During the run of Doctor Who Series 15, Christian Cawley and James McLean got together to discuss how the show was developing.

This conversation took place against a backdrop of intense speculation about the future of the series, its star, and perhaps even its showrunner. Factor in the internal narrative -- dialogue from Mrs Flood -- and comments from Russell T Davies seeming to downplay the future of Doctor Who, and you have an interesting topic for discussion, namely:

Were RTD, the BBC, and Disney+ engaged in one of the most audacious publicity campaigns for a TV show ever? Or was this a semi-conscious, modern day retread of the events surrounding Trial of a Time Lord in 1986?

Find out what we think. Remember, this conversation went out in early May to our Patreon subscribers, so the voices on the end of your podcastmachine have no idea what happened in Episode 8...

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