This was such a beautiful conversation to be part of, with two old friends, and a story that I play at least a small role in.

In 2015, Transition Network, an organisation I had co-founded, undertook a transition of its own, from a pretty conventional management model to a non-hierarchical structure that distributed power, using Holocracy. We had to learn how to do it, and were brilliantly supported by Université du Nous, who support and advise organisations on how to do this.

For this episode of FWIWN I am joined by Sarah McAdam, one of the key people in Transition Network who made this happen and who now supports other organisations in making such shifts, and Guillaume Dorvaux, one of UDN's trainers who trained the team.