This episode is a conversation between Sam Stafford and former Secretary of State for Levelling Up, Housing and Communities, the Rt Hon. the Lord Gove.

Famous in political circles. Infamous, some might say, in planning circles.

The Parliament of 2019-2024 was tumultuous for everybody, but for planning specifically it was an especially tumultuous time.

There was the 2020 'Planning for the Future' White Paper, which Mr Gove inherited in 2021, the same year as the Chesham & Amersham byelection. 2022 brought Mr Gove’s Devolution White Paper, his resignation and reappointment, the LURB, then the LURA, the rebellion against which over "top down" housing targets that precipitated the NPPF changes that were subsequently adopted in 2023.

Mr Gove talks Sam through all of that tumult. They also talked about strategic planning; about B.I.D.E.N; about the stance on housing that the now opposition Conservative Party should take into the next election: and they talked about the merits of 'big bang' planning reform versus pragmatic incrementalism. 

Some accompanying reading.

Foundations

https://ukfoundations.co/

National Planning Policy Fudge

https://samuelstafford.blogspot.com/2023/01/national-planning-policy-fudge.html

The Long-Term Plan for Housing II

https://samuelstafford.blogspot.com/2024/01/the-long-term-plan-for-housing-ii.html

Some accompanying Listening.

Only Memories Remain - My Morning Jacket

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX-RDOp4XtE

Any other business.

50 Shades T-Shirts!

If you have listened to Episode 45 of the 50 Shades of Planning you will have heard Clive Betts say that...

'In the Netherlands planning is seen as part of the solution. In the UK, too often, planning is seen as part of the problem'.

Sam said in reply that that would look good on a t-shirt and it does. Further details can be found here.

Sam is on Bluesky (@samuelstafford.bsky.social) and Instagram (@samuel__stafford). His blog contains a link to his newsletter.