After Further Consideration

Hosts welcome Dr. Faran Saeed, Director of the Murseel J. Lee Scholars Program at the University of Wisconsin and former Director of Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) at the university's Global and International Division. Dr. Saeed shares his leadership journey, from shifting career paths in undergrad to navigating the complexities of DEI work in higher education. He offers powerful insights into values-driven leadership, crisis management, and the importance of centering impacted communities. Through his experiences—including the defining moment of the 2017 Charlottesville crisis—Dr. Saeed provides actionable strategies for leading with integrity, preparing for resistance, and fostering inclusive environments in higher education.

Guest Name: Faran Saeed, Director of the Mercile J. Lee Scholars Program at the University of Wisconsin

Guest Social: https://www.linkedin.com/in/faransaeed/

Guest Bio: Faran Saeed (He/Him/His) holds a PhD in Language, Equity, and Educational Policy from Oregon State University, and holds a Master of Arts in Higher Education Administration from Louisiana State University College of Education. He currently serves as the Director of the Mercile J. Lee Scholars Program and previously as the Director of Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) at the University of Wisconsin-Madison where he oversaw all aspects of global DEI within the International Division. Before working at the University of Wisconsin, he oversaw the Ettihad Cultural Center. This center supports students, faculty, and staff from the North African, Middle Eastern, and South Asian communities at Oregon State University. Furthermore, he served as the IMPACT Conference Board of Directors chair. In the past, he has sat on the NASPA leadership team of the Spirituality and Religion Knowledge Community and was part of the Board of Directors of Convergence, A national organization focused on enhancing institutional climates for religious, secular, and spiritual identities through policy and practice. Before returning to graduate school to pursue his doctorate, he worked for several years at Madison House, the student volunteer and community engagement center at the University of Virginia as the Director of Community Engagement. Additionally, Faran has experience in doing strategic planning, higher education assessment, and developing social justice curriculums.

• Values-Driven Leadership is Essential – Aligning leadership with personal and institutional values ensures that decision-making remains principled, impactful, and student-centered.
• Preparing for Crisis Requires Proactive Planning – A comprehensive communication strategy and clear stakeholder engagement plan are critical for navigating crises effectively.
• Center Impacted Communities in Decision-Making – Listening to and prioritizing the voices of those directly affected by policies and crises leads to more equitable and effective solutions.
• Power Dynamics Shape Institutional Responses – Leaders must understand and navigate institutional power structures to advocate for systemic change and meaningful DEI work.
• Strategic Planning Can Drive Long-Term Equity – Embedding DEI principles into institutional policies, staffing, and community partnerships creates lasting structural change.
• Resistance is Inevitable—Be Ready for It – Anticipating and preparing for opposition helps leaders stay committed to their values while mitigating risks.
• Self-Care Fuels Effective Leadership – Investing in personal well-being—whether through reading, reflection, or taking intentional breaks—sustains leaders in demanding roles.

Dr. Faran Saeed’s career trajectory began with a passion for science, but he soon realized his true calling was in student support and community advocacy. As a first-generation Muslim and South Asian student, he recognized the lack of representation in higher education leadership roles. This realization led him to transition from biochemistry to student affairs, where he found purpose in supporting underrepresented students.

At Louisiana State University, he confronted the challenges of limited diversity in leadership and almost left higher ed due to lack of representation. However, a conversation with peers solidified his commitment to staying in the field. Over time, his work evolved from community engagement to a broader focus on multicultural affairs and DEI, ultimately leading him to leadership roles at Oregon State University and the University of Wisconsin-Madison.

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Dr. Saeed emphasized the importance of leading with values, particularly in supervisory roles. He prioritizes critical reflection on systemic inequities, ensuring that every programmatic decision—from event planning to student advising—aligns with a commitment to equity. He also stressed the importance of relational leadership, building strong connections with colleagues, students, and community partners to drive meaningful change.

His leadership at the Murseel J. Lee Scholars Program reflects this values-driven approach. With a focus on supporting historically disadvantaged students, he has worked to enhance mentorship opportunities, financial accessibility, and strategic partnerships to improve student outcomes. By incorporating student feedback into programming decisions, his team fosters a sense of belonging and inclusion.

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One of the most pivotal moments in Dr. Saeed’s career occurred in 2017 during the white supremacist rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, while he was at the University of Virginia. The crisis highlighted deep systemic failures in institutional responses to racial violence and forced him to reevaluate his role as a leader.

In the immediate aftermath, he implemented a crisis response strategy that prioritized safety, communication, and community support. Key actions included:

• Developing a real-time communication plan to keep students, faculty, and community partners informed.
• Establishing safe spaces on campus with 24/7 student access for emotional support.
• Partnering with mental health professionals to provide trauma-informed counseling.
• Issuing a public statement that took institutional accountability for past shortcomings.
• Advocating for policy changes to prevent similar crises in the future.

This experience reshaped his leadership philosophy, reinforcing the necessity of centering impacted communities, recognizing power dynamics, and making decisions that prioritize long-term equity over short-term appeasement.

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Dr. Saeed shed light on the role of power dynamics in institutional decision-making. He highlighted how university leadership often faces conflicting priorities—balancing donor relations, political considerations, and student advocacy. These tensions can create resistance to bold DEI initiatives.

To navigate these challenges, he emphasized the need for:

• Strategic messaging that aligns with institutional priorities while pushing for systemic change.
• Transparent leadership that acknowledges existing inequities rather than glossing over them.
• Advocacy for equitable resource distribution, ensuring that historically marginalized students receive the support they need.

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Dr. Saeed outlined several steps that higher ed leaders can take to prepare for and respond to challenges:

1. Educate Yourself on Crisis Management – Research best practices, assess past institutional responses, and build a knowledge base for proactive leadership.
2. Engage Impacted Communities First – Prioritize direct conversations with students, faculty, and staff who are most affected by decisions.
3. Develop a Communications Plan – Prepare messaging for different stakeholder groups in advance, ensuring clarity and transparency in crisis situations.
4. Integrate Equity into Strategic Planning – Use crises as opportunities to reassess policies and embed long-term DEI commitments into institutional frameworks.
5. Prepare for Resistance – Anticipate challenges from leadership, donors, and external stakeholders, and develop strategies to stay aligned with core values despite opposition.

To sustain himself in emotionally demanding work, Dr. Saeed prioritizes self-care through reading. After completing his PhD, he rekindled his love for books, reading over 50 in just five months. He balances heavy academic and activist texts with fiction that brings him joy, creating a sense of balance. His self-care routine also includes daily walks while listening to audiobooks, ensuring that he stays mentally and emotionally grounded.

Welcome to a special bonus episode of After Further Consideration, where we'll be revisiting our original "Pulse Check" episodes that published on the Higher Ed Pulse podcast in the Summer of 2024. Today we are revisiting Part 5, which is a conversation between Dr. Cody Nielsen and Dr. Tomika Ferguson. 

In this episode, key takeaways include:

• To serve as an authentic and talented leader, self-love is essential.
• Involving practitioners in more search can benefit the field of higher education, particularly the impact of the work to prepare future and current educational leaders.
• In higher education, we must integrate both theory and practice, ensuring our work is grounded in real-world applications.
• Achieving our professional goals requires a curiosity about others' journeys, without being consumed by following their exact paths.

Welcome to a special bonus episode of After Further Consideration, where we'll be revisiting our original "Pulse Check" episodes that published on the Higher Ed Pulse podcast in the Summer of 2024. Today we are revisiting Part 4 with Jaunelle White, Vice President of Intercollegiate Athletics and Chief Student Development Officer at Point University.

Key takeaways include:

• Intentional leadership fosters inclusivity in decision-making and strengthens relationships with your team.
• Overcoming others' assumptions about you as a leader requires sustained commitment, trust-building, and humanizing yourself to those you lead.
• During a crisis, prioritizing the humanity of your team is more important than the needs of the institution.
• Being confident about making a significant career move requires evaluating the opportunity, timing, and location.

Guest Name: Jaunelle White, Vice President of Intercollegiate Athletics and Chief Student Development Officer, Point University

Guest Social:
LinkedIn
X (Twitter)

Bio: Jaunelle White is the Vice President of Intercollegiate Athletics and the Chief Student Development Officer at Point University in West Point, GA. White is the university's third athletic director and first female director. She has recently been recognized by Southern States Athletic Conference as the Athletic Director of the year. Jaunelle White is a proven leader in Athletics as she was named as one of Sports Illustrated's top 100 Black Women in Sports.

White has led the transition of full membership of Point University from the Appalachian Athletic Conference to the Southern States Athletic Conference.. She also added Women's Flag Football to the Athletic Department, which competes in the Sun Conference and will have its inaugural season in Spring 2024. White oversaw three NAIA National Tournament teams, three NAIA All-Americans l), and one Appalachian Athletic Conference Championship team (Women's Basketball). Point University is a school in the National Association of Intercollegiate Athletics. NAIA announced Point University as a Champions of Character Five-Star Gold Institution. 

White has nearly 20 years of athletic administration experience, particularly at the NCAA Division I level. Most recently, White served as the senior associate athletic director for internal operations and senior woman administrator at Indiana University—Purdue University Indianapolis. She has served in several athletic administrative roles, including compliance, at Texas Southern, Alabama State University, University of South Alabama, Middle Tennessee State University, and Louisiana State University. 
White is a native of Lawrence, Kansas, and played collegiate volleyball at Auburn University from 1996 to 2002. She holds a master's degree in education and a bachelor's degree in business administration from Auburn University.

Welcome to a special bonus episode of After Further Consideration, where we'll be revisiting our original "Pulse Check" episodes that published on the Higher Ed Pulse podcast in the Summer of 2024. Today we are revisiting Part 3 with Dr. Peter Cornish, Director of Counseling and Psychological Services at UHS.

The discussion focuses on the ways in which holistic mental health services is of the most important DEI imperatives in higher education.  As well, the episodes explores with Dr. Cornish what might happen is we were to consider the holistic well-being professionals as leaders in the reforming of the entirety of higher education. Join for this informative episode. 

Guest Name: Peter Cornish, Director of Counseling and Psychological Services, UHS; Honorary Research Professor at the Memorial University of Newfoundland in Canada 

Guest LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/peter-cornish-6b381922

Guest Bio:
Dr. Peter Cornish is the Director of Counseling and Psychological Services at UHS and an Honorary Research Professor at the Memorial University of Newfoundland in Canada. His clinical and research interests include online mental health, stepped-care treatments, mental health service innovations, and inter-professional team functioning.
Over the past five years, Dr. Cornish has provided consultation and on-site training on his Stepped Care 2.0 model to over 150 organizations across North America. His nonprofit company, Stepped Care Solutions, is the lead partner on Wellness Together Canada (link is external), a federal COVID-19 $70M mental health program for all peoples of Canada. Dr. Cornish is the principal investigator for a $1.14M four-year research grant aimed at digitizing and evaluating Stepped Care 2.0 across two Canadian provinces. Currently, he is collaborating with colleagues in the US and Canada on a three-book series on Stepped Care 2.0.

Welcome to a special bonus episode of After Further Consideration, where we'll be revisiting our original "Pulse Check" episodes that published on the Higher Ed Pulse podcast in the Summer of 2024. Today we are revisiting Part 2 with Kevin McDonald of University of Virginia. 

Key Takeaways:

• Your effectiveness as a leader is negatively impacted when you neglect self-care.
• Leaders must be confident in their abilities without being intoxicated by the authority and influence of their position, especially in the face of personal fear, campus conflict, and external pressures.
• Executive leadership carries personal risk and responsibility, necessitating reflection on personal obligations, courage, and lifestyle changes to increase effectiveness.
• Gratefulness and servant leadership can affirm one’s motivations for leadership amid challenging circumstances and professional transitions.

Guest Name: Kevin McDonald, Vice President for Diversity, Equity, Inclusion, and Community Partnerships, University of Virginia

Guest LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/drkevinmcdonald

Guest Bio: Today our Guest is Dr. Kevin McDonald. Kevin McDonald is the University of Virginia’s Vice President for Diversity, Equity, Inclusion, and Community Partnerships. He joined UVA after serving as the chief diversity officer and vice chancellor for inclusion, diversity, and equity at the University of Missouri System and the University of Missouri – Columbia. While at At Missouri, McDonald established its first diversity strategic plan that was integrated within the UM system’s overall strategic plan,
Prior to the University of Missouri System and Flagship campus, McDonald held positions at several other universities, including as vice president and associate provost for diversity, equity, and inclusion at Rochester Institute of Technology, Vice President for equity and inclusion at Virginia Tech, as associate director for compliance and conflict resolution at Johns Hopkins University, and as campus compliance officer at the University of Maryland, College Park.
Prior to his work in higher education, McDonald worked for the U.S. Department of Justice and for Network Solutions, Inc.
McDonald holds a law degree from The Ohio State University and a doctoral degree in higher education leadership from the University of Rochester. He received his undergraduate degree in psychology from Andrews University in Berrien Springs, Michigan.

Hosts Tomika and Cody sit down with Dr. Kimberly Griffin, Dean of the College of Education at the University of Maryland. A scholar and leader passionate about equity and access, Dr. Griffin shares her leadership journey, reflections on higher education, and actionable strategies for fostering authentic communities. From the challenges of leading during COVID-19 to her passion for mentorship, this conversation offers a wealth of insights for higher education professionals and leaders.
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Key Takeaways

• Leadership as a Journey: Dr. Griffin highlights the nonlinear nature of her path to becoming a dean, emphasizing intentionality and adaptability.
• Equity in Action: Equity means acknowledging diverse needs and structuring environments to ensure everyone has equal opportunities to thrive.
• Mentorship as a Catalyst: Effective mentorship requires acknowledging identity and structural dynamics to foster meaningful relationships.
• Community Building Post-COVID: The pandemic underscored the importance of intentionality in creating inclusive and transformative communities.
• Self-Care as Leadership: Taking time to recharge—whether through sleep, yoga, or play—enhances leadership effectiveness and personal well-being.

‍How Dr. Kimberly Griffin Became Dean of the College of Education
Dr. Griffin’s journey to becoming a dean wasn’t a straight path. Initially envisioning herself as a provost or vice president, she focused on problem-based research addressing access, equity, and justice in higher education. Over time, her leadership roles expanded, and she embraced opportunities to serve as associate dean and editor-in-chief of the Journal of Diversity in Higher Education. These experiences, combined with her drive to foster meaningful institutional change, positioned her to take on the role of dean. She admits to moments of imposter syndrome, particularly as a higher education scholar leading a college often focused on pre-K through 12 education. However, the University of Maryland’s commitment to impactful, equity-focused work aligned perfectly with her values, making this a transformative leadership opportunity.
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Balancing Identities: Scholar, Leader, and Individual
Dr. Griffin discusses the complexity of balancing her roles as Dr. Griffin, the scholar; Dean Griffin, the institutional leader; and Kimberly, a Black woman, wife, and mother. She emphasizes the importance of context in how she shows up, explaining that each role requires unique contributions while maintaining authenticity.
Through mentorship and leadership, Dr. Griffin focuses on creating structural changes that promote equity, ensuring her work reflects a collaborative and inclusive approach. Her ability to balance these roles highlights the intersectionality of personal and professional identities.
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Lessons from Leading Through COVID-19
The onset of the pandemic coincided with Dr. Griffin stepping into a more prominent leadership role. The challenges of navigating institutional change, addressing equity concerns, and managing a young family provided valuable lessons about leadership and humanity. She emphasizes the importance of recognizing people as whole individuals and creating policies that reflect their real-life challenges. For Dr. Griffin, this period reinforced her commitment to intentional community-building, fostering environments where people can thrive despite external pressures.
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Mentorship as a Cornerstone of Success
Mentorship has been a central theme in Dr. Griffin’s career. Her co-authored book, On Being a Mentor, emphasizes the importance of identity and equity in mentoring relationships. By addressing structural barriers and creating supportive environments, she aims to transform mentorship into a tool that fosters success and thriving for both mentors and mentees.
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Strategies for Building Authentic Communities
Dr. Griffin’s leadership philosophy centers on intentionality. Through strategic planning, she engages stakeholders in defining shared values and goals, ensuring the college reflects a cohesive and impactful identity. Post-pandemic, she recognized the value of in-person interactions for fostering innovation and trust, emphasizing the need to balance technology with human connection.
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The Role of Self-Care in Leadership
Dr. Griffin reframes self-care as an essential component of effective leadership. From prioritizing sleep to practicing yoga and finding moments of personal joy, she emphasizes that these practices enable her to lead with energy and purpose. By modeling self-care, she also encourages her team to prioritize their well-being, creating a healthier work culture.

Guest Name: Dr. Kimberly Griffin, Dean of the College of Education, the University of Maryland

Guest Social: linkedin.com/in/kimberlyagriffin

Guest Bio: Kimberly A. Griffin (she/her) was appointed dean of the College of Education in 2022. She has been a member of the University of Maryland faculty since 2012. Griffin joined the College as an associate professor in the Higher Education, Student Affairs and International Education Policy Program, and later served on the dean’s leadership team as the associate dean for graduate studies and faculty affairs. In this role, she led efforts to revise the College’s tenure and promotion policy, as well as support and guide faculty hiring and graduate student recruitment. Prior to joining UMD, she was a faculty member at Pennsylvania State University, an assistant dean for graduate studies at the Stanford University School of Medicine, and an admissions officer at Stanford University.

A leader committed to excellence, care, community, and equity, Griffin is energized by the opportunity to collaborate with faculty, staff and students to advance the College and its goals. She is driven by education's ability to make an impact in schools and communities and has worked tirelessly throughout her career to maximize the connection between research and practice. 

As a scholar, Griffin identifies herself as a “problem-based researcher” and her work aims to promote access, equity, and justice in higher education. Much of her current research and writing focuses on mentorship, career development, and faculty and graduate student diversity. Her research has been funded by the Burroughs Wellcome Fund, National Institutes of Health, and National Science Foundation, and she is the co-author of the book, "On Being a Mentor: A Guide for Higher Education Faculty." She previously served as the Editor-in-Chief of The Journal of Diversity in Higher Education from 2018 - 2022. Over her five-year term, her vision-driven leadership translated to notable growth in the journal’s readership, impact, and revenues.

Griffin’s work has been widely recognized for its relevance and effectiveness in addressing persistent problems in higher and science education.  She received the Promising Scholar/Early Career Award by the Association for the Study of Higher Education in 2013, and was named an Emerging Scholar in 2010 and Diamond Honoree in 2020 by ACPA.  For the past three years, she has been named one of the 200 most influential education scholars by Education Week. 

Griffin received her bachelor’s degree from Stanford University, her master’s degree in Education Policy and Leadership from the University of Maryland, and her doctorate degree in Higher Education and Organizational Change from the University of California, Los Angeles.

Welcome to a special bonus episode of After Further Consideration, where we'll be revisiting our original "Pulse Check" episodes that published on the Higher Ed Pulse podcast in the Summer of 2024. Today we are revisiting Part 1 with Patricia McGuire, President at Trinity Washington University.

Key Takeaways from Part 1:

1. Over the past three decades, the role of the college president has transformed dramatically, necessitating extended tenures to lead impactful change in higher education.
2. Leaders must decisively affirm their commitments to equity and inclusion to reshape the institutional culture despite opposition.
3. Becoming an equity leader demands a sustained, long-term commitment.
4. Prioritizing self-care is essential for leaders to prevent burnout.
5. While shifting to an inclusive institutional culture requires buy-in from faculty, trustees, administrators, alumni, and students, it demands unwavering leadership from the president.

Guest Name: Pat McGuire 

Guest LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/patricia-mcguire-4b291510

Guets Bio: Patricia McGuire has been president of Trinity since 1989.  Previously, she was the assistant dean for development and external affairs at Georgetown University Law Center where she was also an adjunct professor of law.  She began her career after law school as the project director for the Street Law clinical program at Georgetown.  President McGuire serves on a number of boards including the Consortium of Universities, Cafritz Foundation, Greater Washington Board of Trade and the Ameritas Holding Company.  Her prior board service includes the American Council on Education, the National Association of Independent Colleges and Universities, the Middle States Commission on Higher Education, Catholic Charities DC, the Meyer Foundation, the Community Foundation of the National Capital Region, and numerous other organizations.  In 2018 she received the Association of Catholic Colleges Distinguished Service Award.  In 2016, the TIAA Institute honored President McGuire with the Hesburgh Award for Leadership Excellence.  In 2015 President McGuire received the Carnegie Award for Academic Leadership from the Carnegie Corporation.  In 2012 she received the Henry Paley Award from the National Association of Independent Colleges and Universities. In 2010 she received the Alexander Meiklejohn Award for Academic Freedom from the American Association of University Professors. She holds honorary degrees from several universities including Georgetown, Howard, Chatham, Emmanuel, Saint Michael’s, Liverpool Hope, the College of New Rochelle and others.  She has received recognition in the Washington Post, Washingtonian magazine, Washington Business Journal and other media outlets.  In 2007 she was named “Leader of the Years” by the Greater Washington Board of Trade.  She earned her law degree at Georgetown and her baccalaureate degree cum laude at Trinity.

This episode of After Further Consideration features Dr. OiYan Poon, co-director of the College Admissions Futures CoLab and a scholar whose work examines racial policies, education access, and affirmative action. Dr. Poon shares her inspiring journey from higher education practitioner to scholar and consultant, exploring how her personal and professional experiences have fueled her commitment to equity and systemic change in higher education. Packed with actionable insights and reflections, this conversation sheds light on the intersections of leadership, equity, and impactful work in the academic and practical realms of higher education.

Key Takeaways

• Leading for Change: Leadership is less about titles and more about staying true to values and fostering meaningful change.
• Relationships Drive Impact: Building trust and genuine relationships is essential for research and policy work that creates sustainable change.
• Equity as a Guiding Principle: Remaining grounded in equity requires a constant focus on community impact and collective learning.
• The Power of Reflection: Effective leadership starts with understanding historical and organizational contexts before taking action.
• Self-Care is Essential: Leaders must prioritize their well-being to sustain impactful work over the long term.

Dr. Poon traces her leadership journey back to her childhood experiences as the daughter of immigrants in Massachusetts, navigating both financial and racial traumas. Her passion for creating a more racially just society was sparked during college, where she combined her role as a resident advisor with transformative learning in ethnic studies. These formative moments inspired her to pursue a career in higher education, eventually leading her to research and systemic advocacy.

While working in student affairs, Dr. Poon often encountered challenges in convincing higher-ups to adopt equity-focused strategies. The recurring demand for “evidence and data” motivated her to pursue a PhD to gain the research skills necessary for systemic change. Her motivation wasn’t prestige but equipping herself with the tools to advocate for social justice and equity more effectively.

Dr. Poon highlights that leadership in higher education must extend beyond individual accolades to collective impact. Whether leading state-wide convenings or consulting on policy, her approach centers on relationships, shared learning, and trust—particularly important in litigious fields like college admissions.

Through her work with the College Admissions Futures CoLab, Dr. Poon fosters collaboration between scholars and practitioners, emphasizing the need for a common language and shared goals. These partnerships are crucial for translating research into actionable strategies that address real-world challenges.

Becoming a mother was a pivotal moment that reoriented Dr. Poon’s priorities toward making her work impactful and accessible. This personal experience reinforced her belief in the importance of communicating research findings in ways that resonate beyond academic circles, driving real change in policy and practice.

Dr. Poon integrates equity into her leadership by constantly reflecting on her values, journaling, and relying on trusted relationships to keep her accountable. She stresses the importance of understanding organizational and historical contexts to craft strategic, equity-focused initiatives.

Dr. Poon advises leaders to “live a lit review” by understanding the stories and systems that precede their arrival. This reflective practice allows leaders to build on existing strengths while thoughtfully addressing challenges. Additionally, she emphasizes focusing on small, sustainable actions that collectively lead to transformative change.

Hosts Cody Nielsen and Tomika reflect on the challenges, wins, and shifts in higher education and DEIB (Diversity, Equity, Inclusion, and Belonging) work over the past year. Together, they emphasize the importance of coalition building, adaptability, and sustaining momentum in social justice movements as we approach 2025.

• The Power of Coalition Building: Addressing societal challenges requires collective, grassroots-driven action to avoid isolation and sustain progress.
• Adapting Strategies for Long-Term Change: Learn how second-half adjustments in sports mirror the strategic pivots needed in DEIB work.
• Joy as Resistance: True progress begins when we connect, cultivate community, and pursue liberatory work grounded in joy and purpose.
• Redefining Leadership and Participation: Leadership in equity efforts isn't about individuals but fostering empowered communities with shared goals.

Why Coalition Building Matters Now More Than Ever 
Cody and Tomika open the episode by acknowledging the weight of the current social and political climate, including shifts that challenge diversity, equity, and inclusion efforts. Tomika reminds listeners of the importance of reframing challenges as opportunities to foster deeper coalitions and communities. Isolation, they agree, is one of the greatest threats to sustaining momentum.

Reflecting on the lessons learned from historical movements, they emphasize that systemic change has always come through collective, not individual, action. From grassroots organizing to coalition building, they encourage leaders to revisit old strategies while fostering inclusive spaces for dialogue, connection, and collaboration.

Adapting for Sustainable Progress 
One of the central themes of this episode is the need to pivot and adapt strategies, much like halftime adjustments in sports. Cody uses the metaphor of second-half game strategies to drive home the point that when traditional approaches no longer work, it’s critical to reassess, reframe, and try something new.

Tomika adds that organizations often face resistance to change because people fear shifts in long-standing values. She stresses the importance of articulating clear goals—like liberation, equity, and belonging—and creating spaces that invite participation, regardless of starting points. Leaders must remain committed to the long game, ensuring that everyone feels a sense of belonging and purpose.

Joy, Connection, and the Path Forward 
Throughout the conversation, both hosts champion joy as a form of resistance. Tomika shares a powerful story about a colleague who felt a renewed sense of belonging when invited to share authentically. This moment underscores the transformational power of building spaces where people can contribute without fear or pretense.

Cody highlights that leaders must foster spaces of vulnerability where diverse voices feel heard, valued, and empowered. As they look ahead to 2025, both hosts agree: it’s time to focus on sustainable change rooted in authentic connection, shared purpose, and long-term strategy.

In closing, Cody and Tomika reflect on the lessons, leadership, and transformative discussions shared throughout the podcast season. They remind listeners that change is possible—but it requires community, adaptability, and joy-driven purpose.

In this episode of After Further Consideration, hosts Cody Nielsen and Tomika Ferguson engage in an inspiring and thought-provoking conversation with Dr. Eddie Moore Jr., a renowned voice in the field of diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI). As the founder of America and Moore and the White Privilege Conference, Dr. Moore shares his personal journey from overcoming addiction to becoming a leader in the fight against systemic inequality. His passion, resilience, and actionable strategies offer valuable insights for DEI practitioners navigating a challenging socio-political landscape.

Key Takeaways

• "Now Is Our Time": DEI professionals must see current challenges as an opportunity to shine and make a difference.
• Self-Care Is Essential: Prioritize mental and physical health to maintain longevity in social justice work.
• Collaboration Over Scarcity: Building partnerships and embracing a mindset of abundance enhances impact.
• Practice Participation: Quiet participants in DEI work need encouragement and diverse ways to engage.
• Face Hate with Preparedness: Resistance often signals meaningful work; respond strategically, not fearfully.

What inspired Dr. Moore to pursue DEI work?
Dr. Moore's journey began with his own struggles. As a college athlete and later a graduate, he returned home to an environment that led him into addiction. A second chance—choosing sobriety over incarceration—was a pivotal moment, launching his academic and professional career. His commitment to DEI solidified during his PhD program, where he was challenged to confront white supremacy and oppression directly in his work.

How does Dr. Moore maintain optimism amid crises in DEI work?
Dr. Moore emphasizes "pessimistic optimism," which combines hope with actionable strategies. He likens current challenges to a Super Bowl moment for social justice advocates, where preparation and resilience take center stage. By framing opposition as evidence of impactful work, he motivates others to persist in the face of adversity.

How should leaders approach the quiet participant in DEI efforts?
Dr. Moore sees silence as the greatest ally of hate. To engage quiet participants, he suggests creating diverse opportunities for involvement—writing responses, sharing creative reflections, or participating in smaller discussions. He encourages leaders to emphasize the necessity of action, reminding them that participation can take many forms.

What actionable strategies does Dr. Moore recommend for DEI leaders?

• Continuous Learning: Stay informed about trends and best practices in DEI.
• Self-Care: Incorporate activities like walking, reflection, or prayer into daily routines.
• Collaborative Spirit: Work with others to build a collective impact.
• Engaging Youth: Inspire and mentor the next generation to sustain progress.

What is Dr. Moore's message to those facing hate and resistance?
Dr. Moore advises taking hate mail and protests as a sign of meaningful work. He stresses preparedness and strategic action without succumbing to fear. Highlighting the importance of collaboration and faith, he believes this is the moment for seasoned advocates to step up and lead.

Dr. Moore’s parting advice? Recognize this time of heightened challenges as an opportunity to advance meaningful change. His mantra for DEI leaders: "Now is our time."

Guest Name: Eddie Moore, Moore for America, The White Privilege Institute

Guest Social: linkedin.com/in/eddiemoorejr

Guest Bio: Dr. Eddie Moore, Jr. has pursued and achieved success in academia, business, diversity, leadership and community service. In 1996, he started  to provide comprehensive diversity, privilege, leadership and #BecomingAntiRacist trainings/workshops. He is recognized as one of the nation’s top speakers and educators.  

Dr. Eddie Moore, Jr. has pursued and achieved success in academia, business, diversity, leadership and community service. In 1996, he started America & MOORE, LLC to provide comprehensive diversity, privilege, leadership and #BecomingAntiRacist training/workshops. He is recognized as one of the nation’s top motivational/educational speakers and practitioners. His interview with Wisconsin Public Radio won the 2015 Wisconsin Broadcasters Association's Best Interview in Medium Market Radio, 1st Place, he is featured in the film “I’m not Racist….Am I?” and in the article 5 Clear Ways to Tell Whether You'll Be a Good Leader in 2021. Dr. Moore was recently named one of  Wisconsin's 51 Most Influential Black Leaders and in 2022 was the recipient of the ABA Section of Labor and Employment Law’s Honorable Bernice B. Donald Diversity, Equity and Inclusion in the Legal Profession Award. He is also the Founder/Program Director for the global White Privilege Conference (WPC). 

In 2014 Dr. Moore founded The Privilege Institute (TPI) which engages people in research, education, action and leadership through workshops, conferences, publications and strategic partnerships and relationships. He is co-founder of the on-line journal Understanding and Dismantling Privilege, co-editor of Everyday White People Confront Racial and Social Injustice: 15 Stories, The Guide for White Women who Teach Black Boys,The Diversity Consultant Cookbook: Preparing for the Challenge (2019), Teaching Beautiful Brilliant Black Girls (2021) and Lil’ e - The Big Misunderstanding (2020). Over a 10-years span, he served as Dir of Diversity at Brooklyn Friends School (Brooklyn, NY) and The Bush School (Seattle, WA). Dr. Moore received his PhD from the University of Iowa in Education Leadership. His PhD research is on Black Football Players at Division III Schools in the Midwest.