Biblical Genetics

Biblical Genetics

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Biblical Genetics episodes

  • Human vs Chimp Part 3: a deep dive into how statistics are being misused

    The opponents of biblical creation have made some glaring errors in their criticisms of prior work on human-chimpanzee genetic differences. Specifically, several of their claims are in conflict with both theory and experiment. I document these here in detail. They have also shown a rudimentary understanding of how scientific data needs to be ‘weighted’ and they completely misunderstand how BLAST is supposed to work. Despite the high level of vitriol I have received so far, I submit this detailed analysis of their work for your review.

    Links:

    • As promised, example programs etc. can be found at: https://github.com/BiblicalGenetics/Human-Chimp
    • Creationist research is utter, utter poo, Roohif, 14 Sep 2018; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D117oXq8yT4
    • “80% Chimpanzee” | The Bogus Creationism of Jeffery Tomkins, Gutsick Gibbon, 26 May 2023; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtTHlqhRQi0
    • Tomkins Responded to Me (Kinda?), Gutsick Gibon, 7 Jul 2023; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYw9jl5jArE&t=18s
    • Jeffrey Tomkins, The Creationist Who Can’t Math: The Movie, Dapper Dinosaur, 24 Aug 2023; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BasDcbzx3AM
    • Human vs Chimp: an honest appraisal of our differences, Biblical Genetics, 15 Aug 2023; https://youtu.be/FHg3LqJI34g
    • The three attempted rebuttal videos: Professional Creationist RESPONDS to my Tomkins Debunk (kinda), 23 Aug 2023; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq1AcyHfLrA; Robert Carter, Liar | Creationists Have a Bad Relationship with Honesty: Part 2, Dapper Dinosaur, 23 Aug 2023; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sx91ljv32Yc; Creationists Behaving Badly: Dr. Rob Carter, Creation Myths, 23 Aug 2023; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9LrhBnVXks0.
    • Human vs Chimp, part 2: Digging deeper into our roots, Biblical Genetics, 5 Oct 2023; https://youtu.be/_vsGVN21TQU.
    • 1 hr 38 min
    • Human vs Chimp part 2

      This is the second installment in a now multi-part series on human and chimpanzee genetic differences. I had a lot of pushback from my last episode, including negative reviews posted by Gutsick Gibbon, Creation Myths, and Dapper Dinosaur. Unperturbed, I push on. Here, I lay out some of the arguments in more detail and discuss many of the problems people are having when using one particular program, BLAST, to assess similarity between the two species. I will address the results of Gutsick Gibbon specifically in Part 3, but this was filmed before I got most of my experimental results back.

      Links (many of these are for Part 3 also):

      Background:

      • Creationist research is utter, utter poo, Roohif, 14 Sep 2018.
      • “80% Chimpanzee” | The Bogus Creationism of Jeffery Tomkins, Gutsick Gibbon, 26 May 2023.
      • Tomkins Responded to Me (Kinda?), Gutsick Gibon, 7 Jul 2023.
      • Jeffrey Tomkins, The Creationist Who Can’t Math: The Movie, Dapper Dinosaur, 24 Aug 2023.
      • My first installment:

        • Human vs Chimp: an honest appraisal of our differences, Biblical Genetics, 15 Aug 2023.
        • The three attempted rebuttal videos:

          • Professional Creationist RESPONDS to my Tomkins Debunk (kinda), 23 Aug 2023.
          • Robert Carter, Liar | Creationists Have a Bad Relationship with Honesty: Part 2, Dapper Dinosaur, 23 Aug 2023.
          • Creationists Behaving Badly: Dr. Rob Carter, Creation Myths, 23 Aug 2023.
          • 33 min
          • Human vs Chimp: an honest evaluation of our genetic differences

            Several anti-creationists have made a hobby out of attacking creationists. Their best efforts, however, have generally failed. For example, see:

            • Sanford 2013 Critic ignores reality of Genetic Entropy: the author of a landmark book on genomic decay responds to unsustainable criticisms creation.com 7 Mar 2013.
            • Price, Carter, and Sanford 2020, Responding to supposed refutations of genetic entropy from the ‘experts’, creation.com, 1 Dec 2020.
            • Unperturbed, “Gutsick Gibbon” has recently tried to discredit Dr Jeffrey Tomkins and his work on human-chimp genetic similarities:

              • “80% Chimpanzee” | The Bogus Creationism of Jeffery Tomkins” 26 May 2023 youtube.com/watch?v=QtTHlqhRQi0.
              • In my analysis of her analysis, I note several flaws in her logic. Note, however, that I deliberately ignored several of her main objections. This was not because I do not have answers, mind you, but because I wanted to focus on the most salient questions. Ignored were questions about why God would have included all the chimp-like non-coding DNA when he made humans and questions about properly weighting samples.

                The most recent comparison I am aware of claimed 96.6% similarity between humans and chimps:

                • Seaman and Buggs 2020 FluentDNA: nucleotide visualization of whole genomes, annotations, and alignments, Frontiers in Genetics 30;11:292.
                • This comes from the laboratory of Richard Buggs. This is much higher than Tomkins’ estimates, that, with one exception, are generally in the 80s. However, I know the first author on that paper, so I called him up to discuss his methods. Sure enough, he used entirely different methodology than earlier work from that same laboratory (which arrived at an estimate of ~85%). To reach the higher percentage similarity, they cut out everything humans and chimps do not share, including the centromeres, telomeres, copy number variations of many annotated genes, and hundreds of thousands of small insertions and deletions that must be included to align the two genomes. This “apples to apples” comparison is fine, as long as everybody acknowledges that the true similarity is necessarily less than 96.6%. Yet, if the percent similarity is much less than 99%, there is no way, mathematically, to explain how so many millions of difference arose in the (imagined) 6.5 million years since our last common ancestor.

                  Additional links:

                  • The Waiting Time Problem, BiblicalGenetics.com, 8 Jun 2021.
                  • Hierachical clustering complicates baraminiological analysis
                  • Carter 2021 Robert Carter gets everything wrong? Responding to even more ridiculous aspersions, creation.com, 10 July 2021.
                  • “Dr. Rob Carter Gets Everything Wrong (with Gutsick Gibbon)” 20 May 2021.
                  • Sibley and Alquist. 1991. The Phylogeny and Classification of Birds.
                  • King and Wilson. 1975. Evolution at two levels in humans and chimpanzees, Science 188(4184):107–116.
                  • Moorjani et al. 2016. Variation in the molecular clock of primates, PNAS 113(38):10607–10612.
                  • Sibley and Ahlquist. 1984. The phylogeny of the hominoid primates, as indicated by DNA-DNA hybridization, J Mol Evol 20(1):2–15.
                  • Sibley, Comstock, and Ahlquist. 1990. DNA hybridization evidence of hominoid phylogeny: a reanalysis of the data, J Mol Evol 30(3):202–36.
                  • Wikipedia page on DNA reassociation kinetics.
                  • Bergman and Tomkins 2012 Is the human genome nearly identical to chimpanzee?—a reassessment of the literature, Journal of Creation 26(1):54–60,
                  • Tomkins and Bergman 2012 Genomic monkey business—estimates of nearly identical human–chimp DNA similarity re-evaluated using omitted data, Journal of Creation 26(1):94–100,
                  • Tomkins 2013 Comprehensive analysis of chimpanzee and human chromosomes reveals average DNA similarity of 70%. Answers Research Journal 8:379–390. The version of BLAST he used for this paper had a flaw in the algorithm that only manifested when using extremely large data sets. Tomkins corresponded with the bioinformatics group at the NIH to get the BLASTN algorithm fixed, which they eventually did. Gutsick Gibbon claims her collaborator is the one who pointed it out. Personally, I do not know the order of events, but either way, the bug was fixed. See the notes on Tomkins 2016 below.
                  • Tomkins 2015 Documented anomaly in recent versions of the BLASTN algorithm and a complete reanalysis of chimpanzee and human genome-wide DNA similarity using Nucmer and LASTZ. Answers Research Journal 8:379–390.
                  • Tomkins 2016 Analysis of 101 chimpanzee trace read data sets: assessment of their overall similarity to human and possible contamination with human DNA. Answers Research Journal 9:294–298. This was a repeat of the 2013 paper, but after the bug was fixed. This is why Tomkins did not change his methods to allow for gaps. See the next entry, however.
                  • Tomkins 2018 Comparison of 18,000 de novo assembled chimpanzee contigs to the human genome yields average BLASTN alignment identities of 84%. Answers Research Journal 11:205–209. Here, Tomkins used long read chimp PacBio contigs, BLASTing them against the human genome with very liberal gap extension set. That study gave an average alignment similarity of 84%. Note that one of the main complaints is that Tomkins did not allow for gaps in his several papers. This is clearly not true. At least, the issue was certainly addressed five years ago. Note also that Tomkins ran his jobs on a local server, which took months to run and complete. Neither he nor I know exactly what she did, nor do I have a strong desire to attempt to repeat her methods. The fact that her ungapped human-to-human BLAST searches yield a percent similarity in the 80s is highly suspicious. If this is the case, BLAST is generally useless and I would assume this would be general knowledge. Nevertheless, this is less important than the fact that the human-chimp identity is demonstrably less than 96.6%.
                  • “They Lied to Us? (Humans & Chimps: Part 1) | The Creation Podcast: Episode 40” 10 Jan 2023.
                  • Lake County Forest Preserves: Fort Hill Trail
                  • Quentin Road Baptist Church, Exploring God’s Oceans (on In Grace TV), Dayspring Bible College and Seminary
                  • Midwest Creation Fellowship (Chicago area: north, south, and central), Quad-Cities Creation Science Association (Iowa)
                  • 22 min
                  • Eschatological Genetics

                    Dr Rob outlines three aspects of genetics that tell us that, scientifically, the human species is doomed to eventual extinction. These include the rate of mutation accumulation in our population over time, the inability of natural selection to remove most of those mutations, and the sheer number of children that would be required to remove the mutations, given perfect selection. These all argue that there is no hope, collectively, in any evolutionary process. Thus, biblically, the only hope for us individually is through belief in Jesus.

                    Links:

                    • Genetic entropy
                    • Basener et al. 2023 Dynamical systems and fitness maximization in evolutionary biology
                    • Fisher’s failure and the dramatic end of neo-Darwinism
                    • Genealogy vs Phylogeny: The War Continues
                    • 15 min
                    • Fisher’s failure and the dramatic end of neo-Darwinism

                      Dr Rob discusses a fundamental aspect of neo-Darwinism (Fisher’s Theorem of Natural Selection) and how it fails mathematically. First postulated in 1930, Fisher’s idea was promoted as something as firm and settled as the 2nd Law. Problem is, he made several incorrect assumptions that invalidate the whole thing. When you add realistic mutations to the scenario (e.g., Basener and Sanford’s ‘Fisher’s Theorem of Natural Selection with Mutations’), you see that the net trajectory of evolution is downward. Why did it take 90 years to figure this out?

                      Links:

                      • Basener and Sanford 2017 The fundamental theorem of natural selection with mutations
                      • Basener et al. 2021 Dynamical Systems and Fitness Maximization in Evolutionary Biology
                      • Keightley and Lynch 2003 Toward a realistic model of mutations affecting fitness
                      • Price 1972 Fisher’s ‘fundamental theorem’ made clear
                      • Fisher 1930 The Genetical Theory of Natural Selection (Wikipedia page)
                      • Carter 2020 A successful decade for Mendel’s Accountant
                      • 12 min
                      • Geeking out about DNA damage repair

                        Dr Rob waxes eloquent about some amazing new revelations involving DNA damage repair systems. Researchers recently turned AI onto the human genome, probing the genes and gene systems that are involved in maintaining and repairing DNA. The results shocked everyone. Many more genes that anyone thought are required, and entire new repair systems were discovered. So what came first, DNA or the amazing repair systems required to maintain DNA that are, in turn, coded into DNA? The point is that these systems are absolutely necessary for living things, yet they are also incredibly complicated. They would never be expected to arise without help, but without them the entire DNA system (not just the code, but the DNA itself) could never exist. Evolution, in this case, simply fails to explain much of anything.

                        Links:

                        Kratz et al. 2023. A multi-scale map of protein assemblies in the DNA damage response. Cell Syst 14(6):447-463.e8; https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37220749/

                        28 min
                      • Why you can’t trace your family tree to Adam and Eve

                        Everybody loves genealogy, but we are severely limited in what we can know about our family histories. There are two main reasons for this. First, family records only go back so far. Even the longest family trees can’t go back thousands of years. Second, personal genetics testing can only tell you who your closest relatives are. Yes, genetics can tell you what population you came from, but that is a matter of statistics, not documentation. This is not a problem for belief in the Bible. Adam and Eve are still the (sole) ancestors of everyone who has ever lived, it’s just that you cannot prove it with what we have available to us today.

                        16 min
                      • It’s an RNA world after all

                        Notes and links:

                        • Genetic Entropy, by John Sanford
                        • Keffer oak
                        • RNA: the epicenter of genetic information, by John Mattick and Paulo Amaral (reviewed by Witold Filipowicz)
                        • 26 min
                        • Bacteria deceived us! Life is not simple

                          Science advances in fits and starts, and it sometimes takes a detour onto a dead-end road. Bacteria represent one of those roads. Studying bacteria gave us a sense that we could easily figure out biology, that there was a direct connection between genes and behavior, and that life was simple. Granted, there was no other way to get started, but the study of bacteria slowed down our understanding of higher organisms in many ways. From the ‘one gene, one enzyme’ hypothesis to the thought that living systems can be reduced to a binary decision tree, many things about bacteria misled us and prevented science from seeing that the majority of the information in the genomes of higher organisms is in the non-coding DNA.

                          • C-value paradox
                          • G-value paradox
                          • Transcription factors
                          • Bathybius (on Creation.com)
                          • One gene, one enzyme hypothesis
                          • Lac operon
                          • Boolean data
                          • 18 min
                          • How I made fluorescent fish (a Christian response to genetic engineering)

                            Genetic engineering is a controversial topic. From vaccines to fetal cells to transhumanism, the debate rages. Yet, there are certain aspects to genetic engineering that are demonstrably good. How are we supposed to make heads or tails of this new technology, especially since it is impacting every aspect of our lives? I thought that a simple explanation (at least, as simple as I could make it!) of the things I did while earning my PhD could help increase our understanding. I, as a conservative Christian, made the ‘frankenfish’. I stole the genes for the bright green and red fluorescent proteins in corals, engineered them into bacteria, then into fish. There is nothing inherently difficult in what I did, but there were a LOT of steps. Perhaps, after this explanation, we can have a more civil discussion on the pros and cons.

                            Links and notes:

                            • Gibbs PDL, Carter RW, and Schmale MC (2008) Nucleic acid encoding fluorescent proteins from aquatic species. US Patent #7,413,874.
                            • Gibbs PDL, Carter RW, and Schmale MC (2007) Fluorescent Proteins from Aquatic Species. US Patent #7,291,711.
                            • Carter RW, Schmale MS, and Gibbs PDL (2004) Cloning of anthozoan fluorescent protein genes. Comparative Biochemistry and Physiology, Part C 138:259–270.
                            • Carter RW (2003) Cnidarian Fluorescent Proteins. PhD Dissertation. University of Miami.
                            • Manica A, Carter RW (2000) Morphological and fluorescence analysis of the Montastraea annularis species complex in Florida. Marine Biology 137:899–906.
                            • Monkeying around with human embryos?
                            • Harnessing God’s design to help prevent sickness, but will the new vaccine technology alter our DNA?
                            • Unnatural selection: CRISPR on Netflix
                            • Gene editing babies? A dangerous, pointless experiment
                            • Human/animal hybrids?
                            • Human Cloning?
                            • Mammoth clones coming to a zoo near you
                            • 36 min

                            About Biblical Genetics

                            From the publisher's feed

                            Biblical Genetics is a vlog/podcast by Dr. Robert Carter. His posts explore modern genetics through the lens of biblical history, and vice versa.