Recorded from a perch above the white sand dunes of Lake Michigan, this episode is part love letter to Camp Miniwanca, part reckoning with the state of academia, and full-bodied remembrance of what true freedom feels like—beyond the metrics, meetings, and masked brilliance.

Dr. Robyn McKay and Dr. Barbara Kerr drop in from Professor Camp, where each summer, faculty from across the country gather to reconnect with the parts of themselves that don’t fit on a CV.

In this episode, we talk about:

• The paradox of intellect in America—why professors are resented and revered
• Barb’s new book, The Psychology of Liberty, and what we’ve lost in our cultural definition of “freedom”
• Time poverty and the myth of virtuous overwork
• The heartbreak of masking your brilliance just to survive
• Why creative kids—and the adults they grow into—need each other
• What it actually feels like to be free (spoiler: it’s not a tax cut)
• Community as refuge, rest as rebellion, and nature as reminder

We also share personal stories of leaving the academy, reclaiming creativity, and finding flow again—whether in a desert in Arizona, or under the Icelandic sky.

Mentioned in this episode:

• The Psychology of Liberty by Dr. Barbara Kerr - you can order your copy from your favorite indy bookstore - please & thank you!
• The cultural co-opting of freedom
• Smart girls, creative misfits, and masked intellectuals
• Rest, rebellion, and redefining success
• The birds. Yes, you can hear them.

🎙 Listen now to The One Where We Remember What Freedom Feels Like.

Then maybe take a nap. Consider it revolutionary.

if you're interested in having your personality tested and interpreted by the two of us, or you're ready to bring us in to work with your teams, Get started by sending an email to [email protected] and we'll help you start the process.

Don't forget to follow us on Instagram for more behind the scenes fun from the farm, creative insights, and plenty of laughs from the reels that I'm constantly posting in stories. You can find us on instagram at @twoshrinksonthefarm.

Last thing: we'd really love it if you'd rate and review our podcast on whatever platform you listen to us on - and share us with your buddies - the more the merrier!