Phil Mullan discusses his latest book, Creative Destruction: How to Start an Economic Renaissance (Policy Press), with Austin Williams, director of the Future Cities Project. This was the official launch of the book.

While governments talk of rebalancing the economy, Mullan talks about a fourth industrial revolution - a revolution that doesn't prioritise holding onto jobs, but "lets the low-productivity parts of the economy go". Discuss.

As Mullan puts it, we have "a zombie economy that is being propped up to ensure the semblance of life". So is it time to turn off the life support, or continue CPR?