On this week’s episode of Chatter, David Priess speaks with political scientist and author Brian Klaas about why certain people seek power, what holding power does to them, and how to get better leaders. They discuss the nature of political research, what kind of people become rulers, corruption and system effects, and ways to keep the most corrupt people out of power--as well as meerkat signaling, a cannibalistic dictator, and Brian's new book, Corruptible: Who Gets Power and How It Changes Us.

Chatter is a production of Lawfare and Goat Rodeo. This episode was edited by Cara Shillenn of Goat Rodeo. Producing and audio engineering by Hamza Shittu of Goat Rodeo. Podcast theme by David Priess, featuring music created using Groovepad.

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