Most people take it for granted that consciousness is the one thing science cannot explain. Julian Kiverstein thinks the problem has been set up backwards from the start. Rather than beginning with dead, inert matter and asking how it could ever give rise to experience, he inverts the question: start from lived experience, which is where phenomenology begins, and then ask how the physical world fits inside it. From that single move he rebuilds the story of how mind emerges from life, and argues the notorious "hard problem" looks far less intractable once you stop trying to squeeze consciousness out of physics.
An Assistant Professor of Neurophilosophy at the University of Amsterdam, Kiverstein has spent his career closing the gap between scientific explanation and first-person experience, working across phenomenology, 4E cognitive science, and psychiatry. We get into his Skilled Intentionality Framework and his account of affordances, the idea that the possibilities the world offers us are neither purely subjective nor purely objective but relational, arising between a living being and its environment. He makes the case that the brain is not literally a computer, only usefully modelled as one, and that treating the model as the reality is a fallacy of misplaced concreteness. There is no rain inside a weather simulation, and by the same logic no computation literally happening inside the skull.
TIMESTAMPS
0:00:00 Start
0:00:48 Meet Julian Kiverstein: A Career Between Disciplines
0:08:02 Why Varela's "Embodied Mind" Changed Everything
0:12:18 Does Phenomenology Dissolve the Hard Problem?
0:19:59 Where Does Consciousness Begin? Panpsychism vs Biopsychism
0:27:42 The Zombie Objection: Sense-Making "With the Lights Out"?
0:31:24 Sentience vs Sense-Making: A Smaller Gap Than You Think
0:35:54 Hans Jonas, Metabolism & the Origin of a Point of View
0:41:23 Starting From Consciousness, Not Physics
0:46:10 Neutral Monism & the Self-World Relation
0:51:32 Intentionality & the Birth of Skilled Intentionality
0:57:46 Dreyfus, AI & Why Computers Can't Cope
1:05:28 Was Dreyfus Faithful to Heidegger? Where He Went Wrong
1:15:52 Gibson, Affordances & Direct Perception
1:22:01 Is It Really Metaphysics, or Just Context?
1:30:01 Relational Realism: Salt, Solubility & the World We Know
1:36:02 Is the Mind a Computer? Models vs Reality
1:46:44 Marr, Whitehead & the Fallacy of Misplaced Concreteness
1:53:33 What Is Information? Bateson, Genes & Purpose
1:57:38 From Survival to Flourishing: Psychedelics & Unselfing
2:06:11 Living in Your Head While Studying the Body
2:13:31 What Keeps Him Up at Night: Philosophy Back Into Life
READ
Key insights and the full transcript here: https://tiagovf.com/posts/podcast-affordances-embodiment-and-the-hard-problem-with-julian-kiverstein
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MUSIC CREDIT
Intro song by Lief Sjostrom, titled Peril, from the album 'Impossible Parade' Website: https://liefsjostrom.com/ Album: https://liefsjostrom.bandcamp.com/album/impossible-parade