In this week's episode, Carol Schultz sits down with Beth Goff- McMillan, CEO of SKG and founder/CEO of FOLIO, to dig into how office design has completely transformed since COVID—and why most companies are stuck in what Beth calls a "vortex of confusion" about what their workspace should even be.

Beth shares 30 years of industry insight on the shift from rigid cubicle layouts to fully open offices to today's hybrid chaos, and explains why the real question leaders need to ask isn't "what furniture do we buy" but "why do we even need an office." They get into what makes employees actually want to come back in (hint: it's not ping pong tables), the most expensive and most overlooked design mistakes companies make, and how a simple employee survey can save a business tens of thousands of dollars. The episode wraps with a look at FOLIO, the tech platform Beth built to drag a notoriously slow-moving industry into the SaaS era.

Takeaways

1. Most leaders are stuck on "what" to put in their office instead of asking "why" they need an office at all.
2. Return-to-office policies alone don't drive engagement or productivity—you need clear KPIs tied to purpose.
3. Employee surveys (before AND after a redesign) can prevent massively expensive, unused investments.
4. Noise and acoustics should be the #1 design priority post-COVID—people need more visual/sound barriers, not fewer.
5. Gimmicks like ping pong and shuffleboard tables rarely get used and often signal a lack of real design intent.
6. Storage and file cabinets are some of the most expensive—and most unnecessary—line items in office design.
7. "Resi-mercial" design (home-like textures, plants, varied seating) makes employees feel more connected and productive.
8. Large conference rooms often go underused—flexible lounge spaces can replace them entirely.
9. Workplace design decisions involve far more stakeholders than people expect: C-suite, facilities, HR, IT, and legal.
10. The furniture/design industry is still behind on technology—and AI-driven tools are starting to close that gap.

Chapters

00:00 Intro: How office spaces have transformed since COVID

01:49 What SKG actually does (workplace strategy, design, furniture procurement)

03:10 30 years of office evolution: from Dilbert cubicles to fully open floors

05:33 The "vortex of confusion"—why nobody has a playbook anymore

07:07 Shifting the conversation from "what" to "why"

09:24 Three things every workspace needs to succeed post-COVID

11:29 "I wanted to earn their commute"—how design changed employee behavior

12:48 Why noise and acoustics should be priority #1

14:21 Dress codes, client expectations, and reading the room

16:17 Two things to leave out of your office (gimmicks & excess storage)

18:41 Bringing "resi-mercial" design into the workplace

23:11 Who SKG actually meets with—from CEOs to facilities to legal

25:19 The survey that saved a client from a costly coffee bar mistake

28:21 Redesigning SKG's own HQ: what worked and what didn't

33:04 The privacy/acoustics fail—and how they fixed it

36:47 Why Beth joined SKG and what keeps her there 11 years later

39:03 Folio: building the first SaaS tool for the furniture dealership industry

43:11 Current bottlenecks: training talent in a fast-changing industry

45:00 Final thoughts

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