Brave New Workforce

Chett Garcia is an Associate Partner at Arete Partners, an executive search firm for VP, Head of, & Director talent at VC-backed startups. Chett is different from most recruiters because he approaches candidates with a people-first mentality. He’s been in this remote role for over three years and shares some of the challenges that have been uplifted now that we are in a more open digital economy.
Key Takeaways
According to the Fed, the economy as we know it might be over.
It’s time to find that new dream job in this economy.
Chett went from being a math teacher to a remote employee three years ago.
Why did Chett decide to move out of Philly?
People have life happening intermixed with their day-to-day work. Pandemic work is not technically considered remote work.
As a recruiter, how does Chett approach his job differently?
What’s been the landscape so far in regards to what Chett’s clients are looking for in more senior executive roles?
Larry has a feeling this is only going to allow clients to attract talent outside of the U.S. in an easier fashion.
It’s a big leap for a lot of executives to uproot their family and move to a different state, making it even harder to fill top-tier positions.
How does Chett mitigate the risks of finding talent that’s a good culture/relocation fit for his clients?
Where is this landscape headed in the next five years? Work is going to be a lot more fun!
Resources
Thebraveworkforce.com (http://thebraveworkforce.com/)
Bravenewcompanies.com (http://bravenewcompanies.com/)
Email Anna: [email protected] (mailto:[email protected])
Chett on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/chettgarcia/)
The economy as we knew it might be over, Fed Chairman says (https://edition.cnn.com/2020/11/12/economy/economy-after-covid-powell/index.html)
Special Guest: Chett Garcia.

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The world is moving, and the locals aren’t happy about it. When Larry moved to rural California, he was met with hostility. Trip experienced the same thing when he was a volunteer on an Indian reserve. Connected communities don’t like outsiders and Anna has seen how easy it is to fall into a silo with your other “outsider buddies” and never even pick up the local language in a foreign country. Each community you enter into has its own cultural language and it’s important to do a little bit of groundwork and research to properly acclimate beforehand.
Key Takeaways
Looking beyond Zoom towns, how will the politics and culture change as more people go home or move to a cheaper state?
Trip grew up in Washington, DC, and doesn’t remember differing opinions being so divided. People just seemed to respect each other a lot more back then.
Larry grew up in a town of 1,200 people. Currently, Larry lives in a rural part of California that leans red on the political spectrum. However, he’s been warned not to drive into certain states with California plates because they’re hated.
Every election cycle, someone wants to move to Canada. It’s actually pretty hard to do.
Anna has seen people move to new countries without doing any research on the culture or the long-term residency requirements.
Buying a new iPhone in Costa Rica is double the price than what you can get in the United States. Shipping things from Amazon into the country is expensive!
Trip shares a story about Trader Joe’s vs. Pirate Joe’s in Canada.
When Larry first moved to this part of California, there was not one friendly person to greet him because they knew he was an outsider.
Trip encountered something similar when he worked on an Indian reservation.
A lot of people are moving; the key is to understand the culture you’re about to enter into and understand the locals may be hostile.
Some city folk end up calling 911 when they see a bear. That’s not how things are done outside of the city.
Anna went to the United States, and because it’s so diverse, she had no idea who was a friend or foe if they were walking towards her after dark. She needed a culture buddy.
Larry experienced the same thing in China. He had no clue what was a safe neighborhood or not.
Anna believes we’ll still be seeing silos of the “outsider folk” in a community and they won’t make an effort to get to know the heart of the community they’re moving into.
You need to make an active effort to integrate with the local scene because the locals aren’t always going to welcome you with open arms.
Larry believes the distribution of people will still be good for us as a whole. However, there will be some growing pains.
We’ve heard about “fly-over states,” but it’s going to be “fly-into states.”
It’s so easy to compare how your old life was so much better than this new or smaller community you’re now a part of, but the locals will get tired of hearing it.
Believe it or not, you can find common ground with people who perceive you to be a murderer. Anna explains.
Resources
Thebraveworkforce.com (http://thebraveworkforce.com/)
Bravenewcompanies.com (http://bravenewcompanies.com/)
Email Anna: [email protected] (mailto:[email protected])
Nonviolent Communication: A Language of Life: Life-Changing Tools for Healthy Relationships, by Marshall Rosenberg (https://www.amazon.com/Nonviolent-Communication-Language-Life-Changing-Relationships/dp/189200528X)

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit bravenewworkforce.substack.com

Sarah McIlwain is the Director of Product Design at Abstract, a design collaboration tool that has a 100% distributed team. Sarah shares her insights on how a leader can build trust and connection through a digital work model and how to minimize useless meetings, and she outlines her documentation process that helps get everyone on the team seen and heard.
Key Takeaways
Sarah recently took on a new role at Abstract, which has a 100% distributed team. How’s it going so far?
The biggest obstacle you have to overcome, and this applies to both remote and physical models, is team culture and trust.
Sarah uses her one-on-one meetings to build trust and connection. Many people often hate it, but small talk goes a long way in doing that.
It’s difficult to be angry with someone with whom you are breaking bread.
How does Sarah manage meetings?
How much of Zoom fatigue is due to just people attending useless meetings?
Digital face-to-face meetings are so precious, so use as many tools as possible to get the “useless” meetings off of your team’s plate.
Trip shares how he turns what was discussed in meetings into applicable action steps.
A lot of meeting tools have built-in features (like transcription services) that can save an assistant’s time.
It’s time to reexamine your company’s processes and tools and see if they’re still serving you.
In a remote model, you have to get good at documenting.
You have to be really, really intentional with connecting with your team in a remote environment. We are wired to do this in person. Lack of trust means less innovation within your organization.
Doing a hybrid model can be unfair to your remote team because they get left out in the day-to-day details. Sarah shares how Abstract was able to create equality no matter where their team was.
How does Sarah take her documentation notes and turn them into action plans for the team?
The future really is remote.
Sarah is hiring right now!
Resources
Thebraveworkforce.com (http://thebraveworkforce.com/)
Bravenewcompanies.com (http://bravenewcompanies.com/)
Email Anna: [email protected] (mailto:[email protected])
Abstract.com (https://www.abstract.com/)
Sarah on Abstract (https://www.abstract.com/author/sarah-mcilwain)
Sarah on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/sarahmcilwain/) Special Guest: Sarah McIlwain.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit bravenewworkforce.substack.com

When it comes to what tools we should be using for our businesses, we’re having the wrong conversation. The tool is not necessarily the solution to the problem, it’s how you want the tool to act and work within your organization so that there is no confusion among your staff. What do you want your process to be when it comes to assigning new tasks, what meeting room to use, and other tools for collaboration? It’s important to take a step back and collaborate with your department heads to build out a tool playbook to get you going and to get you organized!
Key Takeaways
Anna and Larry wanted to talk about what type of meeting tools to use, but Trip has other plans…
Anna and Larry briefly try to troubleshoot Zoom, but Trip reminds us why we aren’t talking about specific tools today.
With so many tool options, there comes a lot of confusion on which tool to use and for who.
Zoom is outschool. Zoom is clanky. ZOOM is not the future!
Does this really need to be a meeting? Digital meetings have not stopped the root problem of useless meetings.
Trip shares a painful meeting experience he used to have that wasted so much time.
Does your company have a meeting process?
Each tool has its own gaps.
Everybody has their own preferences and the problem is that it’s not compatible.
When your hosts were trying to create this podcast, they ran into the same problem too when trying to collaborate. “Where is that document again?”
CFOs are banging their heads because the company is paying for this little tool here, this little tool there, and there’s no way to connect it all.
We’re six months in; it’s time to get your tools organized.
Larry recommends taking a step back and creating a playbook of how you want to operate. Get your department heads involved.
Don’t let your tools become “legacy” knowledge that your new onboarded employee has to go digging in the trenches to find and understand.
Optimizing your workforce requires innovation and it requires design thinking.
Do people really need to be at the “all hands” meeting? Is it really required?
Trip loves Whereby and Calendly.
Why does Larry use both Whereby and Zoom?
Do these products have a “moat” around them? What does Larry mean by this?
Resources
Thebraveworkforce.com (http://thebraveworkforce.com/)
Bravenewcompanies.com (http://bravenewcompanies.com/)
Email Anna: [email protected] (mailto:[email protected])
Whereby.com (https://whereby.com/)
Calendly.com (https://calendly.com/)

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit bravenewworkforce.substack.com

We don’t want to start this podcast off on a “told you so,” but that’s kind of what happened. After releasing the podcast in July, a lot of things have happened in the world, and it turns out Larry, Trip, and Anna’s predictions were all correct. (Can your hosts see the future?) Your co-hosts give a quick update on what’s been going on in the world and how to fully embrace this new remote scene we’re all faced with.
Key Takeaways
Is this going to be the “I Told You So” podcast?
We launched our podcast in July! Let’s give an update on what’s happened since then.
Remember when people said we’d have a vaccine by the end of the year?
Remember when people said we’d all be “back to normal” in a few months?
There’s a mass exodus from expensive cities happening right now. Not to brag, but we were right.
Trip left Seattle. Larry is thinking of leaving. It’s starting to get crowded in his neck of the woods.
The Zoom towns are happening.
Microsoft recently announced that if employees want to work remotely forever, they can! Want to relocate internationally? They can! Dropbox announced they’re going to be a virtual-first company. Companies are converting over.
The biggest hold out right now is Google. They’re not sure what to do with all of this, yet.
People were unhappy that they couldn’t go into the office in the very beginning. Now that everyone is used to it, they don’t want to go back!
People, in the beginning, predicted sexual harassment would go up, verbal abuse from horrible bosses, etc, turns out nope! We were right here too. It’s dropped drastically.
Small entrepreneurs are holding on by their fingernails to what this new world means. Trip has been helping in this space and it’s been satisfying to see the shift.
Schools still haven’t figured this out. Kids will be kids. They will party.
The vaccine might not even be the “final cure” we’re all looking for. This virus could mutate. It could be like the flu virus, but instead of getting a cold, it turns deadly.
Are you really going to wait to restart your career on a 50/50 chance?
What people find more stressful than anything is the unknown.
It’s better to swallow the bitter pill and say “this is it” so you can adapt than keep waiting for it to get better.
There are going to be high rates of alcoholism, depression, and anxiety coming out of this.
What does the future look like for you?
Reframe your mind to see the good even in really negative and awful situations.
There are a lot of benefits to this that we haven’t fully embraced yet.
Stop waiting for this to be over. Stop waiting for someone to rescue you. Embrace it. You’ll be happier.
Resources
Thebraveworkforce.com (http://thebraveworkforce.com/)
Bravenewcompanies.com (http://bravenewcompanies.com/)
Email Anna: [email protected] (mailto:[email protected])

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit bravenewworkforce.substack.com

According to Trip, Ben Carvalho is the one that got away. When Ben was interested in a career switch within corporate, he ran into some issues with the way the corporate hierarchy was structured. In this week’s episode, he details his experience — everything from having to pay out-of-pocket to visit Amazon’s facilities in a different state to having to quit, wait a period of time, and reapply for the job he wanted.
Key Takeaways
Ben left Amazon to become a doctor and is currently in med school.
A little bit about Ben and his interest in UX design.
Ben’s hometown is more rural and agriculturally focused. There wasn’t a lot of opportunity for cognitive scientists there. However, Amazon came into town.
Ben shares how he became a warehouse associate at Amazon, and then later an Operations Area Manager, where he managed close to 200 employees.
It was a good job, but Ben did not graduate college to be a manager at a warehouse.
Since Amazon is so large, Ben wanted to switch career fields within the company to pursue what he studied. He had an interest in user experience and looked for openings at Amazon.
What is “user experience” and what does that entail? Larry explains.
What do people at Amazon look for in a UX designer? Trip explains.
Ben reached out to an Amazon hiring manager who loved the idea and wanted Ben to shadow the UX team in Seattle. How did Ben’s logistic managers take this news?
Larry used to interview students in different parts of the world and his company would always pay for them to come. Seems strange Amazon wouldn’t want to do the same for an internal employee.
Trip explains what ‘Frupid’ means.
So much money gets spent on finding new talent, but why not dig into your own pool and cultivate the talent you already have (and who already understands your company culture)?
Trip really liked Ben’s ambition and really pushed for Amazon to hire him, but due to bureaucracy, they couldn’t make it happen. What actually happened behind the scenes?
Now Ben is going to medical school. How has his learning differed due to the pandemic?
Switching careers takes a lot of courage and vision.
The good news to a story like Ben’s is that your career journey doesn’t have to be so linear. All three of your co-hosts have gone through similar career transitions the way Ben has.
Career switchers might get a bad rep for being indecisive, but that’s not true. They have diverse experience that they can incorporate into your segment that no one else has.
Take risks on people that have an outside perspective and a different skill set; you will see value from it.
Resources
Thebraveworkforce.com (http://thebraveworkforce.com/)
Bravenewcompanies.com (http://bravenewcompanies.com/)
Email Anna: [email protected] (mailto:[email protected])
Ben on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/bjcarva/) Special Guest: Benjamin Carvalho.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit bravenewworkforce.substack.com

Tom Moran is the Chief Strategy Officer at Prodoscore, an organization that uses AI to measure thousands of daily activity points across business applications to gauge employee productivity. What makes Prodoscore different from other employee engagement tools is that it’s a non-invasive way to measure employee productivity and it creates transparency throughout the whole organization. Tom dives into the platform and how it can help the remote workforce.
Key Takeaways
A little bit about Tom and what he does for Prodoscore.
Prodoscore doesn’t do keystroke logging or screenshots through webcam, which is quite invasive.
How does Prodoscore measure the softer human skills like communication, emotional intelligence, etc?
How productive are annual reviews?
There will be some tough conversations when you are able to see the data, but that gives you a clear opening to improve.
Does Prodoscore notice the difference between time put in vs. value put in?
Managers want eight hours put in, but what we’re actually seeing is not people slacking off, but getting burned out.
The overall insight has been that people have been working too much.
Tom and his team have been careful using predictive analytics. He explains why.
Are there privacy concerns with a program like Prodoscore? Do employees feel jaded when their company is “spying” on them?
Employees like the gamification aspects of this data because they can compare themselves to others.
Employees were also able to see what their manager was doing and it made the organization more transparent.
If an employee is working hard, they want everyone to know it.
Some families are struggling. They’re going to Taco Bell or McDonald’s just to use the free WIFI. Environment plays a huge role, too, in productivity.
It can often be a fine balance between metrics, data, and hitting your objectives vs. customer service and spending time getting to know a customer.
What interesting insights have come out of some of Prodoscore’s clients?
Sexual harassment claims have collapsed globally for some organizations. One sexual harassment lawsuit could cost an organization $300,000. All that money is being saved.
Wining and dining clients has also dropped, which companies are now saving on. They can now use this money to reinvest in technology.
You want to encourage the right behavior. If you introduce technology that makes people feel uncomfortable, what does that really accomplish?
How is Prodoscore working against/being aware of bias?
Resources
Thebraveworkforce.com (http://thebraveworkforce.com/)
Bravenewcompanies.com (http://bravenewcompanies.com/)
Email Anna: [email protected] (mailto:[email protected])
Prodoscore.com (https://www.prodoscore.com/)
Email Tom: [email protected] (mailto:[email protected]) Special Guest: Thomas M. Moran.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit bravenewworkforce.substack.com

People are fleeing the city in droves and it’s driving real estate prices in these small quaint and quiet towns up by at least 24%. The infrastructure just isn’t there for such an influx of people. Larry, Anna, and Trip discuss what the future may hold for these small pieces of paradise as more “city folk” start to crowd it up.
Key Takeaways
Trip’s trip across the country has been a challenging one, but at least his fashion sense is on point!
There’s been an increase in “Zoom towns.” What are they?
A lot of people are fleeing the cities and moving into these “vacation” destinations. However, these small and quaint towns aren’t set up correctly for the large influx of people.
The real estate is going bananas in these towns. There are estimates that the markets are up between 24% to 54% depending on the area. Larry is witnessing it happening in his area.
What happens if everything goes back to normal? Will these people even be able to return to the city?
How are companies going to manage this if things return to normal? Will they just fire everyone who doesn’t want to come back?
Companies are going to have to go where the talent is going and where the talent demands where they want to live.
Larry tried to do this back in ’91 but the internet just wasn’t there. Imagine now? There are so many possibilities.
The inner cities are starting to collapse.
Trip is having a hard time finding a house to buy because they’re getting taken off the market so fast.
There’s a whole world out there that still wants to work for the next 20–30 years but can’t because they do not have the tech education/background.
Before you commit to your desired vacation spot or “Zoom town,” there’s a big difference between vacationing here vs. living somewhere.
People want to retire on a beach in a foreign country, but sometimes people forget that there are cultural differences everyone but you understands and you can become jaded real fast.
Anna shares upcoming episodes the Brave New Workforce has lined up!
Resources
Thebraveworkforce.com (http://thebraveworkforce.com/)
Bravenewcompanies.com (http://bravenewcompanies.com/)
Email Anna: [email protected] (mailto:[email protected])
American Factory (https://www.netflix.com/cr-en/title/81090071)

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit bravenewworkforce.substack.com

Trip is in the middle of leaving Seattle to move on to greener pastures. He and his family originally moved out to Seattle for his career, but now that his career is remote, why stay? Trip and his wife made a conscious choice to move to Pennsylvania to be closer to family. He’s eating his own dog food. Anna, Larry, and Trip talk about why now is the best time than any to make the leap.
Key Takeaways
Trip is currently traveling through Montana! He’s leaving Seattle for good.
Let’s back up, why is Trip moving?
The pandemic made Trip and his wife realize that they’re really far away from family.
Trip’s kids want to know where they come from. It was tough for a while because they couldn’t go anywhere and they were trapped in the house. It would be easier with family around.
Economic opportunity moved to the cities, but there’s a lot of room for growth in the Midwest, where you will literally not see anybody for miles.
Larry has seen farms and businesses die out when he was in Nebraska.
You don’t have to live in a place where you don’t want to be.
How low could your cost of living really be while also increasing your quality of life?
Trip is driving through parts of the country and he sees so many people with boats in the driveways. These people have time for amazing hobbies!
Your quality of life can drastically improve outside of the city.
One of the best ways we can increase diversity and inclusion is through traveling the world. You can find so many similarities in people that don’t look like you.
Seattle is one of the most bigoted places Trip has ever been to. He explains what he means by that.
Google recently came out saying that they plan to replace college. You can take certification courses now for six months.
When Larry went to college, it changed him. He was exposed to a new set of cultures and values for the very first time.
Larry grew up in a town of 1,000 people and those types of towns have been dying.
Remote work allows for people to have more economic opportunity throughout the world.
Tech money came into Silicon Valley and it pushed a lot of working folk out. What would happen if we saw a distributed virtual working model throughout the world?
Larry, Anna, and Trip offer their final takeaways. What does “great” look like to you?
Resources
Thebraveworkforce.com (http://thebraveworkforce.com/)
Bravenewcompanies.com (http://bravenewcompanies.com/)
Email Anna: [email protected] (mailto:[email protected])
American Nations Book by Colin Woodard (https://www.amazon.com/American-Nations-History-Regional-Cultures/dp/0143122029)

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit bravenewworkforce.substack.com

AnaMichele Morejon is one of The Brave New Workforce’s apprentices this summer and boy, has she learned a lot. AnaMichele is in her second year of college, but this was the first time she was given complete autonomy and ownership over the tasks she was doing with the team. And boy, has Trip’s mentoring and guidance created a monster. We find out what AnaMichele learned about working remotely!
Key Takeaways
AnaMichele, one of our Brave New Apprentices, joins the show to share her experiences with working remotely this summer.
AnaMichele is in university currently and she is a film and TV production and theology double major with a minor in studio arts.
What did AnaMichele learn this summer about working remotely?
AnaMichele was happy she could focus on learning the things she wanted to learn and the Brave New Workforce was more than happy to work with her on it.
Any good manager listens to their people and helps them achieve tasks they want to do.
Trip has created a monster! AnaMichele’s ownership and attention to detail really excelled throughout this internship when she felt comfortable about the quality of work she was producing.
AnaMichele works when she’s most productive, which happens to be very late at night. What does her family think about this?
AnaMichele is excited for the future, especially now that she knows she can work remotely.
Resources
Thebraveworkforce.com (http://thebraveworkforce.com/)
Bravenewcompanies.com (http://bravenewcompanies.com/)
Email Anna: [email protected] (mailto:[email protected])
Anamichele.com (http://www.anamichele.com/)
AnaMichele on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/anamichele/)
Behance.net/anamichele (https://www.behance.net/anamichele)

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit bravenewworkforce.substack.com