How do you make decisions for the next hundred years based on evidence you only know today? That’s the question Gary Yohe has spent more than four decades wrestling with. One of the first five economists in the world working on climate change back in the early 1980s, Gary served as the Coordinating Lead Author for multiple IPCC report chapters, including the Fourth Assessment that shared the 2007 Nobel Peace Prize. His research has shaped how the world understands climate risk, bridging economics, science, and policy. Instead of chasing a perfect century-long plan, he argues we should treat climate as a risk management problem—act, learn, adjust. It’s an idea that changed the field: policy as an iterative process rather than a single bet on the future.

We talk about how this shift happened and what it means today, from San Francisco’s sea-level strategy—where most of the city plans for a two-foot rise, but why the Embarcadero prepares for six—to the limits of insurance as climate risk becomes unpriceable. Gary channels John Holdren’s line that “we can abate, we can adapt, or we can suffer,” and explains why the catastrophic tail risks will never be fully insurable. He shares lessons from decades of human behavior research: how Florida’s hurricane-proof houses paradoxically increased deaths as people stopped evacuating, and how Outer Banks homeowners started building intentionally ‘disposable’ beach houses when insurance vanished. Along the way, he reflects on the communication gap that dogs climate science—how misinformation can be careless, but accuracy must be flawless—and the discipline it takes to keep public trust.

Now in his seventies, Gary calls himself “a foot soldier in the climate wars.” What keeps him going isn’t blind optimism but something sturdier. Quoting Václav Havel, he distinguishes hope from optimism: optimism expects things will work out; hope believes your actions might make a difference. That’s what motivates him when he imagines his nine-year-old twin granddaughters asking, “Papa, what did you do when all this was happening?” His answer: “I was doing everything I could. And I really thought I might make a difference. And that gave me enough hope to think it was worth the time to do it.”

Referenced:

• IPCC 4th Assessment
• Climate Cafe

Get connected:

• Gary - Wesleyan | Climate Cafe
• Ben - LinkedIn | Climate Papa

Feedback? Guest ideas? Get in touch by emailing [email protected]

Music: Slynk & Lazy Syrup Orchestra - Mellow Kinda Hype (Balkan Bump Remix)

Agriculture, forestry, and land use together account for nearly 24 % of global greenhouse gas emissions. Yet somehow land sits in a weird blind spot: ignored by climate conversations focused on energy and transport, underanalyzed by markets, and mispriced by farmers and timber investors alike. That’s the problem, and opportunity, we’re going to discuss today.

I sit down with Danan Margason, founder and CEO of Aarden, to explore how AI can help land owners understand their options. Aarden sits at the center of a messy, trillion-dollar decision problem—enabling landowners and capital allocators to evaluate a single parcel across radically different paths: timber harvests vs. solar fields, carbon projects vs. housing, restoration now vs. monetizing later.

We dive into the systems thinking behind land use and why this is such a massive market that’s been underserved by technology.

Along the way, Danan shares his journey from crew boats in Seattle to Booking.com, through Carbon Direct’s push for high-quality removals, and into company-building back with his original crew buddy.

Referenced:

• Aarden.ai

• Jobs

• Land use

• Stepchange Show

Get connected:

• Danan - LinkedIn | [email protected]

• Ben - LinkedIn | Climate Papa

  
  

Feedback? Guest ideas? Get in touch by emailing [email protected]

Music: Slynk & Lazy Syrup Orchestra - Mellow Kinda Hype (Balkan Bump Remix)

✨ Special teaser from the Stepchange Show. Details here. ✨

🎧 Listen to the full episode:

• Apple Podcasts

• Spotify

• YouTube

• Substack

• Any other podcast player search: ‘Stepchange’

  
  

Today’s Climate Papa episode is a quick teaser from my other project, The Stepchange Show.

Anay and I spent months digging into the hidden backbone of our modern world: data centers. These warehouses of machines quietly power everything from your email to AI — and now use more electricity than some countries.

This short preview pulls back the curtain. If it sparks your curiosity, head to the full episode on the Stepchange Show through the links above.

What happens when you take the two biggest sources of emissions in the US—transportation and electricity—and smash them together at breakneck speed?

In this episode of Climate Papa, I sit down with Apoorv Bhargava, the co-founder and CEO of WeaveGrid. We explore the massive, unfolding challenge and opportunity of integrating millions of electric vehicles onto a grid that wasn't built for them. WeaveGrid sits at the very center—building the critical software layer to orchestrate this transition, turning EVs from a potential liability into a powerful asset for a cleaner, more resilient energy system.

We dive deep into the systems thinking required to solve climate change, busting common memes around EV charging, and discussing why the real bottleneck isn't just charging stations, but the grid itself. Apoorv shares why he’s wary of buzzwords like "Virtual Power Plants" (VPPs) and makes the case for building trust and genuine partnership with the massive incumbent industries—like utilities and automakers—that are central to the energy transition.

Along the way, Apoorv opens up about his personal journey: from a childhood seeing the impacts of energy and water scarcity firsthand to the all-consuming life of a founder, and why focusing on the human side of the work is essential for the long haul.

Referenced:

• WeaveGrid

• Volts podcast by David Roberts on “enshitification”

Get connected:

• Apoorv - LinkedIn | [email protected]

• Ben - LinkedIn | Climate Papa

Feedback? Guest ideas? Get in touch by emailing [email protected]

Music: Slynk & Lazy Syrup Orchestra - Mellow Kinda Hype (Balkan Bump Remix)

Ben sits down with Michael Leggett—former Google and Facebook design leader turned climate entrepreneur—to explore the invisible but essential machinery behind the clean energy economy. Michael is the co-founder and Head of Product at Ever.green, a startup working to democratize access to high-impact renewable energy deals.

Ben and Michael go deep into the world of renewable energy credits (RECs), power purchase agreements (PPAs), and the shifting landscape of carbon accounting. Why is it that only ~1,000 companies today participate in the kind of long-term clean energy contracts that actually help bring new solar and wind projects online? What happens when companies buy cheap, after-the-fact RECs and claim 100% clean energy? And how might emerging standards like 24/7 carbon-free energy reshape what counts as climate impact—for better or worse?

Along the way, Michael shares his own journey from Big Tech to climate, how becoming a parent shaped his urgency, and why he remains (cautiously) optimistic that Team Earth can get it right—if we keep the focus on real-world outcomes and the systems and incentives that guide those outcomes.

Referenced:

• Ever.green

• Rethinking Scope 2 Accounting by Ever.green

• Stepchange Show: Coal Part II

Get connected:

• Michael - LinkedIn

• Ben - LinkedIn | ⁠Climate Papa⁠

Feedback? Guest ideas? Get in touch, by emailing ⁠[email protected]⁠

Music: Slynk & Lazy Syrup Orchestra - Mellow Kinda Hype (Balkan Bump Remix)

In this live crossover episode of Climate Papa and Volts, I sit down with renowned climate journalist David Roberts for a conversation bridging the personal and the planetary. David traces his unlikely path from doctoral philosophy drop out into journalism—and how his early love of systems thinking shapes his work today.

We dive into the puzzle that is the energy transition. With clean energy solutions now tangible and increasingly affordable, David sees his role not just as a reporter, but as a guide through the nested challenges of decarbonization—from grid reform to housing to the politics of permitting.

We dive into David’s approach to writing (“talk like you’re at a bar with a smart friend”), his current obsessions (electricity and land use), and why abundance, not austerity, should define the climate movement. Along the way we try to answer if humans might be smart enough, as a species, to outrun the fate of the protozoa.

David was thoughtful, funny, and full of hope—with very little room for BS.

Referenced:

• Stepchange Show: Coal I

• 9Zero Seattle

• In defense of Ethical Naturalism

• Is humanity smarter than a protozoan?

• What's up with electric aviation?

Connect:

• David - Volts

• Ben - LinkedIn | ⁠Climate Papa⁠

Feedback? Guest ideas? Get in touch, by emailing ⁠[email protected]⁠

Music: Slynk & Lazy Syrup Orchestra - Mellow Kinda Hype (Balkan Bump Remix)

What if the biggest climate impact from companies like Google wasn’t in their operations, but in how they shape the decisions of billions of people?

In this episode of Climate Papa, I sit down with Travis McCoy, Director of Product for Sustainability at Google. We talk about his journey into climate, the pivotal moment that pushed him to make the leap, and how Google is leveraging its massive distribution to help individuals, businesses, and governments make lower-carbon choices.

Travis shares why he believes climate action isn’t just about reducing emissions—it’s about changing systems at scale. And we have a mini product-jam on what it could mean for tech leaders and product builders to build climate native products.

Referenced:

• Electrify by Saul Griffith

• Google’s sustainability work: Google Sustainability

• Project Sunroof by Google: Project Sunroof

• The Stepchange Show

Get connected:

• Travis - LinkedIn

• Ben - LinkedIn | ⁠Climate Papa⁠

Feedback? Guest ideas? Get in touch, by emailing ⁠[email protected]⁠

Music: Slynk & Lazy Syrup Orchestra - Mellow Kinda Hype (Balkan Bump Remix)

Today I'm excited to introduce a new project, the Stepchange podcast, where we share the stories of human progress. Like Climate Papa, it's driven by a curiosity about the systems that shape our world, but focuses on the historical innovations and moments that got us here and the transformations happening now.

The show is a long-form conversation hosted by me and Anay where we unpack the technologies, systems, and infrastructure that underpin modern life. Our first episode explores coal's role in the Industrial Revolution - a story that echoes through to the many fuel debated today. You can listen by searching for "Stepchange" on your preferred podcast platform (here on Spotify and Apple Podcasts).

Climate Papa email subscribers will be added to the Stepchange email list so that you don’t miss future episodes. If the show is not for you, you can always unsubscribe and your Climate Papa updates will not be impacted.

Subscribe: stepchange.show

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Coal is the story of a step change—a transformation so profound that it reshaped the course of human history. The rise of coal reshaped economies, societies, and the very way we live. It became the foundation of the Industrial Revolution and powered a new era of progress, but this leap forward came at a tremendous cost.

Coal’s story begins with ancient plants that captured sunlight and locked away carbon over millennia. These deposits, buried deep in the Earth, would one day drive empires and fuel industries that transformed the world. Yet, behind this transformation lies a complex and often difficult legacy.

Even as coal has faded from the forefront of our energy landscape, its fingerprints remain everywhere. The technologies it spawned, from steam engines and the rail to industrial manufacturing, continue to underpin our modern world. At the same time, coal’s legacy is inseparable from many of the challenges we face today, from labor abuse and environmental degradation to global climate change.

In this debut episode, we explore the first chapter of coal's story, from its early discovery and use through the dawn of the 20th century.

Thank you for joining us for the first episode of Stepchange. Don’t forget to subscribe and share your thoughts by emailing us at [email protected].

Hosts: Ben Shwab Eidelson and Anay Shah

Timestamps

00:00 - Welcome to Stepchange
03:37 - The Birth of Coal
09:39 - Coal's Early History
17:01 - Britain's Coal Transformation
25:49 - Reshaping Home & Hearth
34:49 - The Iron & Coke Revolution
44:28 - The Steam Engine Breakthrough
1:03:37 - The Railway Revolution
1:19:50 - The Rise of Industrial Cities
1:38:57 - Life in the Mines
1:54:37 - Coal Comes to America
2:24:11 - Themes & Reflections

Barbara Freese, 12/12/24

Johnston Suter, 1/6/24

Geological History

Industrial Development

Social Impact and Labor History

Modern Context

There was a fire that burned for 29 hours. It destroyed over 17,000 buildings, killed over 300 people, and left more than 100,000 homeless. This was the Great Chicago Fire of 1871. Out of the ashes, Chicago rebuilt itself into a global model of resilience. The disaster spurred major changes, including the use of fire-resistant building materials, stricter safety codes, the expansion of the fire department, and the modernization of water and sewer systems. It ultimately set the conditions for Chicago to become the birthplace of the skyscraper and a leader in architecture and urban planning.

The fires in Los Angeles are still burning. The devastation is immense and heartbreaking. To grasp for some meaning, I’ve been reflecting on the history of Chicago—not as a direct analogy but as a beacon of hope. Hope that something long-lasting and transformative can come from this disaster. That we can be collectively catalyzed not just to rebuild, but to rebuild smarter—with better tools, better systems, and to rebuild resiliently. That is my hope for Los Angeles and its amazing people.

To help process and understand the fires—how we got here and where we might go next—I reached out to our friends at Convective Capital. Jay Ribakove is a Principal at Convective Capital—a venture firm investing in solutions to combat and adapt to the growing threat of wildfires.

We unpack how wildfires have changed over time—from the low-intensity fires of the past to today’s massive, catastrophic events. Jay explains the critical factors at play in the Los Angeles fires and the tools we have to increase our defenses.

Referenced:

Get connected:

Feedback? Guest ideas? Get in touch, by emailing ⁠[email protected]⁠

Music: Slynk & Lazy Syrup Orchestra - Mellow Kinda Hype (Balkan Bump Remix)

On this show, we’ve explored how people can make infrastructure changes in their lives that have long-term positive climate impacts—whether it’s upgrading your furnace to a heat pump or switching from a gas car to an EV. Food is on the other end of the spectrum. It’s the ultimate behavioral challenge: the average person has three meals a day, 21 meals a week. That's over 1,000 meals a year or 5,000 decisions over five years. Compare that to the one-time choice of a car you may drive for five years. Each of these meals—and how we prepare them—has a major impact, both on our personal health and on the health of the planet.

In this episode, I sit down with my friend Joel Gamoran—a fellow Seattle papa, chef, culinary teacher, and founder of Homemade Cooking. Joel’s journey has taken him from teaching as the head chef at Sur La Table to hosting the cooking show Scraps, where he turned food waste into culinary masterpieces (and published a cookbook as well).

We discuss staggering truths about the waste in our food system—and how culinary medicine is a key unlock for our health, our communities, and the planet. Joel generously opens up about his own health journey and how that connects to his life’s work.

If after this conversation you want more of Joel’s amazing energy, you can cook with him via his site Homemade Cooking, watch his PBS show Homemade Live, and follow along via his Instagram.

Referenced:

Get connected:

To get in touch, email ⁠[email protected]⁠

Music: Slynk & Lazy Syrup Orchestra - Mellow Kinda Hype (Balkan Bump Remix)