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Guest background: Ryan Visconti is the Lead Pastor of Generation Church in Mesa, Arizona. A former Army officer who served in Iraq before entering ministry, Ryan brings a unique leadership perspective shaped by both military service and over a decade of leading a rapidly growing church. In this conversation, Ryan shares insights on church growth, staff culture, worship leadership, difficult personnel decisions, AI, and what it means to lead with conviction in an increasingly complex cultural environment.

Key Topics Why lead pastors should care about worship and production

Ryan believes worship and production are too important to be delegated without involvement from senior leadership. As a musician and former drummer, he sees worship as a central part of discipleship and church culture. Rather than viewing worship and production as separate departments, he sees them as essential ministry tools that help communicate truth and shape the spiritual life of the church.

Leading without micromanaging

One of the recurring themes of the conversation is finding the balance between oversight and empowerment. Ryan argues that many leaders overcorrect against micromanagement and unintentionally drift into abdication. While creative leaders need freedom to lead, pastors still have a responsibility to provide vision, theological oversight, and clear expectations.

How worship shapes theology

Songs often leave a deeper imprint on church members than sermons. Ryan discusses his process for reviewing new songs, evaluating lyrics, and ensuring worship services reinforce sound theology. Generation Church also uses Scripture on LED screens during worship to connect song lyrics directly to biblical truth.

Building a healthy staff culture

Generation Church has experienced significant growth over the past decade, and Ryan attributes much of their staff culture to a strong sense of mission. Team members understand the purpose behind their work, move quickly toward goals, and share a common commitment to reaching people with the gospel.

Ministry families versus ministry jobs

Ryan challenges the idea that ministry should be treated like a typical profession. Instead, he encourages staff members to see themselves as ministry families who are pursuing a shared calling together. This perspective shapes how the church supports staff spouses, children, and family life while helping prevent resentment toward ministry.

Caring for staff kids intentionally

As a pastor's kid himself, Ryan is passionate about helping ministry families thrive. Generation Church intentionally invests in staff children through celebrations, gifts, special events, and additional support. The goal is for staff kids to grow up loving the church rather than resenting the ministry environment they were raised in.

Growing a church from 500 to thousands

Ryan reflects on the systems and leadership shifts required as Generation Church grew from approximately 500 attendees to one of the largest churches in the region. He discusses key growth barriers, assimilation systems, volunteer pipelines, and the importance of continually adapting leadership structures as the organization expands.

Why serving is often more powerful than small groups

While both serving and small groups create community, Ryan believes serving can be one of the most effective pathways to engagement. Serving teams naturally create relationships, ownership, and a deeper connection to the mission of the church.

When organizations outgrow their leaders

One of the most candid portions of the conversation focuses on leadership capacity. Ryan explains that churches must continually develop leaders because organizations can eventually outgrow the abilities of the people leading them. While these conversations are often difficult, leaders have a responsibility to prioritize the long-term health of the mission.

Lessons from military leadership

Ryan shares how his years as an Army officer continue to influence his approach to leadership. The military taught him the importance of leading by example, maintaining high standards, embracing accountability, and understanding that leadership requires both responsibility and courage.

Wartime ministry in a changing culture

Drawing on his military background, Ryan describes modern ministry as "wartime ministry." He believes church leaders face increasing cultural pressure and must be prepared to lead through controversy, opposition, and difficult conversations without compromising biblical convictions.

AI and the future of ministry

Ryan is cautiously optimistic about artificial intelligence. He already uses AI to accelerate sermon research and administrative tasks, but he also recognizes challenges that come with AI-generated misinformation and theological confusion. He believes church leaders will need to help people navigate a future where AI increasingly influences how individuals seek answers and form beliefs.

Teaching truth with clarity and compassion

A major focus of the conversation is the relationship between truth and grace. Ryan argues that effective ministry requires both compassion and conviction. While leaders should genuinely care for people, they should also be willing to address difficult topics and provide clear biblical guidance rather than avoiding controversial issues.

Difficult leadership decisions and church health

Ryan discusses the painful reality that leadership sometimes requires difficult personnel and cultural decisions. Healthy organizations cannot avoid conflict forever, and leaders must be willing to protect culture, address problems directly, and prioritize the long-term health of the church over short-term comfort.

Reaching a new generation searching for truth

Ryan believes many young adults—especially young men—are searching for clarity, purpose, and truth. As culture becomes increasingly unstable, he sees growing opportunities for churches that are willing to communicate biblical truth clearly while helping people find meaning and hope through Christ.

Notable tools, organizations, and resources mentioned

• Generation Church

• ChatGPT

• Gemini

• Logos Bible Software

• Inside Elevation

• Elevation Church

• United States Army

• Charlie Kirk

• Leadership Research Services

• Real-Time AI Translation Technology

Key Quote

"Ministry is the one arena that is actually higher stakes than combat. In combat, this is life and death. In ministry, this is heaven and hell."

• • • • •

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Churchfront Conference Workshop — Lee Fields | Building Volunteer Mixing Systems That Actually Work

Guest background: Lee Fields is a front-of-house engineer, audio educator, and one of the most respected voices in live sound for churches. In this Churchfront Conference workshop, Lee demonstrates his practical approach to building repeatable mixing systems that help volunteer audio engineers succeed week after week. Drawing from decades of experience in live production, he focuses less on mixing tricks and more on creating processes, gain structures, and source quality that deliver consistent results regardless of who is behind the console.

Key Topics The true measure of an audio director

Lee challenges a common assumption among church audio leaders. Great audio leadership is not measured by how well you mix when you're behind the console—it's measured by how good the mix sounds when you're not there. The goal of every production leader should be building systems that enable volunteers to succeed consistently rather than relying on a single expert operator.

Why consistency matters more than complexity

Many churches unintentionally create complicated mixing environments that overwhelm volunteers. Lee advocates for simpler workflows, fewer variables, and repeatable processes that lower the skill barrier while maintaining high-quality results. The easier the system is to operate, the more likely volunteers are to succeed.

The upstream factors that shape every mix

Before touching a console, Lee explains that every mix is heavily influenced by factors that happen long before signal reaches the mixer. Room acoustics, speaker placement, PA tuning, source quality, and stage volume all have a greater impact on the final result than plugin choices or advanced processing techniques.

Sources matter more than gear

One of Lee's core philosophies is that great sound begins at the source. Well-tuned drums, properly dialed-in guitar tones, quality vocal technique, and intentional stage preparation solve far more problems than expensive gear or complicated processing chains ever will.

Building a default mix file for volunteers

Rather than rebuilding a mix from scratch every weekend, Lee recommends creating a carefully designed baseline console file. By investing significant time into gain structure, EQ, compression, routing, and effects ahead of time, churches can create a starting point that volunteers can confidently use every week.

The importance of proper gain structure

Lee emphasizes that gain staging is one of the most overlooked aspects of church audio. Compression thresholds, EQ decisions, effects sends, and overall mix balance depend on consistent input levels. If gain structure changes every week, nothing else on the console behaves predictably.

Line check, soundcheck, and rehearsal are not the same thing

Many churches blur the lines between technical preparation and musical rehearsal. Lee explains the importance of separating line checks, soundchecks, rehearsals, and individual practice. When each step serves its intended purpose, teams become more efficient and less stressed.

EQ decisions driven by musical context

Throughout the workshop, Lee demonstrates how EQ should be guided by what a source needs to contribute to the overall mix rather than arbitrary frequency targets. High-pass filters, low-mid cleanup, and frequency shaping all serve the larger goal of creating clarity and space for every instrument.

Why less processing often sounds better

Instead of relying on extensive plugins and advanced processing chains, Lee demonstrates how effective results can be achieved using basic console tools. Careful use of EQ, compression, gates, and a small number of reverbs often produces more consistent and musical results than overly complicated setups.

Managing tracks in modern worship environments

Lee discusses practical strategies for integrating tracks into a live worship mix. Rather than sending every track element to a single stereo channel, he recommends separating important musical hooks, percussion elements, vocals, and support layers so engineers can maintain clarity and control.

Reverb techniques for clarity and depth

The workshop includes several practical reverb strategies, including using high-pass filters, controlling low-mid buildup, and utilizing pre-delay to preserve vocal intelligibility. These subtle adjustments help create depth without sacrificing clarity in the mix.

Developing your ear as an engineer

When asked about his mixing process, Lee explains that great engineers develop a mental library of sounds through years of listening. Every EQ move and processing decision is guided by a clear sonic destination based on thousands of hours of critical listening and musical study.

Notable tools and equipment mentioned

• Allen & Heath Consoles

• Midas Wing

• Meyer Sound Loudspeakers

• Shure SM57

• Nord Keyboards

• MainStage

• Pro Tools

• Spotify

• Playback Tracks

Key Quote

"The quality of your mixing skill has nothing to do with how well you mix. It has everything to do with what it sounds like when you're not behind the console and someone else is."

• • • • •

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Guest background: Josh Kelsey is the Lead Pastor of Vineyard Church in California. In this conversation, Josh shares how his church is actively using AI across nearly every department—from sermon preparation and curriculum creation to operations, worship ministry, and discipleship. He offers a practical vision for how church leaders can use AI to reclaim time, reduce burnout, and focus more deeply on shepherding people.

Key Topics AI in the church: fear vs. opportunity

Josh argues that many church leaders are approaching AI with unnecessary fear. While concerns around ethics and implementation are valid, he sees AI primarily as a tool—one that can dramatically increase effectiveness while freeing leaders to focus on ministry. He believes churches that embrace these tools thoughtfully will be able to pastor more effectively, not less.

Why churches are historically slow to adopt technology

Churches and nonprofits are often years behind the business world when it comes to adopting new technology. Josh believes AI is creating one of the largest technological shifts of our generation, and many church leaders risk missing opportunities simply because they haven't taken time to understand what's actually possible.

Scaling ministry without losing community

One of the most intriguing ideas discussed is whether AI can help churches scale without sacrificing the personal connection that often disappears as organizations grow. Instead of hiring more specialists for every operational challenge, churches may soon be able to use AI systems to maintain consistency, communication, and care at a much larger scale.

AI as a team of specialists

Rather than thinking of AI as a chatbot, Josh encourages leaders to think of it as an entire team of specialists available on demand. Administrative support, curriculum development, data analysis, planning, project management, and content creation can all be assisted by AI, allowing pastors to spend more time on teaching, discipleship, and relationships.

The future of church software

The conversation explores how tools like Planning Center, HubSpot, Notion, Logos, MultiTracks, and other church software platforms will likely become deeply integrated with AI through technologies like APIs and Model Context Protocol (MCP). Instead of manually moving information between platforms, leaders will increasingly interact with a single AI layer that understands and works across their entire ministry ecosystem.

How Josh uses AI for sermon planning

Josh shares his personal workflow for annual sermon planning and weekly sermon preparation. What once required multiple staff meetings and days of planning can now be completed in minutes. He uses AI to help organize ideas, structure teaching series, review theological themes, and accelerate sermon preparation while maintaining full ownership over theological convictions and final content.

Using AI without losing your voice

One of the biggest concerns among pastors is whether AI will replace authentic preaching. Josh argues that AI works best as a collaborator rather than a creator. By training AI on previous sermons, theological frameworks, and ministry values, leaders can use it to refine and organize their ideas while still maintaining their unique voice and convictions.

Curriculum creation and discipleship workflows

Vineyard uses AI extensively to create small group curriculum, discipleship resources, class materials, slide decks, teacher guides, and parent resources. Tools like NotebookLM help transform existing content into multiple formats, dramatically reducing preparation time while increasing consistency across ministries.

AI-powered worship ministry

Worship and production teams are also leveraging AI. Josh and his worship pastor discuss using tools like Suno to create custom music, countdown tracks, and ministry-specific content. They also explore future possibilities for creating custom stems, backing tracks, and other resources that could significantly reduce production workload.

The ethics of AI and transparency

Throughout the conversation, Josh emphasizes the importance of transparency. Leaders should be honest about where AI is assisting their work while recognizing that many forms of ministry have always involved collaboration, research assistance, editors, and support staff. The key is maintaining integrity while leveraging powerful new tools.

A leveling of the playing field for small churches

Perhaps the most exciting implication is what AI means for under-resourced churches. Pastors who lack staff, consultants, formal training, or large budgets can now access tools that help bridge those gaps. Josh believes AI may become one of the most powerful ministry equalizers the Church has ever seen.

Notable tools and resources mentioned

• Claude

• ChatGPT

• Gemini

• NotebookLM

• Planning Center

• HubSpot

• Notion

• Logos Bible Software

• Suno

• Zapier

• MultiTracks

• Google Workspace

Key Quote

"Imagine if you could free up 15 hours of your week to spend more time making sure the people in your church who are most forgotten actually get seen."

• • • • •

Disclaimer: This video and description contain affiliate links.

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Guest background: Reggi Beasley spent eight years on staff at Elevation Church, serving in multiple worship leadership roles before becoming Worship Pastor overseeing worship ministry across Elevation's multi-site campuses. In this conversation, Reggi shares practical leadership lessons from leading large teams, developing healthy ministry culture, navigating difficult personnel decisions, and helping worship leaders grow in both character and calling. Drawing from decades of ministry experience, he offers wisdom for church leaders seeking to build thriving teams without sacrificing people in the process.

Key Topics Leading worship across a multi-site church

Reggi shares what it was like overseeing worship ministry across Elevation Church's many campuses, caring for hundreds of worship team members while maintaining consistency, culture, and leadership development. He explains how healthy systems and clear communication help large ministries scale without losing their pastoral focus.

Why culture rises and falls on leadership

Strong ministry culture begins with leaders who can communicate vision clearly and model it consistently. Reggi explains that leadership is not just about saying the right things but communicating with the right spirit and heart. People follow both what leaders say and how they say it.

Building healthy audition and onboarding processes

The conversation explores practical systems for auditioning and onboarding worship team members. Reggi explains why churches should depersonalize parts of the evaluation process while keeping pastoral care highly personal. Clear standards, structured feedback, and thoughtful communication can help leaders maintain excellence without damaging relationships.

Protecting relationships while maintaining standards

One of the most practical leadership discussions centers around how churches can navigate difficult conversations when someone is not ready to serve on the platform. Reggi emphasizes the importance of protecting people's dignity while still maintaining standards that serve the health of the ministry.

The power of delegated leadership

Rather than becoming the sole source of feedback and correction, Reggi encourages worship pastors to build leadership layers within their teams. By empowering music directors, section leaders, and trusted volunteers, churches can create healthier cultures while preventing leaders from becoming bottlenecks.

Why leaders should "save their voice"

One of Reggi's favorite leadership principles is learning to "save your voice." Instead of always being the person who delivers correction, leaders can create systems where accountability comes through trusted team members. This protects relationships, strengthens other leaders, and allows pastors to use their influence more strategically.

Handling difficult transitions and team changes

Every worship leader eventually faces difficult decisions around staffing, volunteers, standards, and inherited ministry cultures. Reggi shares lessons learned from both successes and mistakes, encouraging leaders to move slowly, lead with empathy, and prioritize people over programs.

Patience, growth, and long-term ministry impact

Many young leaders feel pressure to create rapid change, but Reggi argues that meaningful ministry growth often happens slowly. Drawing on agricultural and biblical imagery, he explains why patience, consistency, and faithfulness produce deeper and more sustainable results than constant urgency.

Common leadership challenges facing worship pastors

From performance-driven identities to platform ambition, Reggi discusses some of the most common character challenges he sees among worship leaders. He encourages leaders to root their identity in Christ rather than influence, opportunity, or recognition.

Calling versus assignment

A major theme of the conversation is the distinction between calling and assignment. Reggi challenges the modern tendency to treat every ministry opportunity as a calling, arguing instead that our primary calling is to follow Christ faithfully. Assignments may change, but identity remains constant.

Equipping the saints for ministry

Drawing from Ephesians 4, Reggi explores how ministry leaders are called to equip others rather than become the center of ministry themselves. Whether in the marketplace, church, or home, every believer has opportunities to participate in meaningful kingdom work.

Crown Collaborative and encouraging church leaders

Reggi shares his vision for Crown Collaborative, a new nonprofit focused on connecting, encouraging, and supporting pastors, executive pastors, and worship leaders. His goal is to help leaders learn together, laugh together, and build the kind of resilience that allows them to last for the long haul.

Notable resources and organizations mentioned

• Elevation Church

• Crown Collaborative

• Ephesians 4

• Micah 6:8

• Passion Conferences

• Hillsong Worship

• Chris Tomlin

• Louis Giglio

• Ableton Live

• In-ear monitor systems

Key Quote

"When you sit in a seat of leadership, you probably underestimate the way other people weigh your words."

• • • • •

Disclaimer: This video and description contain affiliate links.

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Churchfront Podcast — Josh Kelsey | How AI Is Transforming Church Ministry

Guest background: Josh Kelsey is the Lead Pastor of Vineyard Church in California. In this conversation, Josh shares how his church is actively using AI across nearly every department—from sermon preparation and curriculum creation to operations, worship ministry, and discipleship. He offers a practical vision for how church leaders can use AI to reclaim time, reduce burnout, and focus more deeply on shepherding people.

Key Topics

AI in the church: fear vs. opportunity Josh argues that many church leaders are approaching AI with unnecessary fear. While concerns around ethics and implementation are valid, he sees AI primarily as a tool—one that can dramatically increase effectiveness while freeing leaders to focus on ministry. He believes churches that embrace these tools thoughtfully will be able to pastor more effectively, not less.

Why churches are historically slow to adopt technology Churches and nonprofits are often years behind the business world when it comes to adopting new technology. Josh believes AI is creating one of the largest technological shifts of our generation, and many church leaders risk missing opportunities simply because they haven't taken time to understand what's actually possible.

Scaling ministry without losing community One of the most intriguing ideas discussed is whether AI can help churches scale without sacrificing the personal connection that often disappears as organizations grow. Instead of hiring more specialists for every operational challenge, churches may soon be able to use AI systems to maintain consistency, communication, and care at a much larger scale.

AI as a team of specialists Rather than thinking of AI as a chatbot, Josh encourages leaders to think of it as an entire team of specialists available on demand. Administrative support, curriculum development, data analysis, planning, project management, and content creation can all be assisted by AI, allowing pastors to spend more time on teaching, discipleship, and relationships.

The future of church software The conversation explores how tools like Planning Center, HubSpot, Notion, Logos, MultiTracks, and other church software platforms will likely become deeply integrated with AI through technologies like APIs and Model Context Protocol (MCP). Instead of manually moving information between platforms, leaders will increasingly interact with a single AI layer that understands and works across their entire ministry ecosystem.

How Josh uses AI for sermon planning Josh shares his personal workflow for annual sermon planning and weekly sermon preparation. What once required multiple staff meetings and days of planning can now be completed in minutes. He uses AI to help organize ideas, structure teaching series, review theological themes, and accelerate sermon preparation while maintaining full ownership over theological convictions and final content.

Using AI without losing your voice One of the biggest concerns among pastors is whether AI will replace authentic preaching. Josh argues that AI works best as a collaborator rather than a creator. By training AI on previous sermons, theological frameworks, and ministry values, leaders can use it to refine and organize their ideas while still maintaining their unique voice and convictions.

Curriculum creation and discipleship workflows Vineyard uses AI extensively to create small group curriculum, discipleship resources, class materials, slide decks, teacher guides, and parent resources. Tools like NotebookLM help transform existing content into multiple formats, dramatically reducing preparation time while increasing consistency across ministries.

AI-powered worship ministry Worship and production teams are also leveraging AI. Josh and his worship pastor discuss using tools like Suno to create custom music, countdown tracks, and ministry-specific content. They also explore future possibilities for creating custom stems, backing tracks, and other resources that could significantly reduce production workload.

The ethics of AI and transparency Throughout the conversation, Josh emphasizes the importance of transparency. Leaders should be honest about where AI is assisting their work while recognizing that many forms of ministry have always involved collaboration, research assistance, editors, and support staff. The key is maintaining integrity while leveraging powerful new tools.

A leveling of the playing field for small churches Perhaps the most exciting implication is what AI means for under-resourced churches. Pastors who lack staff, consultants, formal training, or large budgets can now access tools that help bridge those gaps. Josh believes AI may become one of the most powerful ministry equalizers the Church has ever seen.

Notable tools mentioned

• Claude

• ChatGPT

• Gemini

• NotebookLM

• Planning Center

• HubSpot

• Notion

• Logos Bible Software

• Suno

• Zapier

• MultiTracks

• Google Workspace

Key Quote

"Imagine if you could free up 15 hours of your week to spend more time making sure the people in your church who are most forgotten actually get seen."

• • • • •

Disclaimer: This video and description contain affiliate links.

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In this episode, Matt sits down with Spencer, Churchfront's Director of Engineering, to break down the most common PA system problems churches face and how to design sound systems that actually serve the room. We're covering everything from phase cancellation and speaker placement to line arrays, point source speakers, acoustics, modeling software, and practical ways to improve your church's audio without breaking the budget.

Whether you're planning a new audio system, troubleshooting an existing PA, or simply trying to understand why your room sounds the way it does, this conversation will help you make better decisions and avoid costly mistakes.

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Churchfront Podcast — Erwin McManus Lead Pastor, Mosaic Church (Los Angeles) | Author, The Seven Frequencies of Communication

Guest background: Erwin McManus has led Mosaic in LA for 35 years, building a congregation averaging in its twenties across 40+ nationalities. He's also an author, speaker, and has been a longtime participant in the Global Leadership Summit at Willow Creek.

Key Topics

What holds church leaders back The most common internal limitation isn't skill or resources — it's the lack of felt permission. Pastors are often communal and loyal by nature, which also makes them dependent on someone saying "it's okay to go for it." The church culture tends to withhold permission rather than grant it. This is a big reason conferences are so magnetic — they're not primarily about information, they're about permission receiving. People go to be in a room where they feel free to dream, risk, and believe. Erwin said a large part of his life's work has been giving people permission: to dream big, to risk, to try low-percentage ideas, and to fail without that defining their worth.

Giving permission downward in the org chart Leaders often receive permission at a conference and then come back and tell their team what to do — which is not the same as giving permission. True permission-giving means creating space for people to grow, develop, dream, and execute in their own way. Key principle: hold tight to where you're going, hold loosely to how you get there. Someone can execute at a high level and still do it differently than you would — and that's okay.

"It's All About People" vs. "You Can't Take Everyone With You" (from Mind Shift)McManus intentionally places these as Chapter 1 and Chapter 3 as a juxtaposition. Most leaders lean hard toward one and neglect the other. His advice: read both, figure out which one resonates more, then go apply the other one. That tension is where relational elegance lives.

When people leave, they attack your character At Mosaic, after major style and culture shifts, the people who left rarely said "I don't like the music." They attacked Erwin's character because it made them the hero of their story. He found the exceptions refreshing — the people who were honest ("the church is too young," "too diverse," "too evangelistic") made it easy to respond. His approach: when you bring clarity as a leader, you're giving people the gift of choice. If they hate who you are now, they're going to really hate who you're becoming — so this is actually a good time to part ways. "If you're everything, you're nothing."

The white interior at Mosaic Hollywood During the 18-month pandemic shutdown, Aaron McManus pitched painting everything white — stage, speakers, walls. No precedent existed for it. The idea was: when people come back, we don't want them having a nostalgicexperience — we want them going forward. The white space became a blank canvas for projection and lighting in every direction. It's now been widely imitated. (They did the same thing at their current Pasadena theater space, which was the longtime home of the Rocky Horror Picture Show.)

The Seven Frequencies of Communication The seven frequencies are a framework for understanding how people communicate and how they're heard — not just outwardly but internally, since your inner voice shapes the health of your soul. The frequencies: Commander, Challenger, Healer, Motivator, Professor, Seer, Maven. This isn't a static identity — it's a dynamic range you can access. The goal is mastery over your frequencies, not just defaulting to your primary one.

• Every frequency also has a shadow — the dark version of the same trait. Commander → Dictator. Seer → Perfectionist. Challenger → Manipulator. Motivator → Performer. We tend to access our shadows with zero effort and have to work to access the authentic frequency. That's true of all positive human characteristics: courage, forgiveness, integrity all require work. Their negative counterparts (fear, bitterness, dishonesty) require nothing.
• Practical example: Erwin's wife Kim is a Commander. 42 years of "turn off the lights and lock the doors" instead of "I love you." He learned to translate that as I love you, keep me safe. His daughter Mariah is a Challenger — she's always trying to elevate him, but it reads as reprimand. Understanding the frequency means getting offended less.

Hire for character, not for frequency When Jake asked whether leaders need Commander or Challenger to run a department, Erwin's answer was simple: if the character is right, the frequency will work itself out. A high-Motivator leader who doesn't have Commander will still make people want to achieve for them — and the team will learn to push for clarity on execution. Environmental health matters more than frequency profile.

Commanders and competency Commanders have competency as a core value. If you move a Commander into a new role without giving them enough context, resources, and framing, they won't feel like they're being trusted — they'll feel like they're being set up to fail. The key: make sure they feel equipped, not just trusted. "He just wants to make sure he has enough swords."

Seers in leadership Many megachurch pastors are Commander-Seer combinations. The risk for Seers is confusing movement with momentum — pivoting sideways to get around an obstacle, while the team thinks the direction has changed entirely. The Seer knows they're still heading north; they forgot to communicate why they went east first. Solution from their team's side: instead of assuming the vision changed, ask "this feels like a direction change — is this a strategic move to get there faster? Help me communicate it well."

Churchfront "Captive Consultant" segment Erwin's advice for Churchfront: since they're committed to serving churches exclusively, look for where churches are growing fastest — new residential development, emerging demographics — and think about what a scalable package looks like for smaller churches. The message is too important not to be heard clearly, which makes sound and AV integration genuinely mission-critical work. He also noted that once a building is built, the acoustic future is largely set — making early architectural involvement from integrators essential.

Book/Resource mentioned: The Seven Frequencies of Communication — includes an assessment on their website. Also mentioned: Mind Shift by Erwin McManus.

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How to Disciple Your Team When You're Always On Stage - Part 2 Episode Description

In part two of this worship pastor conversation, Matt and Sean Bennett tackle the practical realities of leading volunteers, building sustainable systems, and avoiding burnout. They discuss how to disciple a team of 30 people when you can only really pour into 5 or 6, why production should enhance worship without becoming the focus, and why planning doesn't limit the Holy Spirit - it actually creates space for him to move.

Sean also shares why he has no desire to return to vocational ministry anytime soon, the "make it better" trap that burns out worship pastors, and the one simple rule that will save your sanity: Sundays are for service, not evaluation.

In This Episode

• Discipleship at scale - You can't disciple 30 people on your own, so here's how to train disciples to be disciplers and create a sustainable leadership structure
• How production supports worship - Why the pendulum is swinging away from production-heavy worship, and how to let production enhance rather than distract
• Planning and the Holy Spirit - Why "I just want to be led by the Spirit" is a cop-out, and how good planning actually creates space for spontaneity
• The biggest pitfall - Why not keeping the main thing the main thing is the fastest way to burn out your team and lose sight of why you're actually there
• Practical tips for sustainability - Why Sundays are for service not evaluation, how to build yearly rhythms that include rest, and when to do acoustic sets to reset expectations

Timestamps

00:00 - How to Disciple Your Team When You're Always On Stage 04:42 - How Production Supports Worship Without Becoming the Focus 09:53 - Systems and Planning: The Holy Spirit Shows Up on Monday Too 16:03 - The Biggest Pitfall: Not Keeping the Main Thing the Main Thing 19:10 - The "Make It Better" Trap and How to Avoid Burnout 23:23 - Practical Tips: Sundays Are for Service, Not Evaluation

Key Quotes

"You can't lead 30 people on your own. At some point you have to teach your leaders to be leaders and to lead other people."

"The Holy Spirit can show up on a Monday morning planning meeting just as much as he can show up on a Sunday during a service."

"Sundays are for service, not for evaluation. You can't change Sunday. The only thing you can do is look at it for next week."

"When we stand before God someday, he's not going to ask us how many perfect services we put on. He's going to ask us what our hearts were like."

Resources Mentioned

• Planning Center
• ProPresenter
• Tom Jackson Productions
• Carey Nieuwhof podcast episode (referenced)

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This is part 2 of 2. If you missed part 1, go back and watch that for insights on what to look for when taking a new worship pastor role and navigating the tension between excellence and authenticity.

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What I Wish I Knew Before Becoming a Worship Pastor - Part 1 Episode Description

Matt sits down with Sean Bennett, one of the newest members of the Churchfront team and a 16-year worship ministry veteran, to talk about what it's really like to lead worship and production teams. In part one of this two-part conversation, they discuss what to look for when stepping into a new worship pastor role, navigating the tension between excellence and authenticity, and how to lead a production team you can never actually be with.

Both Matt and Sean have led in large churches, small churches, and multi-site churches. They've both been the worship pastor who also had to somehow lead the tech team. This conversation pulls back the curtain on the real challenges worship pastors face and offers practical wisdom for anyone in church production or worship leadership.

In This Episode

• What to look for when interviewing for a worship pastor role - Why you need to see people at their worst before taking the job, and the red flags Sean wishes he'd paid more attention to
• Excellence vs. authenticity - How to define excellence in a way that doesn't lead to perfectionism, and why "doing the best you can with what you have" changes everything
• The worship/production leadership dilemma - Why churches should stop hiring one person to do both roles, and what to do if you're already in that position
• You're a pastor first - Why your primary objective is discipleship, not musicianship, and how that changes the way you lead your team

Timestamps

00:00 - Introduction: Meet Sean Bennett 03:27 - What I'd Do Differently Stepping Into a New Role 08:04 - The Tension Between Excellence and Authenticity 13:16 - Leading a Production Team You Can Never Be With 18:15 - You're a Pastor First, Leader Second

Key Quotes

"Excellence is doing the best you can with what you have. That starts with being honest about what you actually have."

"If you're leading people, you are a pastor. Your primary objective is discipleship - helping someone become more like Jesus."

"There are some churches that could not pay me enough to work for them. And knowing that ahead of time is a good thing."

Resources Mentioned

• Working Genius Assessment by Patrick Lencioni
• Churchfront free courses at churchfront.com

Connect With Us

Visit churchfront.com for free church production training and resources

This is part 1 of 2. Watch part 2 for more on discipling your team, building sustainable systems, and avoiding burnout.

Apply to Join Churchfront Premium

Apply to Join Churchfront Pro

Free Worship and Production Toolkit

Shop Our Online Courses

Join us at the Churchfront Conference

Follow Churchfront on Instagram or TikTok: @churchfront

Follow on Twitter: @realchurchfront

Gear we use to make videos at Churchfront

Musicbed SyncID: MB01VWQ69XRQNSN

Podcast Notes: Leadership & Scaling from Solo to 10+ Team Members with Jake Gosselin Overview

Matt interviews Jake Gosselin about growing Churchfront from a one-person YouTube channel into a 10+ person church AVL systems integration company. They talk through leadership growth, hiring, delegation, and how to maintain vision while scaling, with direct parallels to church leadership.

Key Topics & Timestamps Vision as the Foundation (00:00–05:32)

• Why clear vision needs to come before leadership development

• Churchfront's mission: "Equip church leaders in spaces with innovative solutions for thriving ministry."

• The importance of a mission statement, vision statement, and core values

• A two-day workshop at Ramsey to clarify and communicate vision

• Natural progression from YouTube creator to leading a 10-person team

Key Quote: "If there is no clear vision of where you're trying to bring that organization, then everything else that we're about to talk about with leadership development and scaling an organization is kind of irrelevant because nobody knows where you're going."

The Transition from Hands-On to Hands-Off (03:23–07:54)

• How Jake went from knowing everything to empowering team decision-making

• Building systems so problems get solved without senior leader involvement

• Decision-making frameworks around mission, vision, values, and finances

• When leaders should stay involved vs. when to delegate

• Team members now have authority and clarity to address issues independently

• High-risk or costly decisions still require senior leader involvement

Key Quote: "It's so cool that my brain, even though I can keep up with a lot of things, I can no longer keep up with all of the cool things that are happening in the business and probably some of the headaches."

Hiring A-Players (07:54–13:04)

Essential hiring criteria:

1. Mission alignment — genuinely excited about equipping church leaders

2. Self-leadership — evidence of personal discipline (health, appearance, habits)

3. Character references — take time to call references and vet thoroughly

4. Working Genius Assessment — using Patrick Lencioni's framework to build balanced teams

5. Team vetting — multiple team members interview candidates

Churchfront Focus: Churchfront only works with churches (not corporate AV, DJ setups, or other venues). Candidates need to genuinely care about the local church.

Working Genius Details:

• $25 assessment (WIDGET acronym)

• Identifies whether someone leans toward Wonder/Invention vs. Tenacity/Galvanizing traits

• Helps place people into roles that fit their strengths

• Recommended for church staff to understand their "genius zones"

Key Quote: "If you can't lead yourself, you can't lead others very well."

The Challenge of Letting Go (13:37–16:56)

• Why control is tempting but unsustainable for growth

• Long-term vision motivates delegation

• Media/marketing was Jake's original specialty and the hardest area for him to delegate to Matt

• Over time, Matt learned Jake's standards and expectations

• Hiring people who are better than you in specific areas

Real Examples:

• Chris installs, rigs, mounts, and runs cable better than Jake

• Spencer models and drafts 3D spaces faster in Vectorworks

• James creates better schematics

Senior Leader Principle: Leaders should understand all departments without controlling them. Spend a few hours learning the basics so you can make informed decisions about major investments.

Church Application: Senior pastors should take Churchfront courses (a couple half-days) to be more informed than most lead pastors when making major AV decisions.

Key Quote: "I'm motivated by the long-term vision of where this is going and how big the organization has to go that I'm just like, 'Yeah, I don't need to control everything. I don't want that life where I feel like I have to because I'm just going to be miserable about that.'"

Present Leadership Without Micromanaging (17:46–19:40)

• Weekly team meetings where everyone shares what they're working on

• Asking: "What did you do last week?" and "What are you working on this week?" (3–10 minutes)

• Five minutes with each team member can make a huge impact

• Being present builds trust across the org chart

• Service businesses succeed based on team health and performance

• Jake shifted from solo productivity to supporting team members

Key Quote: "That five minutes of interaction with one of your team members a week, no matter where they're at in the org chart, goes a long way because they're like, 'Oh wow, our senior leader knows me. I can trust him.'"

High-Leverage Activities (19:50–23:16)

Definition of leverage: low input, high output—like a tool that multiplies your strength.

What Jake focuses on now:

1. Pre-design client conversations — 2–3 hours per project that sets the trajectory for large-budget projects (using Wonder/Invention/Visionary strengths)

2. Media creation — 30 minutes to a few hours can reach thousands (what built Churchfront over 8–10 years)

3. Leader development — multiplication only happens as the team grows from 10+ toward 20–30

For church leaders:

• Sunday preaching — communication at scale (in-person and online)

• Developing other leaders — especially in areas where you're less gifted

Key Quote: "What can I put lower input into and gives me high output? That's what a lever or a tool is."

Leadership Evolution (23:23–25:23)

John Maxwell's Five Levels of Leadership (applied):

1. Position — title alone (doesn't get you much)

2. Permission — relationships; people give you permission to lead

3. Productivity — "Follow me because I produce results" (how Churchfront started)

4. Leader development — "Follow me because I'll equip you to lead others" (current focus)

5. Multiplication — creating leaders who create leaders

Jake's journey:

• 2016: solo entrepreneur and highly productive individual

• Read leadership books and understood the growth track

• Started with productivity to get things off the ground

• With 10 people (and aiming for 20–30), he must focus on leader development to reach multiplication

Key Insight: Leadership maturity means realizing it's more people-focused than anything else.

Advice to 2016 Jake (25:44–28:06)

What Jake would tell his younger self:

• "Buy more Bitcoin" (half-joking)

• With what he knows now, he could do in 2–3 years what took 10

• But he wouldn't rush it—focus on the journey

• Be a man of good character

• Follow God

• Keep sustainable work-life balance

• Care for spouse and kids

• Don't rush—God multiplies right inputs into massive outputs

• Seek wise counsel on business strategy and online marketing

• Show up and do the work every day

For young 20-somethings Jake mentors:

• Focus on self-leadership and the basics

• Better strategies exist—learn from wise voices

• Put in consistent daily work

• People don't see the late-night edits and behind-the-scenes grind

Key Quote: "A lot of people see Churchfront and they're like, 'Wow, it's like 300,000 subscribers. It's a decent sized little business growing a lot.' It's like, yeah, that's after eight to 10 years of just showing up and doing it every single day."

Main Themes Don't Throw the Baby Out with the Bathwater

As church culture shifts away from overly corporate/produced approaches back toward authenticity, it's still worth keeping the leadership lessons that help organizations run well—especially because leadership often isn't taught deeply in Bible school contexts.

Parallels Between Business and Church Leadership

Churchfront is a Christian business that prays before meetings and focuses on serving the local church. The leadership principles Jake uses translate directly to church staff leadership, especially for teams of 5–15.

The Secret Sauce

In service businesses (and churches), the team and people are the product. That's why leader development and team health matter so much.

Natural Progression

Growth happens in stages. Jake went from being intimidated by the idea of 10 staff members to progressing through each hire and stage—each step building confidence for the next.

Practical Takeaways for Church Leaders

1. Clarify your vision first—mission, vision, and core values you return to weekly

2. Hire A-players only—take time, use assessments, and get team input

3. Build decision-making systems so your team can solve problems without you

4. Stay present without micromanaging—even five minutes per person per week helps

5. Focus on high-leverage activities—preaching, leader development, strategic decisions

6. Understand all departments without needing to control them

7. Invest in education—leaders should understand the basics of major spending areas

8. Progress through leadership levels—from productivity to multiplication

9. Prioritize character and self-leadership—in yourself and the people you hire

10. Think long-term—consistent daily effort over 8–10 years creates remarkable results