Some scammers love the challenge of deceiving those they target while others are forced to scam. Those that thrive off of destroying others try to heighten your emotions very quickly. Both excited and angry responses can get you into making irrational decisions.

Today's guest is Doug Shadel. Doug is a former fraud investigator and special assistant to the Attorney General at the Washington State Attorney General's office. He served as state director for AARP Washington and Strategy Director for AARP's national anti-fraud efforts. Doug has collaborated on numerous educational videos and academic studies and co-authored five books about fraud. He also co-authored the AARP Fraud Frontier 2021 Report. He is currently Managing Director of Fraud Prevention Strategies LLC, a Seattle-based consulting firm.

Show Notes:

• [1:08] - Doug shares his background and career in fighting fraud.
• [2:43] - Robo-calls have been a long lasting problem that Doug has been working on with AARP and Nomorobo.
• [7:11] - Over the years, Doug has interviewed numerous scammers. They all say their primary goal is to get a victim in a heightened emotional state.
• [9:07] - Doug describes the research that shows when people are in a heightened emotional state, they are more likely to fall victim to a scam.
• [10:57] - Block the incoming robocalls to begin with to help avoid a scammer manipulating you into a heightened emotional state.
• [13:17] - It still is very dangerous to answer these phone calls because a lot of them are really persuasive and really good at what they do.
• [14:34] - There isn't a specific demographic profile. Doug explains what people who fall victim to a scam have in common.
• [16:49] - The FCC has come down hard on robocallers, but this has just caused scammers to be more careful and even more skilled.
• [18:09] - Have you recently received calls asking for a donation? Doug describes how these work.
• [21:12] - The number one red flag of a robocall is the threat of loss.
• [25:22] - Caller ID is not reliable. It is very common and easy for scammers to spoof a call.
• [27:48] - There are some legitimate needs for people to be able to spoof a call.
• [29:42] - Assume it is a scam if you did not initiate the contact.
• [33:08] - By and large, scammers will not cause violence on a victim, even if they threaten them. They follow the path of least resistance.
• [36:02] - Doug describes some software he uses to edit videos that incorporates AI. These tools are great, but are also used by scammers.
• [39:26] - Grandparent scams are really common. Doug describes what people have said after falling victim.
• [40:40] - There is an illusion of invulnerability. If you are convinced that you are not vulnerable to something, you won't do anything to prevent it.
• [43:04] - There's a lot more money for scammers to make in scamming an employee of a large company than individuals.
• [46:10] - The pandemic also had a big impact on the scamming industry.
• [50:50] - The AARP Fraud Watch Network Helpline is 1-877-908-3360.
• [53:00] - Always report a scam when you know of one. It helps more than you know.

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