Dan rides solo this week in conversation with Jonathan Trimble of And Rising.

Jonathan is the Co-Founder of And Rising, a pioneering agency which invests creative capital to help brands scale.

Creative capital is when an investor offers a mix of strategic and creative skills in place of cash, often more valuable to rapidly scaling businesses if the right mix.

In fact, a sign of its incredible value is that And Rising's portfolio brands have been involved in a combined £1.7 Billion of value at exit.

We speak about why brand is becoming ever more important for tech businesses, the two paths to scaling a brand today and the ever-increasing TikTokification of advertising - yes we did just say TikTokification.

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