In 2001, when writer Jill McCabe Johnson heard the details about a newly caught "Green River Killer" named Gary, she thought a few of the details matched a man she met and took home from a country-western bar in Seattle as a young and eager 18 year old girl. However familiar the description was, she shrugged it off first as a coincidence. Then, the more evidence mounted, the more it became undeniable that it was the same Gary she remembered sitting outside her own apartment a decade before. This June, Jill used her writing and investigative skills to pen an essay about her chilling discovery for Slate. As a prolific poet, Jill was used to an audience, but this story attracted attention and interest from thousands worldwide. Many wrote in to share their own close calls with serial killers, including Ted Bundy. 

Jill joins me this week to talk about her chance meeting with a serial killer who later was convicted of killing 49 women and girls (probably more), one of those victims also living in her same apartment complex. She shares how most serial killers come across not only normal, but charming and charismatic, and her conflicting emotions around this story even to this day. Jill opens up about why she decided to write Gary Leon Ridgway as he lived out his sentence at a Washington State penitentiary. Lastly, Jill gives great memoir writing advice for owning your pain without being a victim, and transcending your self pity.