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This week, Jenny and Sarah tackle the HR landmines small businesses step on all the time.

They break down three compliance issues that quietly turn into very loud, very expensive problems: employee misclassification, messy PTO policies, and unpaid interns who legally aren’t interns.

First: employee misclassification. Paying someone a salary does not make them exempt. Titles don’t matter. Good intentions don’t matter. If someone should’ve been earning overtime and wasn’t, the Department of Labor is not interested in your logic. They’re interested in back pay and penalties.

Then: PTO policies. That “use it or lose it” language still floating around in Colorado? Illegal. Accrued PTO is earned wages. You cannot wipe it out at year-end. They also break down accrual vs. lump sum, payout rules, and why negative PTO feels generous until someone quits and payroll gets messy.

Finally: unpaid interns. The “it’s for experience” kind. The “my friend’s kid needs exposure” kind. The rules are stricter than people think. If the company is benefiting more than the intern, you likely have an employee. And that risk adds up fast.

If you think “we’ve always done it this way” is a solid strategy, this episode might stress you out a little. In a good way.

What’s inside this episode:

[03:12] Why paying someone a salary does not automatically make them exempt
[06:45] The real difference between exempt and non-exempt under FLSA
[10:18] How misclassification turns into back wages, penalties, and audits
[15:02] Why independent contractor status isn’t a “mutual agreement” situation
[19:37] What the Department of Labor actually looks at
[24:11] Why “use it or lose it” PTO policies are illegal in Colorado
[28:26] Accrued vs. lump-sum PTO and where companies get into trouble
[32:54] The negative PTO trap no one thinks through
[36:40] The strict rules around unpaid internships
[41:12] How to structure internships so they’re actually compliant

Hit play. Fix what needs fixing. Then send it to the friend who still thinks titles determine exemption status.

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 This week, Jenny and Sarah tackle a topic that somehow manages to be both extremely relatable and extremely lawsuit-y: swearing at work.

It starts with a law update that made both of them do a double take. Turns out, “letting an F-word fly” at work is no longer just a culture question. In some cases, it is a legal one. And in 2024 and 2025, the courts made that line a lot thinner than it used to be.

What’s inside this episode:

[05:32] Why swearing can make you seem more authentic and more trustworthy, according to research

[12:17] Why that same swearing can still get your company sued

[14:56] The court cases that changed the rules around hostile work environment claims

[15:55] Why one single comment can now be enough to trigger serious legal trouble

[25:09] The difference between swearing at the printer and swearing at a person

[17:17] Why gender-specific and identity-based slurs are basically a career-ending choice

[18:13] How different industries and different countries treat workplace language very differently

[28:31] The impossible spot employers are in between the EEOC and the NLRB

[34:25] Why “that’s just how our industry is” is not a legal defense

[35:48] What new grads and early-career employees should do about swearing at work (hint: don’t)

[39:03] How much these lawsuits actually cost companies when things go wrong

[40:30] Why culture always starts at the top, for better or worse

Jenny and Sarah are not here to pretend nobody ever swears. They are here to explain why the workplace is a different arena, why intent does not protect you from impact, and why “we’ve always done it this way” is a very expensive strategy.

Hit play for some uncomfortable truths, a few wild stories, and a very clear explanation of why the law does not care how authentic you feel. 

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This week, Jenny and Sarah start the year by doing what they do best: collecting a pile of workplace nonsense from the internet and asking the uncomfortable question.

Why are we still building work like people are machines?

They bounce through everything from four-day workweek studies to open offices, from job hunting on dating apps to LinkedIn slowly becoming Facebook with certificates. Somewhere in the middle, they land on the real issue: work keeps taking more, and nobody seems able to say “that’s enough.”

This episode is a grab bag of trends, but the throughline is simple. We are tired. And the system is pretending that’s a personal problem instead of a design flaw.

What’s inside this episode:

• Why working less shouldn’t just make you a better worker, but a better human
• The real reason open offices exist and why nobody can focus in them
• Why people are using dating apps to find jobs now
• How LinkedIn lost the plot
• What “ghost promotions,” “career shrekking,” “midlife collision,” and “culture rot” actually mean
• Why some countries are making after-hours work illegal
• The uncomfortable conversation about unions and power at work
• Why “just set boundaries” sounds great and works terribly in real life

Jenny and Sarah don’t pretend there’s an easy fix. They do argue that modern work is slowly eating everything else and calling it ambition.

If you’ve ever looked at your job and thought, “This is too much, but I don’t see a way out,” this one will feel uncomfortably familiar.

Hit play. Then go close your laptop.

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Rebroadcast: We’re bringing back one of our favorite episodes as hiring ramps up in the new year—and it’s just as relevant now as ever!

In this laugh-and-learn episode, Jenny and Sarah take you inside the beautiful mess of modern recruiting. From jaw-dropping candidate missteps to the surprising rise of parental involvement in job applications (yes, it’s happening), they break down what’s really going on behind the interview screen. With plenty of humor and hard-earned HR wisdom, this episode serves up real talk on how to stand out—in a good way. Whether you're hiring or job hunting, you'll leave with practical tips, a few "you can’t make this up" moments, and a better sense of what professionalism actually looks like today.

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Development planning is the most ignored, and most misunderstood, part of performance management.

In this episode of WTF is Business Casual, HR consultants Jenny Levy and Sarah Burston break down why development planning deserves its own lane and why bundling it into performance reviews quietly wrecks employee growth, engagement, and retention.

This is Part Two of their performance management series, focused on the forward-looking side of work.

What’s inside this episode:

• Why development planning deserves its own conversation separate from performance reviews
• Why tying development to compensation creates false expectations
• What Individual Development Plans are supposed to do versus what they usually become
• Why training is the smallest piece of real development
• How on-the-job learning actually builds skills leaders care about
• The problem with leaders deciding career paths without asking employees what they want
• Why succession planning often ignores human reality
• How lateral moves develop people without inflating titles
• Why growth doesn’t look the same in every season of life
• What leaders owe employees when they say they “care about development”

Listen to Part 1: Performance Reviews Are Broken (Part 1): The Messy Reality of Workplace Evaluation

Want Practical Tools Without Corporate Jargon?

Jenny and Sarah also share details about upcoming free HR training sessions through Rise HR, focused on continuous feedback, development tools, and modern performance management for small and mid-size businesses.

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This week, Jenny and Sarah drag the workplace ritual everyone hates: performance reviews. They open with a simple truth HR has known forever. Nobody likes them, nobody trusts them, and nobody thinks they actually work. Managers dread writing them. Employees dread reading them. Yet here we are, still clinging to a system that feels older than a fax machine.

And yes, they get into the cultural shift that has managers terrified to say anything direct, the rise of “triggered” responses in the workplace, and the confusion leaders feel when employees treat normal feedback like a personal attack. The conversation gets honest about accountability, psychological safety, and why discomfort is not the same as danger.

What’s inside this episode:

• Why everyone complains about performance reviews but nobody changes them
• The four pieces of performance management that companies mix up constantly
• What continuous feedback actually looks like when it’s not performative nonsense
• Why managers need to stop blending praise, coaching, and conflict into one chaotic meeting
• The problem with leaders who want to fire someone but never documented a thing
• When corrective action is appropriate — and why clarity matters more than comfort
• The real difference between doing your job and “going above and beyond”
• Why market adjustments, merit, promotions, and bonuses should never be lumped together
• How generational shifts and therapy language have changed workplace conversations
• What managers owe employees, what employees owe themselves, and what HR is tired of explaining

Jenny and Sarah don’t pretend performance reviews are going anywhere tomorrow. But they do challenge the entire way we think about them, and push for a version that’s clearer, kinder, and way less convoluted.

Hit play for unfiltered HR truth, some laughs, and the reassurance that if you hate performance reviews, you’re not alone, and you’re not wrong.

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Cold and flu season has arrived, and Jenny and Sarah have officially reached their breaking point. This week, they break down the circus of people dragging themselves into the office sick, logging onto Zoom while sweating through a fever, or insisting it’s “just allergies” in the middle of December.

From vomiting kids to adults powering through meetings mid-retch, this episode gets blunt about how unhinged workplace culture has become around “pushing through.” The hosts explain why showing up sick isn’t brave, why it’s often selfish, and why everyone else is tired of catching your germs.

This week’s chaos includes:

• A car ride that felt like a biohazard event
• A client who tried to finish a Zoom call while actively throwing up
• Kids who refuse to drink water and are confused when their throat hurts
• Adults claiming “winter allergies” while running a fever
• Jenny’s emergency plan for vomiting during a video call (step one: slam laptop shut)
• How France sees working sick as selfish while the U.S. calls it dedication
• The badge-of-honor culture that keeps people working when they should be in bed
• The germ gauntlet of parenting small children
• People with paid sick leave who refuse to take it
• A reminder that potluck food handled by children should be illegal

Jenny and Sarah say it plainly:
If you're too sick to be in the office, you're too sick to “just check email.”

Take the day.
Drink some water.
Stop distributing your germs like confetti.

Key takeaways:

1. Your company can replace you faster than it can fix your immune system.
2. Rest is essential, not optional.
3. No one is impressed when you show up sick.
4. Closing your laptop immediately removes you from a Teams call. Use that information wisely.

Listen in for an unfiltered breakdown of why sick-at-work culture makes no sense, why boundaries matter, and why rest is part of being a functioning adult human.

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Welcome back to WTF is Business Casual, where HR consultants Jenny Levy and Sarah Bursten roast, rant, and reality-check the weird stuff that somehow passes for “normal” in the workplace.

This week we’re calling out all the things people still think are fine at work, but absolutely aren’t.

From awkward hugs to speakerphone oversharers, cubicles that look like dorm rooms, and the office “Happy Birthday” song no one actually enjoys, Jenny and Sarah break down what’s WTF-acceptable and what’ll get you side-eyed by HR.

WTF Moments & Hot Takes:

• Hugging at work. Friendly or lawsuit waiting to happen? (Hint: keep your hands to yourself.)
• Cubicle clutter. Your desk isn’t a daycare or a personal museum.
• Being BFFs with your boss. How “we’re just friends” turns into “why did HR call me in?”
• Reply All crimes. Stop hitting that button, Sally. Just. Stop.
• Forced birthday singing. Why workplace celebrations feel more like hostage situations.
• Speakerphone culture. If we can hear your conversation, it’s already gone too far.
• The unspoken workplace rules. The stuff you’ll never find in an employee handbook (but should).

Jenny and Sarah also unpack how corporate culture has shifted from “we dealt with it” to “I’m reporting you,” and why that might be both progress and a buzzkill.

Because let’s be honest. We can’t have nice things anymore.

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Gen Z has officially entered the chat and corporate America isn’t ready.

Jenny and Sarah rip into the chaos (and low-key brilliance) of the newest generation in the workplace. Are they entitled job hoppers with no soft skills… or the only ones brave enough to call BS on burnout culture? 

Spoiler: it’s complicated — and very, very human.

They unpack everything from Gen Z’s allergy to fake leadership to why they’ll quit faster than you can say “circle back.” Plus, the hosts drag every generation (including their own) through the mud for good measure.

You’ll get:

• The truth about Gen Z’s “bad attitude” and why it’s actually a boundary
• How pandemic schooling and parenting styles rewired workplace expectations
• Real talk on feedback, flexibility, and why managers need to grow up too
• The tension between “just do your job” and “I need meaning in my job”
• A mirror moment for HR pros who keep trying to lead with policies instead of people

Because every generation swears the next one’s the problem, but maybe Gen Z’s just the first one bold enough to say the quiet part out loud.

Hit play.
Laugh a little, cringe a lot, and maybe rethink how you talk about “kids these days.”

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Employers love to say they support work-life balance and encourage you to take your PTO. But here’s the workplace reality: when employees actually unplug, they’re often seen as less committed, and less promotable. Welcome to the detachment paradox.

In this episode of WTF is Business Casual?!, Jenny and Sarah unpack the HR bias that rewards “always on” employees and punishes those who set healthy boundaries. It’s the messed-up cycle that fuels employee burnout, slows career growth, and leaves leaders scratching their heads about why people keep quitting.

Drawing from corporate HR experience, research from Harvard Business Review, and their own stories, the hosts get candid about how organizations really evaluate “commitment” at work—and why leaders need to rethink what performance looks like.

In this conversation, you’ll hear:

• Why workplace detachment (logging off, PTO, boundaries) helps performance but hurts promotions
• How unconscious HR bias still favors visibility and “green dot” culture over results
• Real stories of burnout, PTO guilt, and leaders who say “set boundaries” but expect 24/7 availability
• The generational clash over hustle culture, career growth, and work-life expectations
• What France’s “Right to Disconnect” law shows us about protecting employee wellbeing
• How commitment bias skews performance reviews and promotability decisions

Jenny and Sarah also get personal about their different leadership styles. One is wired to respond immediately, the other is comfortable letting things wait, and how those differences play out when managing clients, careers, and sanity.

If you’ve ever been penalized for taking a vacation, wondered why promotions go to the loudest hustlers, or debated whether “healthy boundaries” and “career growth” can actually co-exist in today’s workplace, this episode is for you.

We want your take. Have you seen the detachment paradox play out in your own company? Or caught yourself judging employees (or yourself) for unplugging? Share your story with us on Instagram @wtfisbusinesscasual.

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