S. Lynn, PhD (Bill) is President and founder of PAN Works and host of the PAN Thinks podcast. https://panworks.io/team/name/william-lynn/
Production is by Gary Sheer. https://garysheerphotography.com/
Recorded on 28 May 2026.
Episode art by Rohit Varma on UnSplash. https://unsplash.com/photos/a-group-of-elephants-playing-KB4M14SbvXA
FROM THIS EPISODE
Baker, L. (2025). Should (and Can) Declarations on Animal Consciousness Go Further? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zY_fw6pmJCE
Baker, L., King, B. J., & Lynn, W. S. (2024). Rethinking Animal Consciousness Research to Prioritize Well-Being. Cambridge Quarterly of Healthcare Ethics, 1–5. https://doi.org/10.1017/S0963180124000501
Baker, L., Pauketat, J., Blaine, S., Greer, C., Howansky, K., Massiot, E., Maarschalkerweerd, M. V., & Winkler, R. (2025). Autonomy: An Indicator of Wellbeing in Rewilded Asian Elephants Connected to Karen Communities in Thailand. Society & Animals, 1–26. https://doi.org/10.1163/15685306-bja10252
🎧 Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/pan-thinks/id1870689174
▶️ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@panworksio
🌐 Learn More: https://panworks.io/
🐾 Support: https://www.zeffy.com/en-US/donation-form/donate-for-animal-wellbeing