9 to FI - Financial Independence Conversations

One Year Retired: Finding Pace, Purpose, and Permission to Spend

Elliot and Josh discuss Josh passing one year since retiring after a 25-year career. Josh reflects on celebrating the milestone with a commemorative bike ride, says retirement has been overwhelmingly positive, and describes learning to slow down, avoid overloading projects, and use the power of saying no. He wants more small-group social activities because solo hobbies dominate his routine and large groups feel overstimulating. Josh explains a smooth career transition via a 14-month notice, gradual handoffs, and vacation time, though he still feels awkward using the word “retired,” partly due to ongoing rental property work. They discuss staying challenged without seeking constant entertainment, balancing house projects with hobbies, and shifting from scarcity to abundance by spending more, considering major home upgrades, and possibly selling problem rentals, while noting market downturns and withdrawal-rate comfort.

00:00 Sunday Morning Check In

00:44 One Year Retired

03:43 Finding a New Pace

05:47 Small Group Social Life

11:43 Saying No and FOMO

13:22 Career Transition Glide Path

16:47 Owning the R Word

20:56 Rentals Hobbies and Purpose

29:53 Money Mindset and Spending

52:00 Wrap Up and Listener Thanks

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Health Updates, Market Dip Investing, Rental Property Drag, and the Decision to Stay in the U.S.

Josh and Elliot discuss several updates: both are working on fitness routines and comparing heavier-weight/low-rep training with lighter-weight/higher-rep approaches focused on avoiding injury, while Josh admits he still hasn’t scheduled a colonoscopy after his physical. They talk investing during a market downturn, with Josh buying small amounts of VTI when it hits a self-set price threshold and Elliot funding two IRAs ($14,000) while weighing Roth vs traditional vs brokerage contributions near income limits. Josh shares frustration with scope creep and low urgency on two rental property projects, including a vacant unit he hopes to rent by end of June. They review 2025 taxes, noting Josh’s unexpected near-break-even result due partly to a small Roth conversion and rental profit, and Josh considers Roth conversions in 2026. Elliot reveals his family decided not to move to France due to difficult travel and desire to stay close to family.

00:00 Catch Up And Teaser

01:12 Health Journey Updates

03:05 Training Styles And Injury Prevention

06:34 Doctor Visits And Colonoscopy

07:09 Game Of Thrones Tangent

15:12 Investing During A Dip

18:18 IRA Choices And Cash Plans

22:14 Rental Rehab Scope Creep

24:04 Motivation Without Deadlines

25:10 Part Time Landlord Reality

26:27 June Rental Deadline Pressure

27:24 Decumulating Rentals Debate

28:43 Tax Meeting Takeaways

30:11 Roth Conversion Surprise

34:24 Refunds Versus Withholding

36:17 Roth Ladder Planning

38:06 Retirement Pressure Stories

39:46 France Move Decision

44:10 Testing The Hypothesis

46:08 Staying Put Wrap Up

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Exploring a Move to France: Small-Town Life, Schools, Housing, and the Travel Reality Check

Elliot returns to the podcast and briefly recaps how Lori filled in as a guest, then he shares details from a 10-day exploratory trip to France with Dawn focused on potentially relocating. They flew from St. Louis to Atlanta, Amsterdam, and Bordeaux, rented a car, and spent most of their time in the small village of Eymet, noting its expat presence, language realities, walkable town center, and seasonal tourism. They toured a potential school for their kids, met the principal and teachers, and viewed a possible in-town rental whose British owners made the process easier than typical French “dossier” requirements. Despite a highly positive visit, they express new hesitation about the burdensome multi-leg travel for family and friends, plus constraints around Elliot’s job not being remote if they stay with his employer, leaving their plans more uncertain.

00:00 Cold Open Banter

00:23 Lori Fills In

01:34 311 Concert Recap

03:41 France Trip Begins

04:44 Life in Eymet

07:43 Getting Around and Wine

11:35 Schools and Housing Plans

16:38 Travel Friction Doubts

20:03 Friends Family Visits

27:07 Work and FIRE Options

31:51 Facebook and Prime Confessions

40:04 Wrap Up and Next Steps

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Why We Paid Off a 3.75% Mortgage Early (and What My First Year of Retirement Looks Like) | Josh & Lori

Why would Josh and Lori pay off a low-interest 3.75% mortgage years early—before Josh retired? On 9 to FI, Josh hosts the show solo while co-host Elliot travels in France, and welcomes first-time guest Lori for a candid conversation recorded in a Columbia, Missouri hotel before a Nick Hexum concert. They explain paying off their primary home mortgage in 2024—about 19 years into a 30-year loan—despite common advice to invest instead, with Lori emphasizing emotional security, reduced stress, and eliminating a major monthly expense before relying less on Josh’s income. They discuss budgeting changes, remaining costs like taxes and insurance, and wanting to avoid future debt. Lori also shares an honest assessment of Josh’s first year of retirement, including struggles with structure, balancing fun with chores and rental rehabs, and how rental demands have affected his mood and routines, alongside benefits like more help at home.

00:00 Welcome and Guest Setup

01:36 Meet Lori in Columbia

02:51 Why Pay Off Mortgage

04:46 Emotional Money Mindset

06:49 Low Rate vs Investing Debate

09:24 Debt Free Future Plans

12:03 One Year Into Retirement

14:00 Finding Structure and Balance

15:52 Rental Rehab Season

18:28 Household Chores and Roles

21:01 Wrap Up and Future Episode Tease

21:38 Hotel Room Bloopers

Do you have feedback or suggestions? We want to hear from you!

Contact Elliot: [email protected]

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Do Josh and Elliot Regret Chasing Financial Independence? ACA Health Insurance Costs, FI Sacrifices, and Lessons LearnedDo Josh and Elliot have regrets from chasing financial independence? Before discussing regrets, Josh shares what he learned about ACA health insurance and premium tax credits after listening to ChooseFI episode 588 with Cody Garrett: premiums rise with age (potentially 7–8% yearly), and healthcare costs are often obscured by employer coverage. He tests estimates on healthcare.gov: at ages 49/48 with $84,000 MAGI, a bronze plan is $1,080/month with a $700 credit (~$380 out of pocket), while at age 62 the premium rises nearly $800 with a larger $1,656 credit, and without subsidies could approach $2,000/month ($24,000/year). They then reflect on FI regrets: early “fast and furious” scrimping, being cheap vs frugal (thermostat battles, delaying home improvements), saying no to experiences like concerts, overdoing side hustles and rehabs at the expense of time with grandparents and kids, pushing a spouse toward retirement, and staying too cautious in careers.00:00 Welcome and Setup00:34 ACA Premiums Surprise03:52 Running Healthcare Estimates06:47 Planning for Subsidy Cliffs08:42 Switching to Regrets08:58 Early FI Mindset10:45 Josh Story and Thermostat15:01 Home Upgrades and Cheapness22:06 Time Tradeoffs with Family34:29 Saying No to Experiences36:09 Pushing Spouse and Career39:17 Closing Thoughts on Regret40:17 Wrap Up and Goodbye

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Books mentioned in this episode: Tax Planning To And Through Early Retirement: https://amzn.to/4bstLmN

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Josh Recaps a Two-Week Las Vegas Trip as Josh and Elliot Discuss FIRE Spending, the 4% Rule, and ACA Subsidy CliffsJosh and Elliot record an off-the-cuff episode to keep their weekly podcast goal, with Josh recapping a two-week Las Vegas trip focused on concerts (Def Leppard and two long 311 sets), hiking, and other entertainment rather than heavy gambling, though a brief roulette/blackjack run with his son ended in losing winnings. Josh notes dining out cost nearly $2,000 over two weeks for a group that sometimes totaled five people, prompting broader FIRE discussions about tracking true annual spending, budgeting “guardrails,” and sequence-of-returns risk. Josh shares that early 2026 expense tracking suggests $80–90K annual spend rather than a guessed $60K, affecting reliance on the 4% rule. They discuss withdrawal cadence, investor policy statements, 72(t) vs Roth conversion ladders, and Josh’s concern about ACA subsidy cliffs around ~$84K MAGI given rental income and tax-deferred assets. Elliot updates on planning a France move, uncertain timing, remote-work approval, and whether to sell or rent their house.00:00 Back From Vegas00:56 Concerts And Hiking03:16 Roulette And Blackjack06:04 Trip Costs Reality Check09:07 Tracking Spending Guardrails14:26 Market Drops And Mindset21:31 Withdrawal Strategy Talk29:32 ACA Subsidy Cliff37:19 Drawdown Options Complexity40:24 France Move Update43:12 Sell Or Rent The House47:10 Wrap Up And Thanks

Do you have feedback or suggestions? We want to hear from you!

Contact Elliot: [email protected]

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Any of these products help the show. Thanks for your support!

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⁠Empower⁠ is Josh’s choice for Net Worth and Budgeting

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⁠Buy Us a Coffee⁠ - One time donation or monthly, it’s up to you

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Books mentioned in this episode:

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Josh and Elliot Do an Expense Audit: Stop Lifestyle Creep, Cut Money Leaks, and Reduce Big Tech DependenceJosh tells Elliot he was mentioned in ChooseFI episode 586 (“Stop Lifestyle Creep with the Expense Audit”) after emailing in about finding “money leaks” by reviewing Q4 expenses, comparing the process to cleaning out a junk drawer, and cutting about $400/month. Josh and Elliot discuss how periodic expense audits help restore intentional spending habits and reference the idea that each $100/month saved can reduce a FI “fine number” by about $30,000.They share recent budget snapshots: Josh describes January spending as “lumpy,” with about $4,000 in core spending plus another roughly $4,000 in travel payments for a big trip, bringing total monthly spend to about $8,500, while noting improved intentionality compared to earlier spending. Elliot reports a 54.2% January savings rate, about $8,300 in expenses on a little over $18,000 take-home pay, helped by a January reimbursement tied to work’s flexible spending account for children’s tuition; he notes this is the last year of preschool tuition. Elliot’s top categories remain groceries and food/drink; restaurants were about $400, while “groceries” were about $1,470, reflecting both inflation and a shift toward higher-quality food.They discuss reducing spending and “friction” from subscriptions and retailers, including Elliot’s effort to “sever ties” with Amazon, while Josh finds Amazon Prime re-billed after he thought it was paused and plans to investigate. Elliot describes limited Amazon use after canceling Prime (with occasional purchases for a small business and one instance using a family member to obtain lunchboxes). Josh mentions buying the new “Tax” book by Mullaney and Cody Garrett through Amazon when he couldn’t find it locally, and they share a tip from Mile Hi FI about finding inexpensive used books on eBay.Elliot also describes cutting ties with Facebook as part of “cutting allegiance to the billionaires,” noting his main prior use was groups (including local ChooseFI meetups), and that removing the app reduced reflexive checking and “phantom notification” behavior. He mentions a downside: he learned about a friend’s sudden death only because his wife still uses social media, and he missed seeing birthday posts. They talk about Facebook Marketplace and Messenger, with Josh saying Messenger is one reason he keeps an account.They close with media and time-use habits (Josh watches YouTube mainly on TV; Elliot watches YouTube for research on a move to France) and preview a future discussion about Elliot’s potential early retirement and move timeline (possibly about six months), including planning for a drawdown portfolio versus accumulation, referencing Frank Vasquez’s research and Carl from “Mr. 1500” as contrasting approaches.

00:00 ChooseFI Shoutout Surprise

01:53 Expense Audit Money Leaks

03:07 Savings Rate Math Wins

04:44 January Spending Lumps

09:09 Groceries Inflation Reality

12:10 Breaking Up With Amazon

16:51 Book Buying Alternatives

18:50 Cutting Facebook Ties

26:24 Notifications Phone Habits

30:59 YouTube Replaces Scrolling

34:01 France Move Retirement Talk

37:20 Wrap Up And Next Time

Do you have feedback or suggestions? We want to hear from you!

Contact Elliot: [email protected]

Contact Josh: [email protected]

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⁠Empower⁠ is Josh’s choice for Net Worth and Budgeting

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⁠Buy Us a Coffee⁠ - One time donation or monthly, it’s up to you

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Books mentioned in this episode:

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Josh on Early Retirement Real Estate Turnover + Elliot’s Plan to Move His Family to France in 2026Josh shares how a tenant turnover and light rehab has felt like a part-time job in early retirement, especially due to multiple commutes into the city, and explains they’re not rushing the turnaround while handling painting and minor repairs themselves. He also discusses tracking hours toward IRS real estate professional status (750 hours) and gives an update that Lori is gradually reducing work hours by taking partial days off, with plans to take a full day off next week. Elliot then discusses his family’s decision to relocate to France in September 2026 so their three children can enroll in French public school, and describes using a paid course/checklist to project-manage the move. He explains that his wife and kids have EU citizenship (Italy) and that he plans to use a familial visa, and outlines why France: favorable US–France tax treaty treatment as he understands it, cultural and lifestyle reasons, language immersion, reputed public education, milder weather in southwestern France, and access to healthcare. Elliot notes they will likely rent first, describes key cost-of-living considerations including higher fuel/transport costs, and says the hardest part so far has been choosing a location among many municipalities, with an upcoming March trip to decide. He outlines plans to keep their US house as a long-term rental while selling most possessions, and contrasts furnished vs. unfurnished rentals in France. Elliot shares excitement about potentially transitioning into full FIRE and feeling burned out at work, nervousness about language and building community away from family, and discusses possible work options including remote work or alternative roles at his global company, while acknowledging fluency and higher taxes as constraints for local jobs. They talk about the move as a multi-year plan, potential reasons it could be derailed (major family events), what success could look like in five years (family fluent in French, different school schedule, frequent breaks enabling travel), and how the kids are adjusting—initial resistance from their daughter but growing excitement, including using a language-learning app called Study Cat and beginning to downsize belongings.00:00 Retirement Balance Check

00:47 Real Estate Isn’t Passive

03:06 Turnover Rehab Tradeoffs

04:12 Tax Status and Time Tracking

05:43 Lori Eases Into Part Time

06:57 Moving to France Reveal

07:54 Project Managing the Move

09:37 Checklist and Visa Path

13:42 Why France Taxes Culture

18:59 Cost of Living Reality Check

23:19 Renting First and Countryside Life

25:04 City Convenience Tradeoffs

25:51 Paris Dream vs Countryside Reality

27:22 Choosing Where to Live

29:04 House Plans and Downsizing

30:35 Renting Furnished in France

31:36 Excited and Nervous

34:50 Work Options and Visas

38:49 Long Term Commitment

40:15 What Could Derail It

42:19 Five Year Success Vision

44:45 How the Kids Feel

46:39 Wrapping Up and Next Steps

Do you have feedback or suggestions? We want to hear from you!

Contact Elliot: [email protected]

Contact Josh: [email protected]

Any of these products help the show. Thanks for your support!

Mint Mobile - We both use ⁠Mint Mobile⁠ and save a ton on our phone plan: ⁠https://fbuy.me/vgAmz⁠

⁠Empower⁠ is Josh’s choice for Net Worth and Budgeting

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Looking for a new credit card?  We’re big fans of ⁠Chase⁠

⁠Buy Us a Coffee⁠ - One time donation or monthly, it’s up to you

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Books mentioned in this episode:

Come find us and subscribe on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/@9toFI

Considering a Move to Europe for FI: Italian Passports, Geoarbitrage, and Escaping Rising US CostsThe conversation centers on a family’s renewed consideration of relocating from the US to Europe. Elliot describes a prior relocation request that was approved and then reversed at the last minute, and explains that with a new boss they may ask again this year, noting the worst outcome is being told no. They discuss the appeal of geoarbitrage—keeping a US salary while living in a lower-cost EU country—and emphasize giving their children cultural exposure and an easier window to learn a new language while young, potentially enrolling them in local schools.Healthcare and future college costs are highlighted as major uncertainties in a US-based FI plan, with Elliot suggesting these concerns are often mitigated in the EU. Josh shares a recent example of Affordable Care Act insurance subsidy changes making coverage far more expensive for a 20-year-old dependent. They reference anecdotal research showing a family in France potentially living on around $50,000 annually—about half of their current expenses—and discuss income differences between the US and Europe, with US median salary figures cited around $77,000 versus mid-$40,000s in France. The discussion also explores optionality for the children’s education, including the ability to return to the US for college, and briefly addresses work logistics such as a 6–7 hour time zone difference between the US and parts of Europe.00:00 Considering EU Relocation02:09 Work Approval and Geoarbitrage03:08 Why Move Now for Kids04:01 US Politics and Safety Concerns05:00 Healthcare Costs Wakeup Call06:35 FI Benefits in Europe08:01 How Much Cheaper Abroad10:18 Geoarbitrage and Salary Gaps12:06 Kids Education and Optionality13:11 Next Steps and Time Zones14:25 Wrapping Up

Do you have feedback or suggestions? We want to hear from you!

Contact Elliot: [email protected]

Contact Josh: [email protected]

Any of these products help the show. Thanks for your support!

Mint Mobile - We both use ⁠Mint Mobile⁠ and save a ton on our phone plan: ⁠https://fbuy.me/vgAmz⁠

⁠Empower⁠ is Josh’s choice for Net Worth and Budgeting

Wanna create a podcast? We use ⁠Descript⁠

Looking for a new credit card?  We’re big fans of ⁠Chase⁠

⁠Buy Us a Coffee⁠ - One time donation or monthly, it’s up to you

Want to save money on gas? Try ⁠Upside!⁠

Books mentioned in this episode:

Come find us and subscribe on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/@9toFI

Do you have feedback or suggestions? We want to hear from you!

Contact Elliot: [email protected]

Contact Josh: [email protected]

The Great Transition: How to Move from Full-Time Work to Early Retirement Without One-More-Year SyndromeElliot and Josh discuss the under-covered topic of transitioning from full-time employment into early retirement. Josh recounts how he ended up at a company he hadn’t heard of, worked there for 25 years, and viewed work primarily as a means to provide benefits and income rather than an identity. They share tactics for excelling while protecting time—prioritizing what a boss says matters most, pushing back on low-value meetings, managing deadlines, and avoiding burnout by not immediately turning in work early—which Josh says helped him become highly efficient and even led to two back-to-back promotions. The conversation then shifts to retirement logistics and psychology: Josh gave 14 months’ notice to a new manager, explains why he wasn’t worried about being let go, and contrasts Elliot’s experience of being quickly escorted out of a sensitive cybersecurity role (though paid out for his notice). They address “one more year syndrome,” with Josh describing how he delayed retirement for milestones like paying off the house and getting their youngest through high school, and how setting a firm retirement date tied to his 25-year anniversary helped commit him to leaving. Josh emphasizes preparing for retirement by testing hobbies and routines before quitting, asking what a perfect day looks like, and ensuring activities are scalable and fulfilling; he admits to pre-retirement anxiety about running out of things to do despite having many interests. They also discuss the social friction of being retired—how people ask “what do you do?”—and how the FI community provides more authentic conversations than broader work-centered culture. Josh shares a recent doctor visit where the doctor was surprised by his retirement and Josh framed his activities as managing rental properties. They close by encouraging listeners to flip the “I’ll be bored” script, use current interests (including social media algorithms) as clues for passions, and start experimenting with how to spend time if money were not a constraint.

00:00 Kicking Off: From ‘Being Vertical’ to Early Retirement Talk

00:29 Why the ‘Retirement Transition’ Is the Missing FIRE Conversation

02:43 Josh’s Career Origin Story: Falling Into a 25-Year Job

04:33 Work as a Means to an End: Not Living to Work

07:43 Cracking the Corporate Code: Priorities, Saying No, and Time Defense

15:54 Cruise Control & Side Hustles During the Workday (Rentals + Woodworking)

20:01 Giving Notice: Why Josh Told His Boss 14 Months Early

21:36 Risk of Getting Shown the Door + Beating ‘One More Year’ Syndrome

28:30 Coordinating Retirement Timing & Hitting Key Milestones

29:10 The ‘One More Year’ Trap: Layering Conservatism in FIRE Plans

32:23 Two Sides of the Decision: Money Confidence vs. Time Purpose

36:44 Designing Your Perfect Day: Test-Driving Retirement Before the Ripcord

39:37 ‘What Do You Do?’: Identity, Productivity, and Being Authentic After FIRE

45:51 Why Community Matters (and When FIRE Media Becomes Consumption)

51:33 Closing Advice: Flip the Script on Boredom & Reverse-Engineer Your Day

Any of these products help the show. Thanks for your support!

Mint Mobile - We both use ⁠Mint Mobile⁠ and save a ton on our phone plan: ⁠https://fbuy.me/vgAmz⁠

⁠Empower⁠ is Josh’s choice for Net Worth and Budgeting

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Looking for a new credit card?  We’re big fans of ⁠Chase⁠

⁠Buy Us a Coffee⁠ - One time donation or monthly, it’s up to you

Want to save money on gas? Try ⁠Upside!⁠

Books mentioned in this episode:

Come find us and subscribe on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/@9toFI