30 with Guyon Espiner

The rugby great became the face of mental health in New Zealand, so why does he think he’s failed and what does he plan to do about it? Plus, he challenges Guyon to open up about his own health and asks if New Zealand’s macho culture has really changed.

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Season 2 Episode 5

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Labour's Barbara Edmonds talks to Guyon about the huge fiscal challenges ahead for NZ and whether it's time to lift the superannuation age. Plus, the heart-breaking backstory that motivated her to get into Politics.

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Season 2 Episode 4

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Former White House staffer, John Bolton, on why a second term for Trump would be far worse than his first. Plus, he tells Guyon why it's time for New Zealand to rethink its nuclear-free policy.

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Season 2 Episode 3

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Author of “The Subtle Art of Not Giving a F*ck” Mark Manson, talks to Guyon about the potential upsides of AI therapy and the reasons so many Americans idolise Trump. Plus, he reveals how his life completely changed after visiting NZ.

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Season 2 Episode 2

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ANZ's Antonia Watson talks to Guyon about billion dollar bank profits, whether we're paying too much for our mortgages and why she thinks it's time for a Capital gains tax.

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Season 2 Episode 1

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Geopolitics expert Peter Zeihan tells Guyon what New Zealand needs to do right now if it wants to survive the end of globalisation, why China's days are numbered, and who's going to win the US election.

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A frightening future awaits for much of the world.

That's the prediction of Peter Zeihan, a graduate of Otago University who has become a best selling author on geopolitics and international relations.

His book The End of the World is Just the Beginning was a New York Times best seller in 2022.

Guyon Espiner asked Peter Zeihan, two years on, with the possible return of Donald Trump to the White House, how does he see global tensions playing out and what might this mean for New Zealand?

Your book came out in 2022. Have you cheered up at all since then?

“No, because since the book came out, the Ukraine war has gotten hot and heavy, and we're seeing the beginnings of a very, very probably end of days-style trade dispute between the entire world and the Chinese.

“There are definitely some specifics here and there that have been a little bit more optimistic than I thought, but the bare bones, the idea that the structures that brought us everything in the last 75 years, that they're dying, unfortunately, that's pretty baked in at this point.”

One of the key planks that you write about is the end of globalisation. Why will that happen?

“At the end of World War 2, the Americans found themselves looking across the plains of Europe at the red armies and realising this was not a fight we could win, we needed millions of people to not just stand up, but to stand between the US and the Soviet army.

“And since the Europeans had just been through the most horrific war in human history, getting them to sign up for an open-ended conflict was going to require some severe inducement.

“Globalisation was [the United States’] answer.

“We would send our Navy out - the only Navy to survive the war - and patrol the open ocean so that anyone could send any cargo anywhere, import anything from anywhere, access any market anywhere, if in exchange, you would sign up for the Cold War.

“And that gave us the world that we know.

“But never ever, ever forget that it was always a byproduct of an American security plan that honestly has now been outdated for 30 years.

"[In addition,] as we all globalised, we also industrialised and urbanised.

"When you live on a farm, kids are free labour, but when you move into a condo in a city, kids are an expense…

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Champion boxer Mea Motu gets real about what motivates her in the ring, how her kids saved her life, and why she won’t stay silent on domestic abuse.

*Content warning: Contains discussions of domestic violence and suicide.

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Season 1 Episode 9

Mea Motu is a world champion boxer, but before she even got into the ring as a professional, she had to fight for her own life.

Mea Motu escaped an abusive relationship, which went on for years leaving her homeless at times and fearing for her life.

She's boxed with a broken rib, a dislocated shoulder and asthma, all the while raising five children and speaking out about domestic violence and mental health.

Mea only started her professional boxing career in 2020. Now she's a world champion. She tells Guyon Espiner how she’s done it.

“Just hard work and hard dedication. A lot of sacrifice. But also, I've had a lot of support with family.

“The biggest support is my gym, and my coach and his wife [Isaac and Alina Peach] who have backed me, supported me, believed in me, and invested in me.”

Winning the World Title in 2023 with a broken rib - and not telling her coach beforehand.

“No! I was scared that he might pull me out of the title and reschedule me. And this was my one-shot opportunity, and I didn't want to lose that.

“It was a big challenge. It was very mental. It was really trying to hold myself together, finding certain positions to work around and not get hit there. I did get hit there.

“But also, just embracing the punch and trying to attack with it. So, it was very hard and difficult. I didn't find it easy, but I luckily had the guidance of my cornermen.”

Defending the World Title with a dislocated shoulder

“The belief of [my] cornerman and my coach [enabled me to win.] He just knows what to say. He knows how to intuit me and make me believe I know who I am and what I'm fighting for.

“And he knows how to really just grab my attention and be like, ‘are you OK?’

“He checks that I'm OK no matter what. Every time I come back. ‘Are you OK?’ And I'm like, ‘yes.’ ‘Anything hurting?’ And I'm like, ‘yes.’

“And then he'll find a strategy of how we can get through it. He knows us inside and out. That's his job as a coach.

“It's really mental. The physical is the easiest…

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Waikato-Tainui leader Tuku Morgan tells Guyon why he's so fired about the backlash against te reo, how young Māori have the power to change the future and why he's not sorry about that underwear scandal.

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Season 1 Episode 8

Tukoroirangi Morgan helped establish Māori Television, has been the spokesman for the Māori King, and was once described as the most reviled politician in New Zealand.

He grew up in poverty, in a home where te reo Māori was the first language and has spent his life fighting for that language, as a journalist, a politician, a member of the Kiingitanga, and - currently - as chair of Waikato Tainui.

Now, he says that Māori face an existential battle against the government for their rights, their culture, and their language.

Guyon Espiner asks Tuku about whether he stands by his recent claim: that the government have rendered Māori an almost nullity.

"Absolutely. There are achievements that have been won as a result of courage and determination by our forebears."

"Leaders before my time were able to fashion a pathway so that people like me and my grandchildren could enjoy Te Reo Māori, and have the opportunity to do things for ourselves, both socially and environmentally."

"As the chair of Waikato-Tainui, I have a responsibility to make sure that those things that were entrenched in our treaty settlement are promoted and upheld by this government - including the preservation of our Reo, and the notion of holistic wellbeing for all my people."

Te Reo seems to be thriving in New Zealand society today. More people are speaking it, learning it, non-speakers understand more of it. Will government policy really have a negative effect on that?

"It’s the public narrative that they promote - this notion that our language is irrelevant and inappropriate in modern society. I think the undeniable responsibility of the crown is to be a good partner. And that partnership was enshrined in the Treaty of Waitangi. We should be working together not against each other."

"Modern New Zealand society has embraced Te Reo Māori [but] what we have is a whole bunch of ageing white males who continue to perpetuate this notion that Te Reo Māori is a sidebar."

"Even [former political ally Winston Peters] is a problem. There is only one place where this language belongs, and it's here in this country. We can't go anywhere else. Our existence, our uniqueness as a people, hinges around our Reo, our culture."…

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Mental health advocate Mike King tells Guyon why taking government cash is like taking money from Gollum; the day he realised his homophobic comedy was doing real damage, and why kids don't talk to their parents about their mental health.

*Content warning: This video contains strong language and references to suicide, self-harm and alcohol.

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Season 1 Episode 7

Mike King once described himself as an aggressive, politically incorrect, foul-mouthed, standup comedian. Now, he's one of the most high profile mental health advocates in Aotearoa.

In Budget 2024 his charity I am Hope got $24 million to provide free counselling for young people. There’s now a political fight about how the money was awarded.

Guyon Espiner sits down with Mike to ask about that and bigger questions over whether we have a mental health crisis in Aotearoa and how we should deal with it.

The aim of I Am Hope is to “forever change the way New Zealanders think, act and feel about mental health and suicide.” How so?

"And drive positive societal attitudinal change. And that's the key. Our whole Kaupapa is about changing the way people think, act and feel."

"I've been speaking to schools for the last 13 years. I've listened to over 250,000 young people. And here's what I know. 40% of kids in school will have a major crisis associated with some type of suicidal thinking before they leave school. Not in their lifetime - before they leave school.

Which is staggering to a whole lot of people. Guess what? It's normal. We've all had the thought. If you haven't left the house at least once in your life going, what's the point? You're living in a marshmallow."

"The stat that scares me is, 80% of those kids never ask for help. And the reason they never ask for help is because they're worried about what other people will think, say or do. And what's our message to young people who are travelling that journey? Reach out and ask for help! Excuse me?! “I've just told you, I'm scared of sharks. And your solution is to go swim with sharks, and maybe a dolphin will come along!”

So, what needs to change is, we all need to look in the mirror and ask ourselves, what am I doing to make it more comfortable for young people to reach out and ask for help?"

"And the answer to that is, we're not doing enough. We're busy telling kids what to do, this is what you need to do. We need to start showing them vulnerability."…

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Jordan Williams from the Taxpayers' Union tells Guyon about the group's funding, its connection to the Atlas Network, and why he once joined the Green party.

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Season 1 Episode 6

Jordan Williams is the head of the Taxpayers' Union. With 200,000 members, it’s one of the largest lobby groups in New Zealand.

For the last decade he’s called out wasteful government spending and been a high profile advocate of free speech and transparency.

Guyon Espiner spoke to Jordan Williams about what the Taxpayers' Union is trying to achieve, where it gets its funding, and where it fits in the international movement advocating right wing economic reform.

What is the Taxpayers' Union?

"Well, it's the same pitch as it was when we launched it just over 10 years ago."

"There are hundreds of groups of special interests out there, generally on the centre left, that argue for more money for their particular pet cause. It might be, you know, the protection of the albino snail or whatever. We’re the ones on the other side, to argue for “Mom-and-Pop" taxpayers, the ones that pay the bill.

Until government spending is being spent well, and you've got no government waste, why should we reach deeper into families’ back pockets to tax more?"

"Post-election, we're taking [staffing numbers] a little bit more cautiously, to see where the new equilibrium is. At some point, I think early last year, during the Three Waters debate, I sort of looked and realised, on our payroll, we had 18 staff. This thing started with me, just part time, and then me and a mate."

"We are now the largest, per capita, taxpayer group in the English-speaking world. We’re not quite the largest per capita in the world. The Finns have that, but they've been going, I think, 100 years, and they actually have software that do your taxes. So, it's a little bit of a different business model. They've got quarter of a million financial members."

Donations and Donors

"It is, particularly post-COVID, grassroots fed. More than 80% of our income in 2022 and 2023 is pretty similar. It’s all small donations, online donations, averaging between about $75, $85, depending on the campaign. That’s the bulk of it."

"Sir Bob [Jones] is very generous, and cumulatively, he would be our largest donor because of the office in Wellington, which he donates [rent-free.]"…

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