What happens when a mountain lion advocate, a sheep producer, and a houndsman sit down to talk about the future of mountain lions in Utah?

In this episode of The Wildlife Wire, Samantha Miller is joined by three people whose relationships with mountain lions could hardly look more different: Denise of Utah Mountain Lion Conservation, southern Utah sheep producer and houndsman Andy Rice, and lifelong hunter and houndsman Aaron Johnson.

Despite coming from different backgrounds, they have found substantial common ground: Utah needs to return to sustainable, science-based mountain lion management.

The conversation explores how Utah’s approach to mountain lions has changed in recent years, including the removal of harvest limits, year-round hunting and concerns about a state effort to lethally remove lions in an attempt to increase deer numbers.

Andy offers a particularly compelling perspective from the livestock community. After years of raising sheep in lion country, he says his experience has shown that a stable population of mature, territorial mountain lions can actually reduce livestock losses. Removing established cats can create instability as younger, transient lions move into newly vacant territories.

Aaron discusses what houndsmen are seeing on the ground, including concerns about declining age classes, fewer mature lions and the long-term consequences of treating predator removal as a primary strategy for increasing deer populations.

The group also tackles a question that often gets lost in polarized wildlife debates: What if people who value mountain lions for very different reasons worked together on the things they agree on?

They discuss targeted responses to livestock depredation, sustainable harvest limits, the role of hunters and houndsmen in conservation, and why maintaining stable mountain lion populations can benefit livestock producers, hunters, wildlife watchers—and the lions themselves.

It is a conversation about predators, hunting, agriculture and conservation, but also about something increasingly rare in wildlife politics: finding common ground.

In this episode:

Mark and Sam are joined by John Calfa III, co-host of The Wolf Connection Podcast, for a conversation about wolves, storytelling, conservation, and the connections between humans and the natural world.

John shares how The Wolf Connection Podcast began during the COVID shutdown and has grown into hundreds of conversations with scientists, authors, conservationists, artists, ranchers, hunters, photographers, and naturalists. He also takes us inside the work of Wolf Connection, a sanctuary in Southern California that provides a permanent home for rescued wolves and wolfdogs while using their stories to create transformative experiences for youth, veterans, and other participants.

The conversation explores lessons John has learned from guests including Dan Flores, Kira Cassidy, Julie Argyle, and Marc Bekoff; the intersection of science, art, culture, and conservation; the challenges facing wolves today; and the importance of creating space for different perspectives in often-polarized wildlife debates.

John also reflects on what a decade at Wolf Connection has taught him personally—from finding authenticity and emotional balance to simply learning how to be present with another species. At the center of it all is a simple idea: wolves can serve as powerful teachers, reminding us that humans are not separate from nature, but part of it.

Find out more about the Wolf Connection:

Wolf Connection

Wolf Connection Podcast

Project Coyote and ColoradoWild present Dan Flores in Denver on September 22:

The American Serengeti with Dan Flores

Project Coyote

Center for Biological Diversity’s campaign to protect Mollie’s Pack

Saving Wolves

Joel Sartore — the Photo Ark in your backyard 

Mark and Sam sit down with National Geographic photographer, explorer, author, and conservationist Joel Sartore, founder of the National Geographic Photo Ark.

For more than two decades, Joel has traveled the world photographing more than 17,000 species as part of an ambitious effort to document biodiversity and inspire people to protect wildlife and the habitats they depend on. We talk with Joel about the stories behind some of the Photo Ark’s most unforgettable animals, how the project grew from a Nebraska zoo into a global conservation movement, the role photography can play in changing how people see wildlife, and why protecting biodiversity ultimately means protecting ourselves.

Joel also discusses the newly released 20th Anniversary Edition of The Photo Ark: Animals of Earth and the new Photo Ark: Animals of Earth exhibit at the National Geographic Museum of Exploration in Washington, D.C.

Learn more about Joel, explore the Photo Ark, and see his books and photography at www.joelsartore.com. 

This episode looks at common misinformation campaigns used to oppose pro-wildlife efforts, including messaging that discourages public involvement and leans heavily on “trust the experts.” Sam and Mark break down how these narratives are constructed and why they are effective. They also examine the role of science versus values in wildlife decisions and what that means for public participation.

Dr. Becky Niemiec's analysis of Prop 127

“Ballot Box Biology:” The Myth That Stopped Proposition 127—and Could Shape the Future of Wildlife Protection

This episode breaks down how wildlife legislation actually moves through the political process. Bills begin with a core concept, but are quickly reshaped by stakeholder input, requiring tradeoffs between policy goals and what is operationally and politically feasible.

Mark and Sam get real on how wildlife "management" decisions are made, discuss science-based management and what it means for Colorado residents and wildlife.

Join Sam and Mark as they wrap up their first full year hosting the Wildlife Wire! Thank you to all who have listened throughout the year. We look forward to sharing our thoughts and guests with you.

On this episode we have:

On today's episode Samantha and Mark discuss the interesting wildlife news, including:

Join Sam and Mark as they dive into top wildlife news stories from across the country.

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Ryan Sedgeley from the Endangered Species Coalition joins Mark and Sam for this special Halloween episode. They discuss myths about wolves, coyotes, and prairie dogs, as well as zombie deer and frogs coming back from the dead.