Capitol Conversations

With Congress in August recess, we take a break from our usual policy focused conversations and host interviews with leaders we admire. This week, Chelsea Sobolik sits down with Yuval Levin of the American Enterprise Institute.

Levin’s work in recent years have been instrumental to many of us here at the ERLC in thinking well about what has gone wrong in the public square and to see clearly why now is a time to build toward renewal.

Yuval Levin is the director of Social, Cultural, and Constitutional Studies at the American Enterprise Institute (AEI). He also holds the Beth and Ravenel Curry Chair in Public Policy. The founding and current editor of National Affairs, he is also a senior editor of The New Atlantis and a contributing editor to National Review.

Dr. Levin and scholars in the Social, Cultural, and Constitutional Studies research division study the foundations of self-government and the future of law, regulation, and constitutionalism. They also explore the state of American social, political, and civic life, while focusing on the preconditions necessary for family, community, and country to flourish.

Dr. Levin served as a member of the White House domestic policy staff under President George W. Bush. He was also executive director of the President’s Council on Bioethics and a congressional staffer at the member, committee, and leadership levels.

In addition to being interviewed frequently on radio and television, Dr. Levin has published essays and articles in numerous publications, including The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, The Washington Post, and Commentary. He is the author of several books on political theory and public policy, most recently A Time to Build: From Family and Community to Congress and the Campus, How Recommitting to Our Institutions Can Revive the American Dream (Basic Books).

He holds an MA and PhD from the Committee on Social Thought at the University of Chicago.

• Read: A Time to Build: From Family and Community to Congress and the Campus, How Recommitting to Our Institutions Can Revive the American Dream by Yuval Levin
• Read: Out of Many, One: Portraits of America's Immigrants - President George W. Bush
• Listen: Yuval Levin on the fractures in American public life and the path to renewal
• Subscribe to ERLC’s Policy Newsletter
• Subscribe to ERLC’s The Weekly

We are in a season of transition at the Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission after Russell Moore’s move to Christianity Today. The team in D.C. is changing as well, and so we wanted to bring you a final show with the current team: Jeff Pickering, Chelsea Patterson Sobolik, and Travis Wussow.

This show will air in two parts with reflections on the ERLC’s work in Washington and a conversation with David French of The Dispatch about religious liberty, pro-life policy, and January 6th. Listen to part one here.

The motivating aim of Capitol Conversations was to foster a new evangelical imagination for political engagement and we hope it’s done that for you. On behalf of all of us at the ERLC in Washington, thanks for listening.

In the meantime, stay subscribed to Capitol Conversations as there will surely and soon be something new on this channel. And be sure to check out The ERLC Podcast as well, with new episodes from Nashville released every Friday.

David French is senior editor of The Dispatch. He’s also a columnist for Time. He’s the author of Rise of ISIS: A Threat We Can’t Ignore, and Divided We Fall: America's Secession Threat and How to Restore Our Nation, among others.

• Connect with David French’s work at The Dispatch
• Read issues of David’s newsletter, The French Press, on the topics discussed
  • Liberty Gained and Power Lost from January 10, 2020
  • Punitive Intolerance Is No Way to Preserve Pluralism from July 6, 2021
  • How To Be Pro-Life in Joe Biden’s America from February 7, 2021
  • The Institutionalist Case for Reversing Roe v. Wade from July 27, 2021
  • Only the Church Can Truly Defeat a Christian Insurrection from January 10, 2021
  • January 6 and the Awesome Power of Republican Cognitive Dissonance from July 1, 2021
• Read 4 important SCOTUS cases for life and religious liberty: looking back and looking ahead by Chelsea Patterson Sobolik
• Watch ERLC’s event from July 29, 2021: Baptists and the Court: A Review of Recent SCOTUS Decisions
• Watch the NYT video about January 6th that David recommended: Inside the Capitol Riot: An Exclusive Video Investigation
• Listen to the short podcast series from The Dispatch that Travis recommended: The Hangover with Chris Stirewalt
• Watch Russell Moore’s conversation with Jeff Pickering about January 6th: Chaos at the Capitol: A Conversation about Conspiracies and Violence
• Read How the ERLC advocates on the Hill by Chelsea Patterson Sobolik
• Subscribe to ERLC’s Policy Newsletter

We are in a season of transition at the Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission after Russell Moore’s move to Christianity Today. The team in D.C. is changing as well, and so we wanted to bring you a final show with the current team: Jeff Pickering, Chelsea Patterson Sobolik, and Travis Wussow. 

This show will air in two parts with reflections on the ERLC’s work in Washington, D.C., and a conversation with David French of The Dispatch about religious liberty, pro-life policy, and January 6th.

The motivating aim of Capitol Conversations was to foster a new evangelical imagination for political engagement and we hope it’s done that for you. On behalf of all of us at the ERLC in Washington, D.C., thanks for listening.

In the meantime, stay subscribed to Capitol Conversations as there will surely and soon be something new on this channel. And be sure to check out The ERLC Podcast as well, with new episodes from Nashville released every Friday.

David French is senior editor of The Dispatch. He’s also a columnist for Time. He’s the author of Rise of ISIS: A Threat We Can’t Ignore, and Divided We Fall: America's Secession Threat and How to Restore Our Nation, among others.

• Read David French’s work at The Dispatch
• Read How the ERLC is advocating for Southern Baptists in Washington, D.C. by Jeff Pickering
• Read How the ERLC advocates on the Hill by Chelsea Patterson Sobolik
• Read Why do we send advocacy letters in D.C.? by Chelsea Patterson Sobolik and Jeff Pickering
• Listen to our favorite episodes
  • Chelsea: Melissa Ohden on Surviving Abortion
  • Jeff: Kenneth Bae, the longest held U.S. prisoner in North Korea, on hope in a hard labor camp
  • Travis: Matti Friedman on the Middle East after the Abraham Accords
  • Interns: Staff Roundtable with our spring 2020 intern on her semester in D.C. and how the pandemic changed everything and the episode when Brooke was an intern Year in Review with the 2018 Interns
• Read about the issues we highlighted
  • Chelsea: China’s Main Threat Is a Moral One
  • Jeff: Citing ERLC brief, SCOTUS protects religious liberty
  • Travis: SBA issues new safe harbor for small Paycheck Protection loans
• Subscribe to ERLC’s Policy Newsletter

Jeff Pickering and Brooke Kramer are joined by the Rev. Dr. Gabriel Salguero to discuss why Christians should care about ending the payday debt trap and how the Faith for Just Lending (FJL) coalition is advocating against payday lending. Salguero is the pastor at The Gathering Place, a Latino-led multi-ethnic Assemblies of God congregation in Orlando and also the president and founder of the National Latino Evangelical Coalition (NALEC).

“Payday lending is a form of economic predation and grinds the faces of the poor into the ground. As Christians, we are called by Jesus, by the prophets and by the apostles to care for the poor, individually, and also about the way social and political and corporate structures contribute to the misery of the impoverished. Groups across this diverse coalition don’t agree on every issue in the public square, but I am happy to work together on this issue to stand against unchecked usury and work for economic justice, human dignity and family stability.” — Russell Moore

The Rev. Dr. Gabriel Salguero is pastor at The Gathering Place, a Latino-led multi-ethnic Assemblies of God congregation in Orlando, Florida. Salguero is also the president and founder of the National Latino Evangelical Coalition (NALEC), a coalition of several thousand evangelical congregations in the United States. He was the former Director of the Hispanic Leadership Program (HLP), and the Institute for Faith and Public Life at Princeton Theological Seminary. Salguero has been named as one of the nation’s most prominent Latino evangelical leaders by the New York Times, NBC Universal, Univisión, and many other outlets. In addition, his leadership on issues of young male education and criminal justice reform has been featured by the Discovery Channel and the Oprah Winfrey Network. Rev. Salguero has served on the White House Faith-Based Advisory Council, the National Association of Evangelicals (NAE), and the National Advisory Council of the My Brother’s Keeper Alliance. Salguero holds a BA in Spanish and History from Rutgers University, and M.Div (magna cum laude) from New Brunswick Theological Seminary, he pursued a Ph.D in Christian Social Ethics at Union Theological Seminary, and holds a Doctorate in Divinity from Eastern Nazarene College. Rev. Salguero lives together with his wife, the Rev. Jeanette Salguero and their two sons in Orlando, Florida.

• Learn more about the Faith for Just Lending Coalition
• Learn more about the National Latino Evangelical Coalition
• ERLC supports the Veterans and Consumers Fair Credit Act
• ERLC opposes the OCC’s “True Lender” rule
• Faith Leaders Applaud Congress’ Decision to Challenge OCC’s ‘True Lender’ Rule
• SBC Payday Lending Resolution
• 5 facts about Payday Lending
• Subscribe to ERLC’s Policy Newsletter

Jeff Pickering and Travis Wussow welcome Matthew Soerens of World Relief, a refugee resettlement agency, to the roundtable to talk about what happened with President Biden’s decision on the refugee admissions ceiling. The group also discusses the Evangelical Immigration Table advocacy both for refugee policy and for solutions to the ongoing migration humanitarian crisis at the U.S. southern border.

“Rhetoric is no refuge for the persecuted — we need action. The refugee resettlement ceiling should be raised immediately so our nation can welcome those we already vetted. … We know the program is a secure and thorough process by which America can serve as a beacon of freedom and safe harbor for the oppressed, including persecuted Christians and other imperiled religious minorities.” — Russell Moore on April 16, 2021

“I’m thankful President Biden revised his decision on the refugee ceiling. This action is the first step in bringing admissions back to the historical average and our nation back to our own ideals as a beacon of freedom.” — Russell Moore on May 4, 2021

Matthew Soerens serves as the U.S. Director of Church Mobilization and Advocacy for World Relief and as the National Coordinator for the Evangelical Immigration Table, a coalition of evangelical organizations of which both World Relief and the ERLC are founding members. He previously served as a Department of Justice-accredited immigration legal counselor for World Relief’s local office in suburban Chicago. Matthew is the co-author of Seeking Refuge: On the Shores of the Global Refugee Crisis (Moody Publishers, 2016) and Welcoming the Stranger: Justice, Compassion & Truth in the Immigration Debate (InterVarsity Press, 2018). Matthew earned his Bachelor’s degree from Wheaton College (IL), where he also has served as an adjunct faculty member for the Humanitarian and Disaster Leadership graduate program. He also earned a Master’s degree from DePaul University’s School of Public Service. Originally from Neenah, Wisconsin, he now lives in Aurora, Illinois with his wife Diana and their four children.

• Learn more about World Relief
• Learn more about the Evangelical Immigration Table
• Check out Matthew Soerens’ books about seeking refuge and the immigration debate
• Read EIT’s advocacy statements to President Biden
  • Evangelical Leaders Urge President Biden to Revise Refugee Resettlement Ceiling Immediately, April 16, 2021
  • Evangelical Leaders Commend President Biden for Raising Refugee Ceiling, May 4, 2021
• Listen to previous episodes on immigration and refugees
  • Laura Collins on immigration and border policy solutions
  • Jonathan Hayes on how our government shelters unaccompanied migrant children
• Read Jeff’s article at Providence: A Case for Rebuilding the US Commitment to Refugees
• Read the ERLC and EIT’s series on Thinking Biblically about Immigration
• Subscribe to ERLC’s Policy Newsletter

This week, Jeff Pickering, Chelsea Patterson Sobolik, and Travis Wussow are honored to welcome Gayle Manchin, Chair of the United States Commission on International Religious Freedom to discuss USCIRF’s recently released annual report.

Comprised of nine commissioners, USCIRF is an independent, bipartisan federal body that is principally responsible for reviewing the facts and circumstances of violations of religious freedom internationally and making policy recommendations to the President, Secretary of State, and Congress. The President and leadership of both political parties in the Senate and House of Representatives appoint USCIRF Commissioners.

Gayle Manchin is an educator who has worked in Marion County Schools at the secondary level, on the faculty of Fairmont State University in Developmental Education, and was the Director of the university's first Community Service Learning Program. From 2005-2010, Gayle Manchin served as West Virginia's First Lady. She was appointed by the Governor to serve as a member of the State Board of Education, where she also served as President. She also served for one year as West Virginia’s Cabinet Secretary for the Office of Education and the Arts. At the national level, Gayle Manchin has been President of the National Association of State Boards of Education. She was appointed by then Secretary of Education Arne Duncan to the Federal Improvement for Post-Secondary Education Board in 2010. She is also a member of the Board of Trustees of The Ford Theatre in Washington, D.C. Gayle Manchin has spoken at the state and national levels on the challenges of rural education, poverty, and student achievement. She holds a Master of Arts in Reading and a Bachelor of Arts in Language Arts and Education from West Virginia University, and a master's specialization in Educational Technology Leadership from Salem International University.

• Learn more about USCIRF Chair Gayle Manchin
• Check out USCIRF’s 2021 Annual Report
• Learn more about USCIRF’s Prisoners of Conscience Project
• USCIRF releases 2021 annual report on international religious freedom by ERLC Policy Staff
• Subscribe to ERLC’s Policy Newsletter

Jeff Pickering welcomes back Heather Rice-Minus of Prison Fellowship to talk about the church, criminal justice reform, and why Christians value second chances. This episode comes as we are engaged in Second Chance Month, a nationwide effort each April to raise awareness about barriers to reentry and unlock brighter futures for people with a criminal record.

This conversation was recorded on Friday, April 16, the week before the verdict was announced in the trial of Derek Chauvin for the murder of George Floyd. 

Heather Rice-Minus serves as Senior Vice President of Advocacy and Church Mobilization at Prison Fellowship, the nation's largest Christian nonprofit serving prisoners, former prisoners, and their families. She is a powerful, knowledgeable voice articulating the case for restorative criminal justice solutions. She is also the co-author of Outrageous Justice, a Bible study curriculum and book. A native of Virginia, Rice-Minus resides in Washington, D.C., with her husband and daughter, and they welcomed a second child as foster parents in 2020.

• Learn more about Second Chance Month with Prison Fellowship
• Register for the Second Chance Month Gala on April 29
• Read Heather’s article What the Bible says about second chances
• Listen to the previous episode with Heather A Story of Criminal Justice Reform: How the First Step Act Became Law
• Learn more about the EQUAL Act
• Here are the articles Jeff recommended in the introduction
  • The George Floyd Trial and the Longing for Justice by Russell Moore
  • How I’m Talking to My Kids About the Derek Chauvin Verdict by Esau McCaulley at the New York Times
  • George Floyd and Me by Shai Linne at TGC
• Subscribe to ERLC’s Policy Newsletter

Adoption is a priority of the ERLC’s work, both in policy advocacy and family ministry. Jeff Pickering, Chelsea Patterson Sobolik, and Travis Wussow talk about three adoption issues you should be aware of. They cover the effects of the pandemic on adoption, the Adoptee Citizenship Act, and an important case at the Supreme Court for child welfare providers.

At the end of the episode, the crew is joined by our awesome audio engineer, Gary Lancaster to wish him a farewell, say thanks, and reflect on his decade with the ERLC. anniversary 

• Listen to the podcast by Lifeline Child Services: COVID: One Year Later
• Read Chelsea’s article: How the coronavirus is affecting vulnerable children
• Listen to the podcast on the Fulton case: Lori Windham on Fulton v. Philadelphia, the Supreme Court foster-care case
• Subscribe to ERLC’s Policy Newsletter

Phillip Bethancourt, now lead pastor of Central in College Station, Texas and former ERLC executive vice president, joins Jeff Pickering, Chelsea Patterson Sobolik, and Travis Wussow to discuss how Christians can engage conversations on COVID vaccine hesitancy. Bethancourt’s church recently served their community as a vaccination site.

Guest Biography

Phillip Bethancourt is lead pastor of Central in College Station, Texas. Before he was called to pastor Central, he served as the Executive Vice President of the ERLC team for seven years. He is a graduate of Texas A&M University, class of 2004, and he then went on to earn an MDiv and PhD in Systematic Theology at Southern Baptist Theological Seminary. Phillip and his wife, Cami, have been married since 2005, and have four boys. Phillip’s authored books and curriculum include: Exalting Jesus in Genesis, Christ-Centered Parenting: Gospel Conversations on Complex Cultural Issues, and Religious Liberty: How the Gospel Shapes Our First Freedom.

• Connect with Phillip Bethancourt
• Read the AP story where Phillip is quoted: Vaccine skepticism runs deep among white evangelicals in US by David Crary
• Listen to the episodes we referenced: NIH Director Dr. Francis Collins on the COVID-19 vaccines + Russell Moore on the ethics of the COVID-19 vaccines
• Read Dr. Moore’s Washington Post op-ed co-authored with Walter Kim, president of the National Association of Evangelicals: Not the mark of the beast: Evangelicals should fight conspiracy theories and welcome the vaccines
• See more COVID19 related resources from the ERLC
• Subscribe to ERLC’s Policy Newsletter

We want to help you think well about immigration, especially as the surge in unaccompanied children at the U.S. southern border leads to greater public debate of these issues. Jeff Pickering, Chelsea Patterson Sobolik, and Travis Wussow welcome Jonathan Hayes, a former federal official, to the roundtable to explain how our government shelters unaccompanied migrant children. Hayes served as Director of the HHS Office of Refugee Resettlement, the agency responsible for caring for unaccompanied migrant children.

“Yet again, the situation at the southern border ought to remind us that unaccompanied migrant children are not a mere problem to be solved. They bear the image of God, and are endowed by him with dignity and worth. Jesus loves them, and so should we. These kinds of problems will persist at our border for as long as our immigration system is allowed to languish in incoherence. A better path forward will require government leaders — both in Congress and the administration — coming together in an honest search for solutions based on long-term strategies. In the meantime, we should do everything we can do, through both Christian ministry and government policy, to help alleviate the suffering of those who are attempting to flee violence in their home countries.” – Russell Moore on March 18, 2021

Jonathan Hayes served as the director of the Office of Refugee Resettlement (ORR) in the Administration for Children & Families at the U.S. Department of Health & Human Services until March 2020 when he transitioned to the office of the Assistant Secretary for Preparedness and Response until January 2021. Prior to joining HHS, Jonathan served as chief of staff to two members of Congress spanning over eight years. Additionally, he has experience in the private sector working in broadcast television, sales and marketing, business development, international trade and customs and commercial airline operations. Jonathan received his Bachelor of Science degree in business administration and minor in political science from Florida State University. Born in Greenwood, Mississippi, and raised in Panama City, Florida, he now lives in northern Virginia with his wife Tammy and their five children. He is also an elder at McLean Presbyterian Church.

• Listen to Laura Collins on immigration and border policy solutions
• Read ERLC’s Explainer: The crisis of unaccompanied minors at the border
• Read EIT’s letter to President Biden | Evangelical Leaders Urge Compassionate Response to Vulnerable Children at the Border
• Read Time Magazine piece | How Foster Families Are Stepping Up to House Unaccompanied Children Arriving at the U.S.-Mexico Border by Jasmine Aguilera
• Subscribe to ERLC’s Policy Newsletter