For the Season 11 finale—the season's 11th episode—we go to 11, earning ourselves an "E" for some cussin'

In the ALP's most meta-episode, two podcasters hit record and promptly turn the show into a show about conversation, consulting, and being human. 

Emily Smith, VP of Partner Success at CollegeVine and host of the terrific podcast, The Vinedown with Emily Smith, joins Ken to talk podcast origin stories, why vendor content too often feels “imperious,” and how she builds a looser, more generous show that invites guests to actually "go there."

We compare notes on consulting craft (including Ken's early tendency to overdeliver), the outsider/insider lens she’s honed across work with hundreds of colleges, and a smart take on AI as a thought partner—not a cheat code. Emily also drops a keeper: pattern-break vision—spotting the stale thing we repeat for no good reason and reframing it so others can finally see it.

The episode, in true Emily fashion, is quick, witty, and wildly human. (Her take on Mary Oliver's poetry in the Rapid Descent is gold.)

• 00:00 — Cold-open chaos
• 05:38 — Emily’s show origin, friction of starting, and why “imperious” content misses the mark
• 07:32 — Trust from CollegeVine; leaning out from salesy moments
• 10:44 — Early episodes, dropping the brand preamble, finding the voice
• 13:37 — Doubt & impostor syndrome thread (and why it shows up)
• 15:46 — Outsider vs. insider: value of the outside lens; “600 colleges” perspective
• 19:18 — Consulting arc: outsider credibility, my over-delivering phase, and the line “everything you say must be true… but you need not say every true thing”
• 22:22 — “Noise-lumberjack”: cutting clutter vs. adding it
• 24:28 — Community building and how Emily chooses (and handles inbound) guests
• 29:02 — Jeff Selingo gets a public invite to join the show + the “VP Council” mini-series idea (a teaser for season 12).
• 34:06 — Using GPT well: training on transcripts; AI as creative accelerator
• 40:30 — Key takeaway, from pattern-match to pattern-break vision
• 43:33 — Rapid Descent (spoiler, there's talk of heliskiing in Alaska)
• 55:16 — Outtake: first meeting, Colorado life, and Emily's “Hello Humans” sign

The ALP is supported by RHB, a division of SIG. Music arranged by Ryan Anselment

Chris George—Associate Vice President for Enrollment at St. Olaf College—brings joy, grit, and a runner’s curiosity to this conversation that has less to do with enrollment leadership than it does with living life fully. We trace his path from student life to directing financial aid on day one; how the Lawlor Summer Seminar jump-started a lifelong habit of building a board of experts; and why he asks his team to buy two coffees a year with people outside their lane. We detour to Japan (the Shimanami Kaidō ride), a sunrise stair run inside Athens’ original Olympic stadium, and a family story that turns organ donation into triumph—culminating in a father–son-daughter triathlon three months post-transplant. (I'm not crying; you're crying.) We close with what Japan is doing about its own enrollment cliff and the best advice Chris ever got: understand why a process exists before you change it.

Inspired by Chris's story? Visit donatelife.net

00:00 — Cold open with the “most joyful person in admission.”

02:45 — From residence life to enrollment: the six-story Christmas Eve flood that changed everything.

05:05 — “Director on day one”: learning financial aid by building a network fast.

08:20 — Lawlor Summer Seminar → lifelong connectors; creating your board of experts.

11:55 — Internal networking: have two coffees a year outside your lane.

13:30 — Campus beat reporters example (disability services as cross-campus liaisons).

15:10 — Chris's approach to curating his social persona: runs, rides, and family.

16:15 — On how to truly arrive in a place. Chris's approach is to run in every city you sleep in (and what it reveals about place).

18:50 — Japan: solo ride on the Shimanami Kaidō; hospitality and arrival.

25:35 — Athens: alone inside the Panathenaic Stadium at sunrise—an all-timer.

27:55 — The arc of his son's post organ transplant journey: hospital hallway walks → stolen bases → a family triathlon.

32:05 — Call to action: become an organ donor (donatelife.net).

33:15 — Japan’s enrollment cliff: pathways to residency, international student strategy.

41:05 — Rapid Descent: walkout song, books, breakfast, and staying connected to Colorado sports.

45:25 — Best advice: understand the “why” before changing the “how.”

47:20 — Bucket list (Australia, Alaska, Ireland… and bring the family back to Greece).

The ALP is supported by RHB, a division of SIG. Music arranged by Ryan Anselment

Even though we've only known each other for less than two years, this episode feels like one between two old friends. The newly-minted Dr. Jen Gagne, Executive Director of Admissions at Colorado School of Mines, brings warmth and wit while digging into important stuff: pathways to thriving for queer-spectrum students, how she navigated being an internal candidate, why grad schools are structurally “separate and replicated,” and a spot-on pattern-match between kindergarteners and first-year college students.

We also hit college football haircuts (yes, really), her terrific bucket-list twist on the B&B.

Stick around for the epilogue where we swap stories about high-touch, memorable college welcome rituals that create community and belonging.

Highlights

00:00 — An unusual opening and origin stories
03:30 — Overseeing undergrad and grad admissions at Colorado School of Mines.
04:50 — Mountains, mines, and the glowing “M” that lights up Golden.
05:50 — College football haircuts and mustaches (look it up, friends).
06:30 — From interim to Executive Director.
08:10 — Doctoral work on queer-spectrum students and the college experience.
09:30 — Language matters: why Jen uses “queer spectrum and trans spectrum.”
11:00 — Invisible minorities, safe-space signals, and vanishing LGBTQ centers.
15:20 — Inside view: navigating the tricky path of being an internal candidate.
19:30 — A non-traditional path through advising, career, and student life to EM.
22:20 — Why graduate admissions feels “separate and replicated.”
26:30 — The complexity of overlapping grad cycles and constant motion.
29:50 — Finding community and confidence in Colorado’s admissions network.
31:20 — Leadership in flux: “If you say you know what to do, you’re lying or delusional.”
33:35 — Pattern matching: how kindergartners and first-year students share the same transition.
36:00 — Rapid Descent, (HOT TO GO!, Handsome, and The Speed of Trust)
45:15 — Epilogue: Helluva Welcome week, ten-pound rocks, whitewashing the “M,” and hard-hats. Also, class colors, dirt and the formula for chlorophyll.

The ALP is supported by RHB, a division of SIG. Music arranged by Ryan Anselment

Brian Troyer, Vice President for Enrollment Management at Marquette University, joins the ALP for a conversation that explores the deep roots of Jesuit leadership and the lighthearted joys of life in Milwaukee, including:

• Marquette’s Gift of Time and why institutional rest matters.
• How the university discerned its move to test-optional admissions, grounded in archival research and mission alignment.
• The legacies of leaders like Ray Brown, Roby Blust, and the late President Mike Lovell — and how Brian carries that mantle forward.
• Reflections from the Ignatian Colleagues Program, including the reminder to “pause and let our soul catch up.”
• Brian’s dissertation on how high schoolers’ ecological environments shape their sense of what’s possible after graduation.
• Plus: Tolkien manuscripts, bourbon tours, and a meditation on raw vs. fried cheese curds.

It’s a conversation about integrity, mission, and belonging ... peppered with a fair amount of laughter, reflection, friendship and bourbon.

• 01:30 – A family road trip and Marquette’s Gift of Time.
• 04:20 – Remembering Mike Lovell and lessons in leadership.
• 07:10 – Why and how Marquette went test-optional, with help from the archives.
• 09:20 – Tolkien manuscripts, reading The Hobbit to his son, and dreaming of Stephen Colbert in the archives.
• 12:30 – Retention milestones: two of the best years in Marquette’s history.
• 15:00 – Honoring Ray Brown and Roby Blust (and how Roby's fishing skills resemble that of a well-known biblical fisherman).
• 18:55 – Leadership lessons: integrity, mission alignment, and Shaka Smart’s “relationships, growth, victory.”
• 25:45 – Ignatian Colleagues Program and contemplatives in action.
• 28:45 – A six-day silent retreat and the wisdom of pausing to let our soul catch up.
• 31:30 – Dissertation insights: how ecology shapes student horizons.
• 36:00 – A bourbon detour: Eagle Rare, Buffalo Trace, and Kentucky connections.
• 39:45 – Milwaukee Chamber of Commerce: Kopp’s burgers, Lakefront Brewery, and cheese curds.
• 43:15 – Raw vs. fried cheese curds: a meditation.
• 44:20 – Rapid Descent.

The ALP is supported by RHB, a division of SIG. Music arranged by Ryan Anselment

Candace Boeninger, Vice President for Enrollment Management at Ohio University, joins the ALP to share lessons from her journey into senior leadership, reflecting on her experience working with an executive coach and how it helped her navigate the transition to cabinet-level leadership, as well as her evolving understanding of power—and the responsibility that comes with it.

Candace also shares her approach to “being a student of the profession,” including the podcasts and newsletters that keep her sharp.

• 00:00 — Welcome and Candace’s path to Ohio University.
• 06:00 — From construction software to admissions: “other duties as assigned” and career pivots.
• 13:30 — On career progression: “I want to do work that matters, and I don’t want to work for a bozo.”
• 15:30 — Leadership development and discovering executive coaching.
• 18:50 — The Hogan assessment and learning to find direction without waiting for top-down instruction.
• 24:20 — Lessons from coaching: finding her voice, learning to hold power, and using it responsibly.
• 28:50 — The tension between being a people pleaser and wielding power.
• 29:50 — “If you aren’t willing to become a student of the profession, then you’re probably not going to have very much fun.”
• 31:50 — Her routine for digesting information: Future U, NASFAA’s Off The Cuff, NACAC Admission News, NASFAA newsletter.
• 38:20 — Rapid Descent.

The ALP is supported by RHB, a division of SIG. Music arranged by Ryan Anselment

Rakin “Rock” Hall, Vice President for Enrollment Management and Student Success at Ithaca College, brings a unique mix of reflection, humor, and leadership to The Admissions Leadership Podcast.

In this wide-ranging conversation, Rock shares his take on the promise and perils of AI in higher education, why he's been creating short-form video reflections on leadership and life, and how his first-generation journey shaped the way he now guides his own daughter through the college search.

We also dive into his surprising background in stand-up comedy—what Richard Pryor, George Carlin, and basement record players taught him about timing, connection, and stage presence—and how those lessons echo in his current leadership and storytelling.

It’s a conversation about creativity, courage, and how "leadership is a verb."

• 00:00 – Introduction: Rock Hall, VP for EM at Ithaca College, joins the show.
• 01:30 – Insights on AI: Insights on artificial intelligence from the CollegeVine Vineyard conference, AGI, and higher education.
• 07:00 – Playing with AI tools: How Rock uses ChatGPT and other platforms for reflection and writing.
• 09:30 – TikTok beginnings: Why his wife nudged him to start short-form video reflections—and how they’ve grown.
• 13:30 – “The path of preference is the psychology of choice”: Rock explains one of his more memorable posts.
• 17:00 – Accompanying his daughter through the college search: Reflections as a first-gen father and enrollment leader parent.
• 26:00 – Comedy roots revealed: Hat-tip to Marie Bigham the heads up to Ken, Rock shares how basement record players, Pryor, and Carlin lit the spark for an early journey in comedy.
• 27:00 – College course in stand-up: From class requirement to 15-minute set, and the thrill of getting the crowd on his side.
• 28:30 – Sliding doors moment: Considering a move to LA for comedy before admissions work pulled him in.
• 31:00 – Stage effect today: How comedy chops translate into speaking, presenting, and leading.
• 32:30 – Bombing, self-reflection, and lessons learned: Rock on humility, feedback, and growth.
• 35:30 – Leadership as a verb: Using writing and reflection to stay grounded in service.
• 39:40 – Rapid Descent

The ALP is supported by RHB, a division of SIG. Music arranged by Ryan Anselment

Phil Moreno—Associate Director of College Counseling at the Nueva School and Board Chair for the National Association for College Admission Counseling—joins this episode of The ALP to talk about what it means to lead leaders in challenging times, why gratitude and handwritten notes matter, and how he’s learned to “stay on the bike” while also carving out intentional moments of stillness and renewal. He shares the practices—from solo retreats to time outdoors under dark skies—that help him restore his energy and model balance for others in a profession that asks us to give constantly.

Come for the insights, stay for the velvety voice of a professionally trained broadcaster (the guest; not the host).

Highlights

• 00:00 – Introduction: Phil introduces himself, his role at Nueva, and his work as NACAC Board Chair.
• 03:36 – The Nueva School: Founded on Nobel laureates’ vision, Nueva emphasizes curiosity, design thinking, and social-emotional learning.
• 06:45 – Switching sides: Why Phil left college admissions after nearly 20 years to counsel students at the secondary level.
• 09:06 – Relationships first: The mentors, associations, and small invitations that shaped his career—and why he now works to extend those same invitations to others.
• 13:36 – Leading in challenging times: Guiding NACAC through political attacks on DEI, and reflecting on past moments of crisis leadership.
• 16:47 – A unifying role: How Phil sees himself as a bridge-builder and “leader of leaders,” making space for every voice at the table while keeping the group focused on action.
• 21:31 – NACAC as family: Why he views conference season as a chance to check in on colleagues and carry their lived challenges into board decision-making.
• 24:15 – Self-care (perhaps Ken's favorite part of the episode): Phil’s philosophy of “staying in motion” and the importance of intentional pauses. He describes finding renewal through stillness, solo getaways, and immersion in art and nature.
• 28:17 – Reset moments: From visiting Michael Heizer’s vast desert installation City to hiking remote trails and camping under dark skies, Phil explains how solitude outdoors restores his perspective.
• 36:55 – College Horizons: Why he commits time each year to this extraordinary program (run by ALP alumna, Carmen Lopez) serving Native students, and how it reinvigorates his sense of purpose.
• 39:16 – Leadership qualities: Gratitude, lifting others up, modeling behavior through action, and the power of living authentically.
• 43:43 – Rapid Descent.

The ALP is supported by RHB, a division of SIG. Music arranged by Ryan Anselment

From a childhood “baseball club” in Boston to becoming a Dean of Admission at just 27, Thyra Briggs, Vice President for Admission and Financial Aid at Harvey Mudd College, has built a career defined by curiosity, courage, and care.

In this episode, Thyra reflects on the role of baseball in her story—including a thoughtful gift from Ray Brown and why she’s known as “Aunt Bob”—and the way cover letters have become her personal test for knowing when an opportunity is truly the right fit. She also talks about the leadership qualities that have shaped her approach over three decades: the grace to assume good intent, and the transparency to build trust with colleagues and counselors alike.

Along the way, she shares what it’s like to lead through moments of risk—especially during a tricky moment when she was the board president for the Common Application—the lessons she’s carried from Sarah Lawrence to Harvey Mudd, and why “never say never” has been a guiding theme in her professional life.

00:00 – Introduction: From Boston roots to Harvey Mudd.
01:20 – The “baseball club” and why her brother still calls her “Bob.”
05:00 – A special baseball: one of the most meaningful gifts ever.
07:00 – Growing up a Red Sox fan (and marrying a Yankees fan).
10:24 – From Connecticut College to Sarah Lawrence: first career steps.
13:00 – Four presidents, two institutions, and why she’s stayed.
15:30 – Choosing small colleges, quality of life, and cabinet-level impact.
18:10 – New presidents, new challenges, and the affordability task force.
21:25 – Academic roots in religion and child development, and the “never say never” theme.
23:00 – Public speaking fears, Common App crisis leadership, and surviving “majestic flop sweat.”
26:47 – Moving west: the serendipity of Harvey Mudd.
29:50 – How she decides which opportunities to pursue (and the cover letter test).
32:09 – A big risk: becoming Dean of Admission at 27.
36:00 – Mentors, financial aid partners, and learning with humility.
39:45 – Two leadership cornerstones: grace and transparency.
42:40 – Generational shifts in the profession and evolving work expectations.
45:55 – Rapid Descent

The ALP is supported by RHB, a division of SIG. Music arranged by Ryan Anselment

Jeremy Lowe, Assistant Vice Provost for Undergraduate Admission at American University, has built his leadership style on lessons from three seemingly different places: the punk rock stage, long walks through D.C., and intentional pauses in the face of challenges. In this conversation, Jeremy shares how getting heckled and booed by 1,500 fans taught him resilience, how a 10-mile-a-day walking habit (unbroken since 2020) fuels his problem-solving, and why under-reacting has become one of his most valuable tools as a leader. Along the way, he reflects on belonging, fun, and helping students focus on who they are becoming.

00:00 – Jeremy’s intro from the nation’s capital and a callback to Lisa Keegan’s “why isn’t Jeremy on the show?” moment.
02:50 – Six years on the National Merit Scholarship Review committee and why the work (and mission) is often misunderstood. (Plus a shout-out to Tim McGuire.)
08:16 – Origin story: from C-student in St. Petersburg, FL, to punk rock guitarist in a band called Free Sample.
11:18 – On getting heckled and booed by 1,500 fans ... and why it's awesome.
13:40 – Lessons from punk rock that translate to admissions: resilience, self-promotion, logistics, and collaboration.
15:18 – Barton College, wearing many hats, and finding a professional home at American University.
18:46 – Walking 10 miles a day since 2020: solitude, reflection, and a cast of characters
23:06 – Walking as problem-solving and stress relief, including during the national search for his current role.
26:20 – The email-to-self system for capturing ideas mid-stride.
27:48 – Advice to his younger self: know you belong, have fun, and help students focus on becoming.
30:36 – Balancing joy and gravity in higher ed: why underreacting is a leadership superpower.
33:43 – Music-sharing at weekly team meetings as a culture-builder.
35:40 – Touching grass: reconnecting with students to stay grounded.
36:39 – Packing the backpack for a leadership climb: curiosity and networking.
41:33 – “Networking is better than not working.”
42:07 – Rapid Descent.

The ALP is supported by RHB, a division of SIG. Music arranged by Ryan Anselment

In this episode of The Admissions Leadership Podcast, Justin Rummel, Vice President for Enrollment at Susquehanna University, shares how his journey to the VP seat followed anything but the traditional path.

With no background in admissions, Justin’s career has spanned state politics, federal financial aid policy, compliance and internal audit in both for-profit and non-profit institutions, and leadership in student financial services. It’s a route shaped by systems thinking, sharp financial acumen, and a deep commitment to student success.

Together we explore:

• What it means to lead enrollment without an admissions pedigree
• How financial aid, audit, and bursar roles prepare leaders to think institutionally
• The importance of trust, consistency, and humility when leading former peers
• How early exposure to policy and risk management shaped his leadership lens
• Why belonging starts long before students apply—and how early tech may be shifting the timeline

We also touch on the joys of commencement, the limits of the “demographic cliff” narrative, and the tools—both high and low tech—that still work to connect with students.

00:00 – Justin’s introduction: A “unicorn” in enrollment, Justin shares his unconventional path from state government to the VP seat.
03:22 – Financial aid roots: From policy work to compliance roles in for-profit higher ed.
06:14 – Audit and operations: What internal audit taught him about systems thinking, risk, and institutional mission.
09:35 – Commencement joy: Why student success moments matter across all sectors.
14:14 – Becoming a bursar: Learning to lead teams and navigate complex operations.
15:50 – Scaling down with purpose: How moves to Salisbury and Susquehanna brought him closer to mission.
20:35 – The unexpected call: Saying yes to the VP opportunity, and being ready when it came.
23:16 – From peer to leader: Building trust, showing up physically, and staying consistent during a leadership transition.
26:07 – Operating at altitude: Navigating cabinet conversations and board dynamics with financial fluency.
31:02 – Audit wisdom: How his mentor’s mantra informs his leadership today.
35:57 – Crossing the ravine: Reframing the demographic cliff as less of a crisis and more of a shared opportunity.
38:15 – Belonging and early tech: How technology shapes identity long before students reach college.
41:25 – Low-tech, high-trust: Why the phone (and other old tools) still matter in a digital world.
43:32 – The Rapid Descent: Pearl Jam, Granny Smith apples, handwritten notes, and a dream of Kilimanjaro.

The ALP is supported by RHB, a division of SIG. Music arranged by Ryan Anselment